Wannabehippie Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 He probably means the shoreline. I guarantee you there's no ice on the river bed - ice floats - in fact, if not for the fact that solid water is less dense than liquid water - unlike almost every other molecule on the planet - advanced life on this planet might never have evolved... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsutherland1 Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 The Hudson River at the Fort Washington Link (just south of the George Washington Bridge) in January 2004. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainshadow Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 The Hudson River at the Fort Washington Link (just south of the George Washington Bridge) in January 2004. Don, I remember my high school friend and I used to go down to the Hudson in Yonkers in the late 70s during a couple of warmer days in Feb and watch the ice float by like this pic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainshadow Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Winter 1976-77 was a weak El Niño during the transition to a +PDO phase. December and January had an extreme -NAO/-AO block with impressive ridging over Western Canada into Alaska. This caused strong northerly flow into Canada on the front side of that high pressure, allowing extremely cold airmasses from the arctic to penetrate the CONUS. In essence, the strong -AO block sent the arctic air southward, and much of it was channeled into Canada due to the ridge over AK/BC. Looking at the 500mb map, you can also see that heights were around average in central Canada, meaning there was a good pipeline for the cold. Last winter had an extreme blocking pattern, but the above average heights over all of Canada meant that cold air could never reach the United States. Here is the 500mb map for December and January of the 76-77 winter: Both October and November were also unseasonably cold, that was quite a run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drz1111 Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I used to commute along the Palisades Pkwy, and I can confirm that the Hudson was mostly frozen over north of the GWB (though nothing I'd chance to walk on) and there were some crazy pressure ridge-type formations all over the river. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowshack Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 It definitely has. These clippings are from 1977: 24" thickness on LI Sound sounds very impressive to me. I've snowmobiled across lakes i nthe adirondacks with ice 1/4 as thick...and I think the ice roads featured on Ice Road Truckers only require about 15" of ice to support those trucks. Of course with the current and tides i would imagine it was an inconsistent thickness... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle W Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 from August 31th 1976 when NYC tied its lowest August temperature on record to early February NYC was at least 10 degrees below normal more than 1/3 of the time...Water mains froze late December in Wild Acres Pa and did not thaw out until late February...They had to re do the water mains a few feet lower after that year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsutherland1 Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Some photos of the Hudson River taken today at Kingsland Point Park (Sleepy Hollow, New York): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha5 Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 Great pictures Don! How extensive was the ice coverage there, looks like it extends pretty far out into the river Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthShoreWx Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 24" thickness on LI Sound sounds very impressive to me. I've snowmobiled across lakes i nthe adirondacks with ice 1/4 as thick...and I think the ice roads featured on Ice Road Truckers only require about 15" of ice to support those trucks. Of course with the current and tides i would imagine it was an inconsistent thickness... I have a feeling they were talking about some of the bays and harbors for that thickness. 24 inch thick pack ice would be something in the middle of the sound. The other clipping mentions 90% of the sound covered with "ice floes" 6" thick. It was probably not solid clear across, but it would be quite a sight to look across to CT and see nothing but ice in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsutherland1 Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Great pictures Don! How extensive was the ice coverage there, looks like it extends pretty far out into the river Probably around 60% near the Park. Once one gets south of the Tappan Zee Bridge (top photo), there's much less ice coverage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsutherland1 Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Don, I remember my high school friend and I used to go down to the Hudson in Yonkers in the late 70s during a couple of warmer days in Feb and watch the ice float by like this pic. Thank you for sharing your memories, Tony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I have a feeling they were talking about some of the bays and harbors for that thickness. 24 inch thick pack ice would be something in the middle of the sound. The other clipping mentions 90% of the sound covered with "ice floes" 6" thick. It was probably not solid clear across, but it would be quite a sight to look across to CT and see nothing but ice in between. Those are some great old news clippings that you found. Yeah,it looks like they kept the shipping lanes open from this Coast Guard document on page 45. http://www.uscg.mil/...ter%20Final.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitchel Volk Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I went to the DIA art center in Beacon and the Hudson was mainly frozen with lots of chunk ice. BTW the DIA art center is worth visiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthShoreWx Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Those are some great old news clippings that you found. Yeah,it looks like they kept the shipping lanes open from this Coast Guard document on page 45. http://www.uscg.mil/...ter%20Final.pdf Good find! From p45: 2.4.1.1 Freezing of Long Island Sound There is evidence that substantial portions of Long Island Sound have frozen, significantly impacting vessel transits. Although unable to locate historical records confirming ice formation across the Sound, as part of this Report, COTP Long Island Sound surveyed commercial operators with extensive histories of operation on the Sound, to determine the extent of ice formation. From the mariner information, it is apparent that large portions of Long Island Sound have indeed frozen over sufficiently to impede vessel traffic. In 1977, from the first week in January through the second week of February, most of Long Island Sound was frozen over. The waters at Execution Rock on the western end of the Sound were solid ice. Commercial deep draft vessel traffic was not impeded in the Sound as the shipping lanes remained open, but operation in the harbors was limited strictly to daylight. Riverhead Platform was inaccessible by tankers or barges due to the pressure created by ice pushing on vessels, making mooring exceptionally difficult and causing mooring lines to break once vessels were moored up. Lighted aids to navigation in the sound were off station or missing, and were extinguished; ice buoys replaced buoys for navigation. Ice was 2-3 feet thick in certain portions of the Sound. During the winter of 1967-68, the Port Jefferson to Bridgeport ferry was unable to transit out of Port Jefferson Harbor due to ice that extended out past the entrance to the harbor to a thickness where a crew was able to conduct welding operations on one of the Port Jefferson ferries from the ice. Also that year, there was heavy pack ice between the Connecticut River and the Thames River, causing difficulty of passage for commercial vessels. That same winter, Gardiners Bay, Long Island, froze completely across.83 During the winter of 1917 to 1918, cars were apparently driven across the Sound in the vicinity of Port Jefferson, NY.84 Historic data also indicates that, during the winter of 1779-1780, "Long Island Sound was almost completely clogged with ice, and people were able to cross from Long Island to the vicinity of Stamford" Connecticut for several days, and that people were able to cross other areas of the western Sound, including from Connecticut to Lloyd’s Neck, Long Island.85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha5 Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Good find! From p45: 2.4.1.1 Freezing of Long Island Sound There is evidence that substantial portions of Long Island Sound have frozen, significantly impacting vessel transits. Although unable to locate historical records confirming ice formation across the Sound, as part of this Report, COTP Long Island Sound surveyed commercial operators with extensive histories of operation on the Sound, to determine the extent of ice formation. From the mariner information, it is apparent that large portions of Long Island Sound have indeed frozen over sufficiently to impede vessel traffic. In 1977, from the first week in January through the second week of February, most of Long Island Sound was frozen over. The waters at Execution Rock on the western end of the Sound were solid ice. Commercial deep draft vessel traffic was not impeded in the Sound as the shipping lanes remained open, but operation in the harbors was limited strictly to daylight. Riverhead Platform was inaccessible by tankers or barges due to the pressure created by ice pushing on vessels, making mooring exceptionally difficult and causing mooring lines to break once vessels were moored up. Lighted aids to navigation in the sound were off station or missing, and were extinguished; ice buoys replaced buoys for navigation. Ice was 2-3 feet thick in certain portions of the Sound. During the winter of 1967-68, the Port Jefferson to Bridgeport ferry was unable to transit out of Port Jefferson Harbor due to ice that extended out past the entrance to the harbor to a thickness where a crew was able to conduct welding operations on one of the Port Jefferson ferries from the ice. Also that year, there was heavy pack ice between the Connecticut River and the Thames River, causing difficulty of passage for commercial vessels. That same winter, Gardiners Bay, Long Island, froze completely across.83 During the winter of 1917 to 1918, cars were apparently driven across the Sound in the vicinity of Port Jefferson, NY.84 Historic data also indicates that, during the winter of 1779-1780, "Long Island Sound was almost completely clogged with ice, and people were able to cross from Long Island to the vicinity of Stamford" Connecticut for several days, and that people were able to cross other areas of the western Sound, including from Connecticut to Lloyd’s Neck, Long Island.85 Wow! Thanks for posting that, really impressive to think that people could have walked across the sound at one point. It seems to happen very rarely though, but I guess it is possible, something I did not know before Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsutherland1 Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 FYI, the Hudson River is almost entirely frozen in the vicinity of the Bear Mountain Bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikolai Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Driving down from Greenwood Lake last night, it was neat seeing where the river was frozen. The tappan zee on N was 90% frozen, around the GW ice was spotty (maybe 50%? It was dark obviously...) and down by the Upper West the river looked almost entirely ice-free. I'd bet that given forecasted temps the next two weeks, we see a freeze all the way down past Midtown Manhattan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle W Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 seeing ice in the Hudson river as far south as Manhattan is not unusual...I remember seeing ice in the terrible winter of 1972-73 in February...I rode the Staten island ferry to work during the winters of 2002-03 and 2003-04...Both years saw ice flows near the shores of Staten island and lower Manhattan...Not enough to stop the ferry...I remember 1970-71 having a lot of ice in the waters around Brooklyn...Gravesend Bay was frozen in January 1970 and 1971...January 1977 probably had the most ice in the waters around NYC...Recently I read an article in the Staten Island Advance (News Paper) about the big freeze in 1934...People were walking across the Arthur Kill between Staten Island and New Jersey... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gravitylover Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I remember many times in the late 70's seeing ice boats passing the Amtrak train I was riding on. Does anybody still play with these on the river? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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