ono Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Ok ok- maybe beating a dead horse with this one. So Mt Baker set the record in ~1999 with 1140" in a calendar year. This is pretty common knowledge. Still, I find it hard to believe that somewhere in southeast Alaska and, the mountains there don't get considerably more snow than baker on any given year, and likely have surpassed the current record several times in a some locations. There's just a lack of a snotel, or some form of weather-reporting in these remote regions. It's been said the Juneau Ice Field gets over 1000"/year in some places. not sure how accurate that number is, but it could be possible given size and ample regional precip. Northwest of there, Mt Fairweather. probably receives more precip than Baker (maybe considerably more), much higher latitude/elevation/relief = much colder year-round temps- which would obviously mean more frozen precip/snow. My money would go on Fairweather- it is situated 20km from the pacific graveyard, and has crazy orographic potential. probably the best-situated mountain in the world to produce copious snowfall. patagonia ice field is another possibility with purported annual precip rates of 170-240".some spotty hearsay reports of 1300-1600" of annual snowfall occur in that region. again, all hearsay. Don't know much about that area. Areas of SE Alaska can produce similar annual precip numbers and both are heavily glaciated and mountainous... any thoughts? anyone? bueller? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k*** Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Ok ok- maybe beating a dead horse with this one. So Mt Baker set the record in ~1999 with 1140" in a calendar year. This is pretty common knowledge. Still, I find it hard to believe that somewhere in southeast Alaska, the mountains there get more snow than Baker on any given year. There's just a lack of a snotel, or some form of weather-reporting. It's been said the Juneau Ice Field gets over 1000"/year in some places. not sure how accurate that number is, but it could be possible given size and ample regional precip. Northwest of there, Mt Fairweather. probably receives more precip than Baker, much higher latitude/elevation/relief = much colder year-round temps- which would obviously mean more frozen precip/snow. My money would go on Fairweather- it is situated 20km from the pacific graveyard, and has crazy orographic potential. probably the best-situated mountain in the world to produce copious snowfall. going out on a limb here- Fairweather could have broken baker's 1140" record a few times since it was set a decade ago. pure conjecture on my part. anyone? bueller? I think somewhere in Japan wins the title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebreaker5221 Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Mt. Fairweather is probably a good bet. I also think that parts of the southern Himalayas, near the collision of monsoonal moisture from the south and cold continental air from the north, probably pick up some pretty impressive snowfall totals. Even in the (extremely sparse) observing network available in the region, it is usually only precipitation that is reported... not snowfall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loafnut Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 I think somewhere in Japan wins the title. My money would be on somewhere in southeast alaska. I think Japan is just too dry. It has to be somewhere that gets firehosed all the time and remains mostly snow. When I was in iceland a guide told me that the high elevations of Hvannadalshnúkur average just under 200 inches of liquid precip per year and there are only 4 days per year when the summit is above freezing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k*** Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 My money would be on somewhere in southeast alaska. I think Japan is just too dry. It has to be somewhere that gets firehosed all the time and remains mostly snow. When I was in iceland a guide told me that the high elevations of Hvannadalshnúkur average just under 200 inches of liquid precip per year and there are only 4 days per year when the summit is above freezing. Somewhere in Alaska may well beat out the snowiest areas of Japan, but I wouldn't undersell the Island. There is a firehose effect off of the Sea of Japan and some areas at times can report 25 meter snowpacks. But like someone else said, the place that gets the most snow probably doesn't have observations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamarack Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Paradise, on Rainier, held the record at 1,119" in 71-72 before Mt.Baker topped it. The elevation at Paradise is 1,300' higher than at Baker, but it's also nearly 9,000' below the summit (Baker summit is about 3,600' lower than Rainier summit.) I'd guess that someplace on Rainier's west slope at about 10-12,000' gets 2-3 times the +/- 700" average at Paradise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmlwx Posted November 19, 2010 Share Posted November 19, 2010 Somewhere in Alaska may well beat out the snowiest areas of Japan, but I wouldn't undersell the Island. There is a firehose effect off of the Sea of Japan and some areas at times can report 25 meter snowpacks. But like someone else said, the place that gets the most snow probably doesn't have observations. Jesus. Those pics are really something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voyager Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 So what is the snowiest metropolitan area on earth? Also, wondering about the snowiest metro area in the lower 48. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNYLakeEffect Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 So what is the snowiest metropolitan area on earth? Also, wondering about the snowiest metro area in the lower 48. 1st Question: Probably Sapporo, Japan...about 248"/yr in a city of nearly 2 million. http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.data.jma.go.jp%2Fobd%2Fstats%2Fetrn%2Fview%2Fnml_sfc_ym.php%3Fprec_no%3D14%26prec_ch%3D%2590%25CE%258E%25EB%258Ex%2592%25A1%26block_no%3D47412%26block_ch%3D%258ED%2596y%26year%3D%26month%3D%26day%3D%26elm%3Dnormal%26view%3D&act=url http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sapporo#Climate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocoAko Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 Paradise, on Rainier, held the record at 1,119" in 71-72 before Mt.Baker topped it. The elevation at Paradise is 1,300' higher than at Baker, but it's also nearly 9,000' below the summit (Baker summit is about 3,600' lower than Rainier summit.) I'd guess that someplace on Rainier's west slope at about 10-12,000' gets 2-3 times the +/- 700" average at Paradise. Yeah, this is where I would have suspected it'd be too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voyager Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 1st Question: Probably Sapporo, Japan...about 248"/yr in a city of nearly 2 million. http://translate.goo...view%3D&act=url http://en.wikipedia....Sapporo#Climate Thx! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icebreaker5221 Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 So what is the snowiest metropolitan area on earth? Also, wondering about the snowiest metro area in the lower 48. Depends upon what size "city" you want for the lower 48. The following link has basically all notable metro areas in the U.S.: http://lwf.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/online/ccd/snowfall.html The Marquette, MI metro area has ~65,000 people and averages 141" /year. The Syracuse, NY metro area has ~730,000 people and averages 115" /year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinterWxLuvr Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 Somewhere in Alaska may well beat out the snowiest areas of Japan, but I wouldn't undersell the Island. There is a firehose effect off of the Sea of Japan and some areas at times can report 25 meter snowpacks. But like someone else said, the place that gets the most snow probably doesn't have observations. Those first two pics are unbelievable. What I would love to see is a pic of the machine that created that impossible scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmlwx Posted November 20, 2010 Share Posted November 20, 2010 Those first two pics are unbelievable. What I would love to see is a pic of the machine that created that impossible scene. Maybe everyone got together for a few months and shoveled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zemu Glacier Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 This is a topic I'm also very interested in. I too would find it impossible that in reality there wouldn't be places that would exceed the official snow records at Mount Baker Ski resort or Paradise at Mount Rainer. I can think of many areas that would have a better precipitation/cold temp combination and with more extensive glaciation than Mount Baker or Mount Rainer. Some posts in this thread have already those place but the ones that come to mind the most are Chugach mountain range, British columbia coast range(in particular the waddington range, the Juneau Icefield and around Mount Ratz), the St Ellias Range, Patagonia, Southern Alps In New Zealand and the Eastern Himalayas. I have a book called WORLD Mountaineering and on page 110 it says that the estimated snowfall on Mount Waddington is 60 meters(200 feet)!!!!. Now I would expect that Mount Waddington would probably get more snowfall than Mount Rainer and Mount Baker but that much? That seems a bit too much. For one there is a site that forecasts the weather for all the major mountains in the world and the amounts that it models for Mount Waddington don't seem to come even close to that so far(I've only been looking at now for about 2 months). BTW I've looked at various mountains using that site and so far based on that site the snowiest mountain is a 18,000 foot volcano in Colombia by the name of Nevado del Huila. Based on that same site so far Mount St Ellias, Mount Fairweather and 16,000 foot Puncak Jaya in New Guinea are right behind(but its just a model and there have been some things I've noticed that don't seem right). But having said that if there would be one mountain range where I would place bets on having the true highest snowfall I think I might say the St Ellias Range. I think the southern flanks of Mount St Ellias itself as well as Mount Fairweather really standout. I've also noticed many websites asserting that Mount Fairweather receives 100 inches of precipitation a year. I think its safe to say that 100 inches is a GROSS underestimate in the extreme. I also would probably put in the same category the southwestern part of the southern Patagonia icefield(in particular in the northern part of tyndal glacier), Mount Cook in the southern alps in New Zealand and Kangchenjunga on the border of Nepal/Sikkim(3rd highest mountain in the world). About Tyndal Glacier in Patagonia. There was some intense scientific studies on that glacier for the years 1997-2000 by some Japanese glaciologists and came to the conclusion that some of the most extreme amounts of precipitation occur on the upper parts of the glacier. The high values calculated are considered to be typical of this glacier in the light of synoptic-scale climate analyses of the region. GlaciarTyndall can therefore be classed as one of the most extreme maritime glaciers in the world. http://www.glaciolog...os/shiraiwa.pdf Some New Zealand Scientists used that study to make new estimates on the highest precipitation rates in the world and concluded that in fact Tyndal glacier gets the most precipitation in the world on average actually exceeding the usual names associated with heavy precipitation such as Lloro, Colombia; Mt Waialeale, Hawaii; Mawsynram, india or Cherrapunji,India http://www.geog.cant...GU%20Poster.pdf I also came across this about an climbing expedition to the notorious difficult Cerro Torre in Patagonia in the winter of 1970 where they say it snowed 18 meters in 54 days. http://books.google....nepage&q&f=true Getting back to the study by the New Zealand Scientists. From the same link you can see that several New Zealand stations were right behind the Tyndal glacier in Patagonia and those stations were all in the general vicinity of Mount Cook and so Mount Cook without a doubt would have to be contender for the snowiest place in the world(I've come across some references that say some glaciers in southern also around Mount Cook get an annual snowfall of around 50 meters). I also listed Kangchenjunga because I'm fairly certain out of all the 14 8000+ meter peaks, Kangchenjunga gets hit by the heavy Monsoons the most(its the most easterly and southern 8000 meter peak). It also known for its huge avalanches and the largest glacier in the eastern Himalays(the Zemu Glacier) originates from the East face of Kangchenjunga. One other area within the Himalayas that I would look at would be the Assam Himalaya on the border of India and Tibet just Northeast of Bhutan(specifically around a mountain called Kangtö) because I think this area also gets hit hard by the Monsoons. So this topic I find very fascinating. I would really like to here some feedback from some climatologists or glaciologist(I'm neither) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha5 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 So what is the snowiest metropolitan area on earth? Also, wondering about the snowiest metro area in the lower 48. Not sure about metro area, but Boonville, NY may be the snowiest town. http://www.weather.c...0-12-07?page=10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okie333 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 For big cities (1,000,000+), no other city comes close to Sapporo, Japan's 248 inches per year. Snowiest US metro area with 100,000+ people is Syracuse, NY, with 121 inches per year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amped Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I'd say somewhere along the southern Chile, Argentina border. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carumba Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I'd say somewhere along the southern Chile, Argentina border. I've spent plenty of time in that part of the world. There are few roads or inhabitants across the southern part of the Cordillera and as a result there is little to rely on as far as snow depth measurements go. The Cordillera also isn't as high as it is in the northern and central parts of Chile so topography is not in one's favor the further south you head. FWIW check out the climate in San Carlos de Bariloche in Argentina. Beautiful town in the winter. I also worked in Antofagasta way up in the north of Chile on the edge of the Atacama desert and used to frequently travel east into the mining areas at 10,000ft+ altitude and other folks I worked with had spent time at mines at 15,000+ ft in Peru and northern Chile. But the environment is bone dry, there's no moisture there and it hardly snows even in the depths of winter despite the intense overnight cold at those altitudes. Pity really because if the Cordillera was on the eastern side of the continent with moisture hitting it I'm sure that they'd get amazing snowfalls! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtlehurricane Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 The mountains of the Antarctic peninsula might be in the running, especially towards the north where there's less sea ice on average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amped Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I've spent plenty of time in that part of the world. There are few roads or inhabitants across the southern part of the Cordillera and as a result there is little to rely on as far as snow depth measurements go. The Cordillera also isn't as high as it is in the northern and central parts of Chile so topography is not in one's favor the further south you head. FWIW check out the climate in San Carlos de Bariloche in Argentina. Beautiful town in the winter. I also worked in Antofagasta way up in the north of Chile on the edge of the Atacama desert and used to frequently travel east into the mining areas at 10,000ft+ altitude and other folks I worked with had spent time at mines at 15,000+ ft in Peru and northern Chile. But the environment is bone dry, there's no moisture there and it hardly snows even in the depths of winter despite the intense overnight cold at those altitudes. Pity really because if the Cordillera was on the eastern side of the continent with moisture hitting it I'm sure that they'd get amazing snowfalls! Yeah probably not the southern tip of Chilie. I'd say south central Chilie Torres Del Paine looks like a pretty good spot. It's near 50 S and 6000+ft up. It probably rivals most spots in the cascades Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loafnut Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 A good place to start would be to look at a precip map like this, then try to find places where it snows year round at an elevation where it still gets lots of precip. http://www.climate-charts.com/images/world-rainfall-map.png Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amped Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 A good place to start would be to look at a precip map like this, then try to find places where it snows year round at an elevation where it still gets lots of precip. http://www.climate-c...ainfall-map.png Cayambe Equator wins by that method elevation 18,996 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlizzardWx Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 This is a good thread. I agree with most of you, no doubt there are snowier places than the current record holder. If nothing else if they could measure at the top of the mountain I bet it would make a difference. That said I think the mountains in British columbia probably get more snow than washington. Also other places some of you have mentioned would be a good bet. Maybe they don't have snow stations up there because they would get buried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman56 Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Gotta love the Cascades when the trough is in the west. 8' possible by Thursday... P & C for Mt. Rainier @ 12330': Today: Snow showers. High near 7. Breezy, with a west southwest wind 13 to 16 mph increasing to between 23 and 26 mph. Chance of precipitation is 90%. Total daytime snow accumulation of 3 to 5 inches possible. Tonight: Snow showers likely. Mostly cloudy, with a low around -3. West northwest wind between 8 and 17 mph. Chance of precipitation is 60%. New snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches possible. Tuesday: A 40 percent chance of snow showers. Mostly cloudy and cold, with a high near 10. West northwest wind between 8 and 16 mph. New snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches possible. Tuesday Night: A 40 percent chance of snow. Cloudy, with a low around -1. Northwest wind 7 to 10 mph becoming south southwest. New snow accumulation of 5 to 9 inches possible. Wednesday: Snow. High near 13. Southwest wind between 13 and 20 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 33 to 39 inches possible. Wednesday Night: Snow showers. Low around -2. Breezy. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 23 to 29 inches possible. Thursday: Snow showers. High near 7. Chance of precipitation is 90%. New snow accumulation of 7 to 11 inches possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaoPos Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Gotta love the Cascades when the trough is in the west. 8' possible by Thursday... P & C for Mt. Rainier @ 12330': Today: Snow showers. High near 7. Breezy, with a west southwest wind 13 to 16 mph increasing to between 23 and 26 mph. Chance of precipitation is 90%. Total daytime snow accumulation of 3 to 5 inches possible. Tonight: Snow showers likely. Mostly cloudy, with a low around -3. West northwest wind between 8 and 17 mph. Chance of precipitation is 60%. New snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches possible. Tuesday: A 40 percent chance of snow showers. Mostly cloudy and cold, with a high near 10. West northwest wind between 8 and 16 mph. New snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches possible. Tuesday Night: A 40 percent chance of snow. Cloudy, with a low around -1. Northwest wind 7 to 10 mph becoming south southwest. New snow accumulation of 5 to 9 inches possible. Wednesday: Snow. High near 13. Southwest wind between 13 and 20 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 33 to 39 inches possible. Wednesday Night: Snow showers. Low around -2. Breezy. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 23 to 29 inches possible. Thursday: Snow showers. High near 7. Chance of precipitation is 90%. New snow accumulation of 7 to 11 inches possible. Stiffy Alert!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loafnut Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Unless the peak often above the clouds and thus misses out on much of the precip... It also probably rains up there a fair amount. Cayambe Equator wins by that method elevation 18,996 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zemu Glacier Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 No, it can snow even at incredibly cold temperatures as long as there is some source of moisture and some way to lift or cool the air. It is true, however, that most heavy snowfalls occur with relatively warm air temperatures near the ground—typically -9 degrees Celsius (15 degrees Fahrenheit) or warmer—since air can hold more water vapor at warmer temperatures. http://nsidc.org/snow/faq.html regarding Mount Rainer The heaviest snowfall occurs between the elevation of 5,000 and 11,000 feet. http://www.mount.rai...com/weather.htm In the Alps Observations made in the Alps, and extending over a considerable number of years, indicate that the maximum precipitation in the form of snow takes place in what is known as the "lower snow-region," or between 6500 feet and 8000 feet ... Beyond an elevation of 8000 feet the precipitation sensibly diminishes https://www.google.c...biw=800&bih=433 So what is the point here? That obviously the most amounts of snow aren't in the really high and super cold areas so therefore I think finding areas with high precipitation first would be the more important heuristic than temperature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zemu Glacier Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 I mentioned a website that actually gives forecasts for just about all the major mountains in the world. Well here it is here http://www.mountain-forecast.com/ Like I mentioned in my first post scanning all the areas that should receive a lot of snow (since about September) it seems like a volcano in Colombia consistently gets the most snowfall http://www.mountain-.../forecasts/5750 Colombia itself is known for being one of the rainiest places on earth. But having said that I did notice a flaw in that website which is it doesn't seem to follow what I quoted above in my previous post about snowfall being heaviest lower on the mountain where temps aren't super cold. Another place that should get a lot of snowfall is in the mountains above 6,000 feet on Vancouver Island such as Golden Hinde. Henderson Lake in Vancouver Island gets the most rainfall on average than any place in North America About Antartica. Well of course generally Antarctica is a very dry continent but having said that there is a place in East Antarctica called LAW DOME which supposedly gets a high accumulation rate but still I would be very very surprised if anything in Antarctica even approaches some of these areas in Patagonia, St Ellias Range, Southern Alps in New Zealand, British Columbia Coast range, Chugach Range and so areas in the south eastern Himalaya. , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beavis1729 Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Not sure about metro area, but Boonville, NY may be the snowiest town. http://www.weather.c...0-12-07?page=10 I think two U.S. towns beat Boonville, NY: (1) Valdez, AK: ~298" per year (2) Herman, MI: ~236" per year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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