Nesis rating.

[tamarack]

Its subjective, because you have to define what you mean by "dynamic." My most dynamic storm in terms of incredible winds and long duration (3 days!) was December 1992. Neither March 1993 nor January 1996 comes close to touching it. I also dont like the term "superstorm" because there have been several superstorms over the past century-- and, honestly, I think for overall impact, both November 1950 and January 1978 (midwest bomb) were FAR superior to the so-called "superstorm."

Subjective for sure - 12/92 was a cloudy windstorm with a few flakes in central Maine, while it was destroying SNE/MA locations. And I'd respectfully challenge your "FAR". The south-to-north major impact of 3/93 was amazing, from deadly tornados in FL to closing every major E.Coast airport, even though it was no more than a garden-variety nice snowstorm for much of NNE. The OV bomb was a deeper low with stronger winds, but its major impact area was considerably smaller (though fiercer on average.) 1950 had nearly the same S-N impact, but the snow missed the large E.Coast cities. For me, it's hard to choose from among those 3, and I see a sizable gap between them and whatever is 4th.

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Subjective for sure - 12/92 was a cloudy windstorm with a few flakes in central Maine, while it was destroying SNE/MA locations. And I'd respectfully challenge your "FAR". The south-to-north major impact of 3/93 was amazing, from deadly tornados in FL to closing every major E.Coast airport, even though it was no more than a garden-variety nice snowstorm for much of NNE. The OV bomb was a deeper low with stronger winds, but its major impact area was considerably smaller (though fiercer on average.) 1950 had nearly the same S-N impact, but the snow missed the large E.Coast cities. For me, it's hard to choose from among those 3, and I see a sizable gap between them and whatever is 4th.

Overall I'd agree. Which storm is "the biggest/worst" is always going to be somewhat subjective. And from my own subjective view, the Ohio blizzard of January 1978 was most definitely much fiercer (to steal your word). I was living in northeast Ohio at the time and I can vouch for that storm having personally lived through it. So, right away I suppose I have to admit to being biased because I was there and experienced it first-hand. Yes, the March 1993 storm impacted a larger region and population with a wide variety of severe weather, and dumped a lot more in the way of snow. In fact, eastern OH was even hit with blizzard conditions from that storm, with about a foot of snow in northeast OH (and upwards of 20" in the southeast part of the state)

However, I've always held the 1978 Ohio blizzard as the standard of severe winter storms, especially in terms of wind and cold (and low pressure). There was not all that huge an amount of snow from it (as best as it could be measured in the conditions!), with around 7" or so in Cleveland and northeast OH but a foot or so in western OH and I believe also in IN, MI. Central pressure (as it crossed right over KCLE) was 957mb (28.28"), winds gusted to 70-100MPH (sustained at ~40MPH I recall) at the height of the storm, temperatures dropped some 30 degrees within a couple of hours...and were in the single digits to barely 10 above zero much of the day. At the time, I recall the NWS actually issued a "severe" blizzard warning (not sure if that's even used anymore)...because the winds were over 40MPH and the temperature was 10 degrees or less. The entire area was basically shut down, and they were literally telling people that you could get frostbite in a matter of minutes on exposed flesh in the ridiculously low wind chills. I also remember hearing the Ohio Turnpike was shut down for its entire length for the first (and I believe still the only) time ever. What made the wind and cold all the more impressive (and surreal) is that it was fairly mild with drizzle the day before, and the NWS was already issuing winter storm and then blizzard watches for the event. I recall reading that as the cold air blasted in during the pre-dawn and early morning hours the next day, temperatures at KCLE fell from around 40 at 4AM to around 10 or the low teens by 6AM.

I never much cared for dubbing March 1993 as "The Superstorm" or "Storm of the Century". Or any storm for that matter, as anyone who's been around can probably and legitimately argue for other such "Storms of the Century".

[Paweatherguy1]

Overall I'd agree. Which storm is "the biggest/worst" is always going to be somewhat subjective. And from my own subjective view, the Ohio blizzard of January 1978 was most definitely much fiercer (to steal your word). I was living in northeast Ohio at the time and I can vouch for that storm having personally lived through it. So, right away I suppose I have to admit to being biased because I was there and experienced it first-hand. Yes, the March 1993 storm impacted a larger region and population with a wide variety of severe weather, and dumped a lot more in the way of snow. In fact, eastern OH was even hit with blizzard conditions from that storm, with about a foot of snow in northeast OH (and upwards of 20" in the southeast part of the state)

However, I've always held the 1978 Ohio blizzard as the standard of severe winter storms, especially in terms of wind and cold (and low pressure). There was not all that huge an amount of snow from it (as best as it could be measured in the conditions!), with around 7" or so in Cleveland and northeast OH but a foot or so in western OH and I believe also in IN, MI. Central pressure (as it crossed right over KCLE) was 957mb (28.28"), winds gusted to 70-100MPH (sustained at ~40MPH I recall) at the height of the storm, temperatures dropped some 30 degrees within a couple of hours...and were in the single digits to barely 10 above zero much of the day. At the time, I recall the NWS actually issued a "severe" blizzard warning (not sure if that's even used anymore)...because the winds were over 40MPH and the temperature was 10 degrees or less. The entire area was basically shut down, and they were literally telling people that you could get frostbite in a matter of minutes on exposed flesh in the ridiculously low wind chills. I also remember hearing the Ohio Turnpike was shut down for its entire length for the first (and I believe still the only) time ever. What made the wind and cold all the more impressive (and surreal) is that it was fairly mild with drizzle the day before, and the NWS was already issuing winter storm and then blizzard watches for the event. I recall reading that as the cold air blasted in during the pre-dawn and early morning hours the next day, temperatures at KCLE fell from around 40 at 4AM to around 10 or the low teens by 6AM.

I never much cared for dubbing March 1993 as "The Superstorm" or "Storm of the Century". Or any storm for that matter, as anyone who's been around can probably and legitimately argue for other such "Storms of the Century".

I think I basically agree with all you guys...yes, I consider 93 the superstorm as it is the only true blizzard I have ever been involved in. I also look at the fact that it set pressure records up the eastern seaboard, as well as the impacts it had on the deep south as well.

However, when you look at "storm of the century" every area will have a different one.

[Hoosier]

Overall I'd agree. Which storm is "the biggest/worst" is always going to be somewhat subjective. And from my own subjective view, the Ohio blizzard of January 1978 was most definitely much fiercer (to steal your word). I was living in northeast Ohio at the time and I can vouch for that storm having personally lived through it. So, right away I suppose I have to admit to being biased because I was there and experienced it first-hand. Yes, the March 1993 storm impacted a larger region and population with a wide variety of severe weather, and dumped a lot more in the way of snow. In fact, eastern OH was even hit with blizzard conditions from that storm, with about a foot of snow in northeast OH (and upwards of 20" in the southeast part of the state)

However, I've always held the 1978 Ohio blizzard as the standard of severe winter storms, especially in terms of wind and cold (and low pressure). There was not all that huge an amount of snow from it (as best as it could be measured in the conditions!), with around 7" or so in Cleveland and northeast OH but a foot or so in western OH and I believe also in IN, MI. Central pressure (as it crossed right over KCLE) was 957mb (28.28"), winds gusted to 70-100MPH (sustained at ~40MPH I recall) at the height of the storm, temperatures dropped some 30 degrees within a couple of hours...and were in the single digits to barely 10 above zero much of the day. At the time, I recall the NWS actually issued a "severe" blizzard warning (not sure if that's even used anymore)...because the winds were over 40MPH and the temperature was 10 degrees or less. The entire area was basically shut down, and they were literally telling people that you could get frostbite in a matter of minutes on exposed flesh in the ridiculously low wind chills. I also remember hearing the Ohio Turnpike was shut down for its entire length for the first (and I believe still the only) time ever. What made the wind and cold all the more impressive (and surreal) is that it was fairly mild with drizzle the day before, and the NWS was already issuing winter storm and then blizzard watches for the event. I recall reading that as the cold air blasted in during the pre-dawn and early morning hours the next day, temperatures at KCLE fell from around 40 at 4AM to around 10 or the low teens by 6AM.

I never much cared for dubbing March 1993 as "The Superstorm" or "Storm of the Century". Or any storm for that matter, as anyone who's been around can probably and legitimately argue for other such "Storms of the Century".

Much of IN/MI got 1-3 feet in the '78 storm, with the heaviest amounts near the lake.

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Much of IN/MI got 1-3 feet in the '78 storm, with the heaviest amounts near the lake.

One interesting aspect of that storm was a very unusual west/southwest moving warm front that went through southern MI into IN and southwest OH. From what I've read about that storm, this front resulted from relatively (very relatively!) warm air actually being wrapped and advected into the northwest and west side of the system in the strong circulation. It also actually helped to enhance convergence and hence snowfall in those areas too.

[tamarack]

One interesting aspect of that storm was a very unusual west/southwest moving warm front that went through southern MI into IN and southwest OH. From what I've read about that storm, this front resulted from relatively (very relatively!) warm air actually being wrapped and advected into the northwest and west side of the system in the strong circulation. It also actually helped to enhance convergence and hence snowfall in those areas too.

Just to add to the "subjective" meme - I lived in Fort Kent at that time, and the OV bomb was a major thaw for N.Maine (no surprise with the LP hundreds of miles to our west), though it had a few inches of snow at each end of the rainy period. We also missed most of the other two-thirds of the "3 week trifecta", getting 4" on 1/20 and 2" on 2/7.

Very few storms blasting other places in the east ever did much in N.Maine. Exceptions coming to mind are the 1/77 Buffalo blizzard (13" with winds gusting to 50) and the 4/82 spring surprise (17", teens, winds g60 IMBY, CAR 26" - at the time their biggest ever.)

[WeatherNC]

Pretty sure the NESIS calculation ends at the VA/NC border and stops at the PA/OH border

Do you have a source to support this as the Jan 93 Superstorm rating, and more recently the Boxing Day 10 rating likely include areas outside of "VA/NC border and stops at the PA/OH border?"

If the rating only included areas within, then why do the published maps show totals for areas outside?

[WeatherNC]

Could a met possibly clarify how snows outside the 13 state area are calculated in?

The scale is calibrated by first computing Amean and Pmean for 10-in. (25-cm) snowfall accumulations within the 13-state area from West Virginia–Virginia northeastward to Maine for each of 30 cases (Table 1; also see Kocin and Uccellini 2004a, Figs. 3-2a) Final values of NESIS are then computed for the total snowfall distribution east of the Rocky Mountains (Fig. 1, Table 2). These steps recognize that the basis for the application of NESIS is to quantify the impact of heavy snowfall on the Northeast urban corridor, while also accounting for the total snow history associated with these storms as they track across the United States. For example, heavy snowfall from the New England snowstorm of late February 1969 (Fig. 1c) was confined solely to eastern New England, while many other snowstorms, such as March 1960, January 1964, and February 1979 (Figs. 1a–1c) were part of more widespread storm systems affecting larger portions of the nation. Thus, NESIS represents a measure of the integrated, or total, impact of a snowfall within and outside the Northeast, calibrated by the 30 storms AMERICAN METEOROLOGICAL SOCIETY FEBRUARY 2004 | 181 from 1950 to 2000 that had the largest apparent impact in the Northeast urban corridor. Furthermore, the scale provides added weight to the higher snowfall increments (n 2, 3, ...,), which are generally maximized in the northeastern part of the United States for these selected storms, reflecting the greater potential disruption when very heavy snow falls in the most densely populated areas.

Source (page 180): http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/pdf/10.1175/BAMS-85-2-177

[OKpowdah]

Thanks WeatherNC for clarifying that

[NJwinter23]

Yeah, Well I don't know about yawn. I mean Philly and NYC saw 7 and 9 inches respectively. All of pa basically all the way back to the Midwest will be in that 4-10 range with higher amounts in the plains. Deep south is the same deal with some isolated 10+ totals. New england is going to be buried by 10-25 inches of snow.

Yeah, it didn't have the highest totals ever, but the system isn't completely centered around dc and baltimoe, and if the storm misses them it isn't an automatic 2 or lower.

This storm had impacts on Atlanta, Dallas, Birmingham, Memphis, Pittsburgh, Columbus, and cincy, which all get factored in...it is one of the largest areas I remember getting 4+ inches of snow.

Philly Intl was officially 5.2", Central Park 9.1"... I think this will be a NESIS 2 not because of intensity/totals or anything like that, but because of the smallish area it affected. So I consider it higher than say a Dec. 30th, 2000 type storm that was NESIS 1 and a fair analog to this storm in how it developed.

[NJwinter23]

By the way, I've been bothered by a lot of the snowfall maps on the NESIS page which seem to under-do the snowfall totals on several storms. I'm not sure what snowfall totals they use to interpolate in between the f6 sites, but so many storms do not represent well in my opinion. That Boxing Day map is just the latest in the bunch which only has 10-20 inches in my area where there was widespread 20+ (25 for me)

[Paweatherguy1]

Philly Intl was officially 5.2", Central Park 9.1"... I think this will be a NESIS 2 not because of intensity/totals or anything like that, but because of the smallish area it affected. So I consider it higher than say a Dec. 30th, 2000 type storm that was NESIS 1 and a fair analog to this storm in how it developed.

It actually affected a rather large area.

[A-L-E-X]

Subjective for sure - 12/92 was a cloudy windstorm with a few flakes in central Maine, while it was destroying SNE/MA locations. And I'd respectfully challenge your "FAR". The south-to-north major impact of 3/93 was amazing, from deadly tornados in FL to closing every major E.Coast airport, even though it was no more than a garden-variety nice snowstorm for much of NNE. The OV bomb was a deeper low with stronger winds, but its major impact area was considerably smaller (though fiercer on average.) 1950 had nearly the same S-N impact, but the snow missed the large E.Coast cities. For me, it's hard to choose from among those 3, and I see a sizable gap between them and whatever is 4th.

lol yea "Far" is an exaggeration on my part, but I remember reading accounts of both the 1950 and 1978 and being wowed by them. March 1993 was amazing also (as was January 1996), but the way I judge storms (subjectively) is by the following hypothetical question: "If I had to chose to be in the maximum impacted location, which storm would I choose?"

[weathermanchild]

lol yea "Far" is an exaggeration on my part, but I remember reading accounts of both the 1950 and 1978 and being wowed by them. March 1993 was amazing also (as was January 1996), but the way I judge storms (subjectively) is by the following hypothetical question: "If I had to chose to be in the maximum impacted location, which storm would I choose?"

How would you measure that? I was looking at the conference program for AMS Seattle and found this:

http://ams.confex.com/ams/91Annual/webprogram/Paper180462.html

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

lol yea "Far" is an exaggeration on my part, but I remember reading accounts of both the 1950 and 1978 and being wowed by them.

Well, believe me when I say I was "wowed" by the Ohio Valley blizzard in 1978 experiencing it first-hand! But I was also wowed by March 1993, the extent of area it affected...and it even was pretty bad in Ohio (kind of unusual for your typical coastal storm to do that!). Since I grew up during the 1978 storm, though, that has always remained in my mind as the standard, like I said. I'm sure those who were younger in 1993 and experienced that first-hand in the areas that got really hammered, they'll look back as that one being their "standard" that they grew up with, years from now.

Interesting tidbit during the 1950 storm that I've read about...they played the Ohio State-Michigan game that weekend, in Columbus! Michigan won 9-3 or something like that, and each team punted some 20+ times! Hardly any passes were attempted, given the conditions (no surprise there). And from what I recall reading, Michigan won by scoring a TD on a blocked punt. I find it amazing that either team's field goal kicker would even stand a chance, yet there were 2 field goals and an extra point! Heck, I find it amazing they even played the game in the first place!

From what I read too, OSU's coach was fired shortly thereafter when the season ended, and it left a vacancy for none other than...Woody Hayes!!