Southland Wx Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 This is just crazy. I guess its good for California agriculture, considering i *think* they depend on this snowpack come summer? Major. Snow runoff in the Sierra is critical for Central Valley ag, as well as statewide power, not to mention drinking water. Great news for California. The extended drought in Central and Northern California has drained lake levels to unbelievable levels. This year is a good start to replenishing those lake levels. This really is great news...considering the seasonal forecast was fairly obvious to be below normal precip, especially for the southern half of the state. In the end, it might end up being that the entire West Coast does good this season. But the snowpack in the Sierra would be both a major coup and vital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Might be a good year to start thinking about a late march trip to Mammoth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Especially considering how warm this storm is going to be. This really is an awesome pattern though. Very out of character considering we have a mod-strong Nina going in the Pacific. One thing's for sure...with the initial base from November up there and the monster snows the next week or so, skiing is going to be phenomenal up there over the next several months, especially if we can stray back into more Nina climo in Jan/Feb, with colder than normal wx. Yah, that is why I was mentioning above 9000 feet where I suspect the rations will be a tad better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Might be a good year to start thinking about a late march trip to Mammoth Mammoth or Heavenly or whatever, I would take any of them. I love the Sierras and the intermountain west. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Mammoth or Heavenly or whatever, I would take any of them. I love the Sierras and the intermountain west. They are pretty much awesome on all fronts. Mt Hood up through Whistler (my fav) are probably all off to a big time start. It was just a couple years ago when lifts at one of the Tahoe area resorts had to shutdown because they couldn't move because the snow was so high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 They are pretty much awesome on all fronts. Mt Hood up through Whistler (my fav) are probably all off to a big time start. It was just a couple years ago when lifts at one of the Tahoe area resorts had to shutdown because they couldn't move because the snow was so high. Speaking of intermountainwest, UT just put out an avalanche watch for the Wasatch and western Uintas for the onslaught of moisture laden snow over their typically dry and compact snow. Utah has some great ski areas as well, and all centered around SLC. Alta/Snowbird as well as Park City were my favs. Never been to the Pacific NW side of things but my friend went to Whistler/Blackcomb a couple years ago. Too bad they were shafted last winter during the olympics. Most people don't realize they aren't all that high...well below 10,000 feet. I want to say on average around 3000-6000 feet or so for Whistler Blackcomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Speaking of intermountainwest, UT just put out an avalanche watch for the Wasatch and western Uintas for the onslaught of moisture laden snow over their typically dry and compact snow. Utah has some great ski areas as well, and all centered around SLC. Alta/Snowbird as well as Park City were my favs. Never been to the Pacific NW side of things but my friend went to Whistler/Blackcomb a couple years ago. Too bad they were shafted last winter during the olympics. Most people don't realize they aren't all that high...well below 10,000 feet. I want to say on average around 3000-6000 feet or so for Whistler Blackcomb. I've been out to the Canyons/Park City and liked it but had average-ish conditions (near 60 one day, then a 3-6 inch snow, then cold), I imagine after a really nice dump it's great but what mountain out west isn't. Never been to Alta (is it still ski only?) and Re: the elevation at Whistler, I did know that, but it doesn't feel that way because there is so much above tree line/glacier/bowl terrain, the snow is definitely not as nice, but if you spend your time on the upper slopes it's pretty sweet and the views are unparalleled. If you're ever looking for something different, Big Sky in Montana is a fantastic resort, good village, dry snow and an impressive mountain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 I've been out to the Canyons/Park City and liked it but had average-ish conditions (near 60 one day, then a 3-6 inch snow, then cold), I imagine after a really nice dump it's great but what mountain out west isn't. Never been to Alta (is it still ski only?) and Re: the elevation at Whistler, I did know that, but it doesn't feel that way because there is so much above tree line/glacier/bowl terrain, the snow is definitely not as nice, but if you spend your time on the upper slopes it's pretty sweet and the views are unparalleled. If you're ever looking for something different, Big Sky in Montana is a fantastic resort, good village, dry snow and an impressive mountain. Yeah I hear that, I also did SnowBasin at Ut and we got shafted because they had a layer of ice on top of the snow...it sucked. Snow quality is huge out W and can ruin any good resort. I heard great things about Big Sky, definitely want to go there soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southland Wx Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Might be a good year to start thinking about a late march trip to Mammoth Or mid-June! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeznado Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 A minor grammatical point- it's the Sierra (plural) not the Sierras...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 A minor grammatical point- it's the Sierra (plural) not the Sierras...... Very true, thanks. So then would it be wrong to call them the Sierra Nevadas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srain Posted December 17, 2010 Author Share Posted December 17, 2010 A minor grammatical point- it's the Sierra (plural) not the Sierras...... Thank you grammer nazi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Thank you grammer nazi. It is "grammar" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srain Posted December 17, 2010 Author Share Posted December 17, 2010 Ouch... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 sickness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeznado Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Very true, thanks. So then would it be wrong to call them the Sierra Nevadas? Yes, that is incorrect, the plural is Sierra Nevada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Ouch... Insanity. Given the models (and HPC) will smooth the crap out of this, it is likely localized regions through the Sierra Nevada (thanks for the correction cheeznado) will see well over the 14.7". Snow record that asklhuna talked about earlier may be in jeopardy even with the high snow levels and low ratios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Insanity. Given the models (and HPC) will smooth the crap out of this, it is likely localized regions through the Sierra Nevada (thanks for the correction cheeznado) will see well over the 14.7'. Snow record that asklhuna talked about earlier may be in jeopardy even with the high snow levels and low ratios. corrected the minor error. It averages out to nearly 1.5" per hour for 120 straight hours, assuming 10:1 Sierra cement, summits probably much higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 corrected the minor error. It averages out to nearly 1.5" per hour for 120 straight hours, assuming 10:1 Sierra cement, summits probably much higher. Well the HPC map I referenced was qpf in inches though...and asklhuna's comment of course snow in feet. But yeah, at that rate some records may be falling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 Well the HPC map is qpf in inches though. my bad, i thought you were tanslating that to snow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 my bad, i thought you were tanslating that to snow. This brings up a good point though. Our discussions regarding snow ratios is generally only considering the thermal profile. Some good studies from Utah's Wasatch (mostly relating to avalanche potential with differing types of snowpack layered over another owing to snow ratios) show the extreme variability one can achieve in snow ratios owing to not just thermals but also strength and direction of the wind in reference to the mountain and individual peaks. Using a conservative 8/10-1 in general, some peaks will see much higher ratios as well to go along with the higher qpf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 One thing nobody has mentioned is the wind potential across the Washoe Valley east of the Sierra Nevada in NV. They look favorable for some extreme downslope windstorms and a potential near mtn level inversion in some models. Storms like this have destroyed the Reno radar in past events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-L-E-K Posted December 17, 2010 Share Posted December 17, 2010 I believe we have a met on the board from the Reno area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srain Posted December 17, 2010 Author Share Posted December 17, 2010 One thing nobody has mentioned is the wind potential across the Washoe Valley east of the Sierra Nevada in NV. They look favorable for some extreme downslope windstorms and a potential near mtn level inversion in some models. Storms like this have destroyed the Reno radar in past events. The drive from Reno to Tahoe will be brutal...I've had a couple of those strong crosswind landing in Reno as well... URGENT - WEATHER MESSAGE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE RENO NV 322 PM PST FRI DEC 17 2010 ...PERIODS OF STRONG AND POSSIBLY DAMAGING WINDS SATURDAY... .PRECIPITATION WILL DECREASE IN INTENSITY AND COVERAGE LATE FRIDAY NIGHT AND SATURDAY FOR WESTERN NEVADA. AS PRECIPITATION DECREASES IN INTENSITY AND COVERAGE...WINDS ARE EXPECTED TO INCREASE SIGNIFICANTLY. NVZ001-003-181400- /O.UPG.KREV.HW.A.0004.101218T1200Z-101219T0000Z/ /O.NEW.KREV.HW.W.0006.101218T1200Z-101219T0000Z/ MINERAL AND SOUTHERN LYON COUNTIES-GREATER RENO-CARSON CITY- MINDEN AREA- INCLUDING THE CITIES OF...HAWTHORNE...YERINGTON...SMITH VALLEY... SPARKS...GARDNERVILLE...VIRGINIA CITY 322 PM PST FRI DEC 17 2010 ...HIGH WIND WARNING IN EFFECT FROM 4 AM TO 4 PM PST SATURDAY... THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN RENO HAS ISSUED A HIGH WIND WARNING...WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM 4 AM TO 4 PM PST SATURDAY. THE HIGH WIND WATCH IS NO LONGER IN EFFECT. * TIMING: WINDS WILL BEGIN TO INCREASE LATE TONIGHT WITH THE STRONGEST WINDS SATURDAY MORNING AND AFTERNOON. * WINDS: SOUTHWEST 20 TO 35 WITH GUSTS TO 60 MPH. GUSTS UP TO 70 MPH IN THE FOOTHILLS AND IN WIND PRONE AREAS SUCH AS WASHOE VALLEY...GALENA...STEAD...AND ALONG HIGHWAY 95 NEAR WALKER LAKE. WINDS WILL DECREASE DURING PERIODS OF PRECIPITATION. * IMPACTS: DANGEROUS CROSSWINDS ARE EXPECTED ALONG NORTH-SOUTH ORIENTED HIGHWAYS SUCH AS HIGHWAYS 95 AND 395...ESPECIALLY FOR HIGH PROFILE VEHICLES. IN ADDITION...ANY LOOSE OUTDOOR ITEMS OR HOLIDAY DECORATIONS SHOULD BE SECURED OR PUT AWAY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 18, 2010 Share Posted December 18, 2010 The drive from Reno to Tahoe will be brutal... URGENT - WEATHER MESSAGE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE RENO NV 322 PM PST FRI DEC 17 2010 ...PERIODS OF STRONG AND POSSIBLY DAMAGING WINDS SATURDAY... .PRECIPITATION WILL DECREASE IN INTENSITY AND COVERAGE LATE FRIDAY NIGHT AND SATURDAY FOR WESTERN NEVADA. AS PRECIPITATION DECREASES IN INTENSITY AND COVERAGE...WINDS ARE EXPECTED TO INCREASE SIGNIFICANTLY. NVZ001-003-181400- /O.UPG.KREV.HW.A.0004.101218T1200Z-101219T0000Z/ /O.NEW.KREV.HW.W.0006.101218T1200Z-101219T0000Z/ MINERAL AND SOUTHERN LYON COUNTIES-GREATER RENO-CARSON CITY- MINDEN AREA- INCLUDING THE CITIES OF...HAWTHORNE...YERINGTON...SMITH VALLEY... SPARKS...GARDNERVILLE...VIRGINIA CITY 322 PM PST FRI DEC 17 2010 ...HIGH WIND WARNING IN EFFECT FROM 4 AM TO 4 PM PST SATURDAY... THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN RENO HAS ISSUED A HIGH WIND WARNING...WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM 4 AM TO 4 PM PST SATURDAY. THE HIGH WIND WATCH IS NO LONGER IN EFFECT. * TIMING: WINDS WILL BEGIN TO INCREASE LATE TONIGHT WITH THE STRONGEST WINDS SATURDAY MORNING AND AFTERNOON. * WINDS: SOUTHWEST 20 TO 35 WITH GUSTS TO 60 MPH. GUSTS UP TO 70 MPH IN THE FOOTHILLS AND IN WIND PRONE AREAS SUCH AS WASHOE VALLEY...GALENA...STEAD...AND ALONG HIGHWAY 95 NEAR WALKER LAKE. WINDS WILL DECREASE DURING PERIODS OF PRECIPITATION. * IMPACTS: DANGEROUS CROSSWINDS ARE EXPECTED ALONG NORTH-SOUTH ORIENTED HIGHWAYS SUCH AS HIGHWAYS 95 AND 395...ESPECIALLY FOR HIGH PROFILE VEHICLES. IN ADDITION...ANY LOOSE OUTDOOR ITEMS OR HOLIDAY DECORATIONS SHOULD BE SECURED OR PUT AWAY. Yeah, it is going to be a downslope windstorm crap-show. The setup for high profile vehicles is awful as 395 from Carson City to Reno runs straight N-S perpendicular to the range. Reminds me of I-25 in Wyoming in the lee of the Wyoming Range where they see ridiculous windstorms that topples semis rather frequently. Here is a CIMMS article discussing one of the storms that dominated the Reno radar. http://cimss.ssec.wi...g/archives/1581 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aslkahuna Posted December 18, 2010 Share Posted December 18, 2010 Yes, that is incorrect, the plural is Sierra Nevada. You are right in that also-the problem is that Sierra Nevada is Spanish and so the English doesn't translate right. I've actually brought this point up before on an almost yearly basis each Winter and was about to again but you beat me to it. Actually however, although the word Sierra, is plural and the name Sierra Nevada translates freely to "snow covered mountains" the mountain range itself is singular since there's only one Sierra Nevada. According to the National Geographic Society, the Sierra Nevada is the longest continuous mountain range in the lower 48 (the Rockies in CO come close but are not continuous through their entire length. Downslope winds in the Reno area are a given if we get that strong flow across the Sierra. I've been in Reno for some of those events. In fact, my experiences there helped a bit in forecasting similar wind events lee of the Huachucas near Sierra Vista in AZ. The Sierra Wave off the southern Sierra Nevada is one of the strongest Mountain Waves in the World. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aslkahuna Posted December 18, 2010 Share Posted December 18, 2010 Thank you grammer nazi. Not just grammar but any Met or one interested in same should know the correct terminology for the geographic features they deal with. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srain Posted December 18, 2010 Author Share Posted December 18, 2010 Not just grammar but any Met or one interested in same should know the correct terminology for the geographic features they deal with. Steve As you see, the Topic was edited, Steve. Perhaps a bit of that 'old TX slang' since I frequent the area and friends that live in the Tahoe Basin. Regards ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted December 18, 2010 Share Posted December 18, 2010 You are right in that also-the problem is that Sierra Nevada is Spanish and so the English doesn't translate right. I've actually brought this point up before on an almost yearly basis each Winter and was about to again but you beat me to it. Actually however, although the word Sierra, is plural and the name Sierra Nevada translates freely to "snow covered mountains" the mountain range itself is singular since there's only one Sierra Nevada. According to the National Geographic Society, the Sierra Nevada is the longest continuous mountain range in the lower 48 (the Rockies in CO come close but are not continuous through their entire length. Downslope winds in the Reno area are a given if we get that strong flow across the Sierra. I've been in Reno for some of those events. In fact, my experiences there helped a bit in forecasting similar wind events lee of the Huachucas near Sierra Vista in AZ. The Sierra Wave off the southern Sierra Nevada is one of the strongest Mountain Waves in the World. Steve Yes, they get some of the most spectacular mountain waves in the US if not the world. I would love head down into Owens Valley sometime for a significant downslope wind event. Boulder/Denver can rival them in terms of mountain waves in the US though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srain Posted December 18, 2010 Author Share Posted December 18, 2010 Big hit from the NAM. Impressive totals. Strong dynamics are in play with the Pacific cyclone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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