LocoAko Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 http://www.federaltimes.com/article/20101228/PERSONNEL02/12280301/1001 Obama replaces intern program with new hiring programs By STEPHEN LOSEY | Last Updated: December 28, 2010 The Federal Career Intern Program, a popular and controversial hiring authority that managers have used to quickly hire tens of thousands of new workers, will end March 1, according to an executive order signed yesterday by President Obama. Critics of the intern-hiring program — primarily federal unions — said it grew beyond its original scope and was being abused. Some agencies such as the Border Patrol used it as their primary hiring authority. Unions allege some agencies use FCIP to block veterans from federal jobs, and the Merit Systems Protection Board agreed in a Nov. 2 ruling. The Student Career Experience Program, another intern-hiring program, will also be canceled and replaced with a new program simply called the Internship Program, Obama said. Obama directed federal personnel director John Berry to create new hiring authorities, called Pathways Programs, that will enable managers to hire interns who are still in college or recent college graduates. ThePathways Program will also include the already-existing Presidential Management Fellows program. "To compete effectively for students and recent graduates, the federal government must improve its recruiting efforts; offer clear paths to federal internships for students from high school through post-graduate school; offer clear paths to civil service careers for recent graduates; and provide meaningful training, mentoring and career-development opportunities," Obama wrote. "Further, exposing students and recent graduates to federal jobs through internships and similar programs attracts them to careers in the federal government and enables agency employers to evaluate them on the job to determine whether they are likely to have successful careers in government." The Internship Program, one of the three Pathways Programs, will cover high school and college students and will show them what job opportunities exist in the federal government. Managers would only be able to bring those interns on temporarily — though Obama did not say how long internships should last — and the program does not include avenues to hire them directly or otherwise convert them to a federal job once their internships are completed. Obama said the program's paid interns should be given meaningful work to develop their skills — though he did not say what kind of work they should do — and said agencies should set clear expectations for them. He did not say how interns would be chosen. The Recent Graduates Program, another Pathways Program, will give people who have received a degree in the last two years developmental opportunities in the federal government that could lead to a permanent job. Veterans who had to complete a period of military service after graduating will have six years to join the Recent Graduates Program. Most participants will be in the program for up to two years, although Obama will allow agencies to extend appointments for six more months if necessary. Agencies may noncompetitively convert participants to a non-permanent term appointment, which lasts from one to four years; a career appointment; or a career conditional appointment, which includes a one-year probationary period. National Treasury Employees Union President Colleen Kelley applauded the end of FCIP, but was wary of the proposed Recent Graduates Program's hiring exceptions, which she said appeared similar to FCIP. "We see no reason why the existing competitive hiring procedures should not remain the primary hiring method for recent college graduates," Kelley said in a statement. "This new program would [like FCIP] be an exception to competitive service and, as such, it should be very narrowly drawn." Obama said FCIP employees will be converted to the competitive service March 1 with no loss of pay or benefits. Tell us what you think. E-mail STEPHEN LOSEY. Perhaps not good news for some meteorology students who were planning on using SCEP as a way to get into the National Weather Service... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhineasC Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 The Internship Program, one of the three Pathways Programs, will cover high school and college students and will show them what job opportunities exist in the federal government. Managers would only be able to bring those interns on temporarily — though Obama did not say how long internships should last — and the program does not include avenues to hire them directly or otherwise convert them to a federal job once their internships are completed. This doesn't make any sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baroclinic_instability Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 This is interesting news. Good and bad depending on who you talk to. SCEP had become quite competitive, so it really wasn't a sure thing anyways, but I am sure some folks in undergrad/graduate school will not be happy with this. I wonder how the new programs will work exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blizznd Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I think ending the SCEP program is a terrible idea. We have always had 1 or 2 SCEPs at NWS Grand Forks and use them quite effectively. In fact, we were promised by NWS management of SCEPs to help us out when NWS took away our fifth journeyman slot and created a Service Hydrologist at NWS LaCrosse. Will the the NWS give us our fifth journey back? Not likely, this in an area where in the last number of years have had among the most number of confirmed tornadoes in the warm season, life threatening blizzards in the winter, and record spring flooding along the Red River. Let's not forget the Devils Lake situation. I am all for veterans and how they served the country, but I dont think they should be put ahead of a college student in any scoring or preference. The best person for the job should win, regardless of situation. My two cents. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormguy80 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I agree with you about the veterens thing but they always have been put ahead of everyone else - I don't think anything has changed drastically in recent months regarding this from what I understand. I think ending the SCEP program is a terrible idea. We have always had 1 or 2 SCEPs at NWS Grand Forks and use them quite effectively. In fact, we were promised by NWS management of SCEPs to help us out when NWS took away our fifth journeyman slot and created a Service Hydrologist at NWS LaCrosse. Will the the NWS give us our fifth journey back? Not likely, this in an area where in the last number of years have had among the most number of confirmed tornadoes in the warm season, life threatening blizzards in the winter, and record spring flooding along the Red River. Let's not forget the Devils Lake situation. I am all for veterans and how they served the country, but I dont think they should be put ahead of a college student in any scoring or preference. The best person for the job should win, regardless of situation. My two cents. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isohume Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I think ending the SCEP program is a terrible idea. We have always had 1 or 2 SCEPs at NWS Grand Forks and use them quite effectively. In fact, we were promised by NWS management of SCEPs to help us out when NWS took away our fifth journeyman slot and created a Service Hydrologist at NWS LaCrosse. Will the the NWS give us our fifth journey back? Not likely, this in an area where in the last number of years have had among the most number of confirmed tornadoes in the warm season, life threatening blizzards in the winter, and record spring flooding along the Red River. Let's not forget the Devils Lake situation. I am all for veterans and how they served the country, but I dont think they should be put ahead of a college student in any scoring or preference. The best person for the job should win, regardless of situation. My two cents. Dan They aren't "put ahead" of anyone else. They are given 5 pts for being honorably discharged and serving in a campaign...or they are given 10 pts if they are disabled. Both duly justified and warranted imo. These points are added to their overall score (if they pass first) and they are graded alongside everyone else. If they make the panel, it's because they are in the top group of qualified applicants....not just because they are veterans. 5-Point Preference Five points are added to the passing examination score or rating of a veteran who served: During a war; or During the period April 28, 1952 through July 1, 1955; or For more than 180 consecutive days, other than for training, any part of which occurred after January 31, 1955, and before October 15, 1976; or During the Gulf War from August 2, 1990, through January 2, 1992; or For more than 180 consecutive days, other than for training, any part of which occurred during the period beginning September 11, 2001, and ending on the date prescribed by Presidential proclamation or by law as the last day of Operation Iraqi Freedom; or In a campaign or expedition for which a campaign medal has been authorized. Any Armed Forces Expeditionary medal or campaign badge, including El Salvador, Lebanon, Grenada, Panama, Southwest Asia, Somalia, and Haiti, qualifies for preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormguy80 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 are you sure about that? I called the HR office after reading about this issue on the other thread and they confirmed that veterans who make gold, or the top group, do indeed block others from getting a chance of getting hired. NOT saying that they get a free pass into that group just for being a veteren just that if they make it into that group (on their own merit + any 5 point preference) they will pretty much get the job before anyone else. According to the person I spoke with its always been this way its just that now they won't even refer you to the hiring official if there are 3 or more vets since the vets will block the others in the gold group. Before recently they (the vets) would still block just that this wasn't as apparant as everyone else in gold would still get referred even though they weren't going to have a shot at getting the job if there were vets in that group. make sense? I hope I'm wrong but this is what I gleaned from my conversation with the guy. It was confusing to follow the exact details of what he was saying I"ll admit. They aren't "put ahead" of anyone else. They are given 5 pts for being honorably discharged and serving in a campaign...or they are given 10 pts if they are disabled. Both duly justified and warranted imo. These points are added to their overall score (if they pass first) and they are graded alongside everyone else. If they make the panel, it's because they are in the top group of qualified applicants....not just because they are veterans. 5-Point Preference Five points are added to the passing examination score or rating of a veteran who served: During a war; or During the period April 28, 1952 through July 1, 1955; or For more than 180 consecutive days, other than for training, any part of which occurred after January 31, 1955, and before October 15, 1976; or During the Gulf War from August 2, 1990, through January 2, 1992; or For more than 180 consecutive days, other than for training, any part of which occurred during the period beginning September 11, 2001, and ending on the date prescribed by Presidential proclamation or by law as the last day of Operation Iraqi Freedom; or In a campaign or expedition for which a campaign medal has been authorized. Any Armed Forces Expeditionary medal or campaign badge, including El Salvador, Lebanon, Grenada, Panama, Southwest Asia, Somalia, and Haiti, qualifies for preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isohume Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 are you sure about that? I called the HR office after reading about this issue on the other thread and they confirmed that veterans who make gold, or the top group, do indeed block others from getting a chance of getting hired. NOT saying that they get a free pass into that group just for being a veteren just that if they make it into that group (on their own merit + any 5 point preference) they will pretty much get the job before anyone else. According to the person I spoke with its always been this way its just that now they won't even refer you to the hiring official if there are 3 or more vets since the vets will block the others in the gold group. Before recently they (the vets) would still block just that this wasn't as apparant as everyone else in gold would still get referred even though they weren't going to have a shot at getting the job if there were vets in that group. make sense? I hope I'm wrong but this is what I gleaned from my conversation with the guy. It was confusing to follow the exact details of what he was saying I"ll admit. I've never heard of vets "blocking panels" just because three made it to the panel. Our union rep here at the office has never heard of it either. I've put many bids out the last few years and I've seen plenty of non/vets get those jobs and I'm a preference eligible vet. To me...the VP process seems to work like I described. Who really knows tho? I'd like to find out for sure and our union rep is looking into it for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wall_cloud Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 wasn't this discussion hashed out about a week ago? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isohume Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 wasn't this discussion hashed out about a week ago? Apparently not. The thing is...I don't think any of us knows what's going on for sure so there are no tidy endings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBUWX23 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 What if you are already in the SCEP program? What happens then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isohume Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 What if you are already in the SCEP program? What happens then? They are automatically transferred into the GTFO program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormguy80 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I'm just telling you what I was told. The guy I spoke to specifically used the word "blocking". I've never heard of vets "blocking panels" just because three made it to the panel. Our union rep here at the office has never heard of it either. I've put many bids out the last few years and I've seen plenty of non/vets get those jobs and I'm a preference eligible vet. To me...the VP process seems to work like I described. Who really knows tho? I'd like to find out for sure and our union rep is looking into it for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSUmetstud Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I've never heard of vets "blocking panels" just because three made it to the panel. Our union rep here at the office has never heard of it either. I've put many bids out the last few years and I've seen plenty of non/vets get those jobs and I'm a preference eligible vet. To me...the VP process seems to work like I described. Who really knows tho? I'd like to find out for sure and our union rep is looking into it for me. You're in the NWS already...it only applies to DE...not MAP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBUWX23 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 They are automatically transferred into the GTFO program. Do you know if the potential for non-competitive placement still holds afterwards or is that out the window with this? I am a SCEP (Graduate Student) and was just curious as I have not heard about this until reading the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isohume Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I'm just telling you what I was told. The guy I spoke to specifically used the word "blocking". That's fine and I believe you. I'm just saying what I've experienced. We could be talking about two different things I bet. You're in the NWS already...it only applies to DE...not MAP. I still get the 5 points added to my score and I always will for any federal job I bid on. I have no idea what this "blocking" thing is for the intern ranks. It could very well be in place I have no clue. I'd really like to see the unions response on this. You're right tho...I haven't seen the positions I apply for being blocked by vets. Do you know if the potential for non-competitive placement still holds afterwards or is that out the window with this? I am a SCEP (Graduate Student) and was just curious as I have not heard about this until reading the thread. I imagine it does. That was the contract you came in under and I think it would be illegal for them to change it...not to mention it'd be highly dishonorable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBUWX23 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I imagine it does. That was the contract you came in under and I think it would be illegal for them to change it...not to mention it'd be highly dishonorable. I appreciate your response.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blizznd Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 SBUWX23 We have two SCEP students who will graduate this spring....one as a senior and the other a grad student. I would hope they would be ok and get placed in a non-competitive slot like prior SCEPs, but to be honest our office just doesnt know. But being that many start getting placed in the Mar-Apr time period and that OPM was given time to convert to whatever new plan there will be, they might just sneek in. Now....we do have a SCEP who is a sophomore at Univ of North Dakota and wouldnt be at all suprised if he would have to compete. Simply NWS Offices just dont know anything yet. Good luck! Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Analog96 Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 They aren't "put ahead" of anyone else. They are given 5 pts for being honorably discharged and serving in a campaign...or they are given 10 pts if they are disabled. Both duly justified and warranted imo. These points are added to their overall score (if they pass first) and they are graded alongside everyone else. If they make the panel, it's because they are in the top group of qualified applicants....not just because they are veterans. 5-Point Preference Five points are added to the passing examination score or rating of a veteran who served: During a war; or During the period April 28, 1952 through July 1, 1955; or For more than 180 consecutive days, other than for training, any part of which occurred after January 31, 1955, and before October 15, 1976; or During the Gulf War from August 2, 1990, through January 2, 1992; or For more than 180 consecutive days, other than for training, any part of which occurred during the period beginning September 11, 2001, and ending on the date prescribed by Presidential proclamation or by law as the last day of Operation Iraqi Freedom; or In a campaign or expedition for which a campaign medal has been authorized. Any Armed Forces Expeditionary medal or campaign badge, including El Salvador, Lebanon, Grenada, Panama, Southwest Asia, Somalia, and Haiti, qualifies for preference. Don't you think they could get rid of the Korean War period now? There aren't too many 75-80 year olds applying for work now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBUWX23 Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 SBUWX23 We have two SCEP students who will graduate this spring....one as a senior and the other a grad student. I would hope they would be ok and get placed in a non-competitive slot like prior SCEPs, but to be honest our office just doesnt know. But being that many start getting placed in the Mar-Apr time period and that OPM was given time to convert to whatever new plan there will be, they might just sneek in. Now....we do have a SCEP who is a sophomore at Univ of North Dakota and wouldnt be at all suprised if he would have to compete. Simply NWS Offices just dont know anything yet. Good luck! Dan Thanks!, I have another year until I get my Master's so obviously things can change but it does seem unfair to have all the paperwork signed with it mentioned at the top and then they take that opportunity away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmichweather Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 here's the official stuff http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2010/12/27/executive-order-recruiting-and-hiring-students-and-recent-graduates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmichweather Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 well i guess there wont be a national recruitment for scep this year i guess as soon as the presidential decree came out the program was essentially terminated for any more recruitment. I guess i can't apply for a scep this year http://www.crh.noaa.gov/lsx/?n=studentindex The Student Education Employment Program (SCEP). By Executive Order 13562 on December 27 2010 the Student Career Experience Program (SCEP Program) has been abolished. The SCEP program will eventually be replaced by a new Internship Program. Details on the new Internship program have not been presented to Central Region Headquarters or local National Weather Service Offices. We have no time table as to when the new Internship Program will take effect. However as soon as we receive new information about this program we will present this information on this website Continue to visit this website for further details concerning the new Internship Program. The SCEP program served a number of federal agencies during its 16 years of existence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MN Transplant Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Thought of this thread while I was reading the December BAMS. The article by Seguin and Smith notes that 85% of all SCEP students became full-time permanent NWS employees, and SCEP students filled about 1/3 of all available entry-level positions (2005-2009). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocoAko Posted February 23, 2011 Author Share Posted February 23, 2011 For what its worth, and I can't seem to find a link about this, but while I was at the AMS Student Conference a few weeks back a NWS Meteorologist mentioned how the SCEP Program had been canceled but that as of that morning it was reinstated, at least for NOAA. So perhaps it is still "on"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MN Transplant Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 well i guess there wont be a national recruitment for scep this year i guess as soon as the presidential decree came out the program was essentially terminated for any more recruitment. I guess i can't apply for a scep this year http://www.crh.noaa....?n=studentindex The Student Education Employment Program (SCEP). By Executive Order 13562 on December 27 2010 the Student Career Experience Program (SCEP Program) has been abolished. The SCEP program will eventually be replaced by a new Internship Program. Details on the new Internship program have not been presented to Central Region Headquarters or local National Weather Service Offices. We have no time table as to when the new Internship Program will take effect. However as soon as we receive new information about this program we will present this information on this website Continue to visit this website for further details concerning the new Internship Program. The SCEP program served a number of federal agencies during its 16 years of existence. Student Education Employment Program (SCEP) ( NEW - Updated - January 22 2011) The Student Education Employment Program (SCEP).will continue for one additional year - 2011 (FY11). Earlier today we have received word from Central Region Headquarters (CRH) that the SCEP program will continue through 2011. On December 27 2010 by Executive Order 13562 the Student Career Experience Program (SCEP Program) was terminated. However, this has changed as of today January 22, 2011. The SCEP program will continue through 2011. The SCEP program will eventually be replaced by a new Internship Program. CRH is currently reviewing the current SCEP committment (salary projections, graduations etc) to determine how many new SCEPs they will bring on board in light of the reduced funding for the NWS program. Details on the new Internship program have not been presented to Central Region Headquarters or local National Weather Service Offices. However as soon as we receive new information about this program we will present this information on this website If you are interested in the SCEP program, please visit with your professor at your meteorology department to complete the paper work in the packet that they received on Janaury 19 2011. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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