Allsnow Posted Monday at 02:45 PM Share Posted Monday at 02:45 PM 2 minutes ago, psv88 said: Wasn’t it supposed to be very cold this week? Looks average at best now The cold modified as we got closer we done 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian5671 Posted Monday at 02:58 PM Share Posted Monday at 02:58 PM Snow cover going here after yesterdays 41 degrees and rest will go this week with temps in the 30's and sun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1220 Posted Monday at 03:03 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:03 PM 58 minutes ago, Allsnow said: Brutal… NYC going to finish below 10 inches this season which will be the 3rd winter in a row. The 4+ streak will definitely go into next winter Can’t say that definitively because maybe we can squeeze a half decent event in like 2/28/23 which was 4-6” for much of the area but not looking good. We sunk all the way down to a Richmond/Tidewater VA snow climate without larger KU events. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The 4 Seasons Posted Monday at 03:04 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:04 PM 5 minutes ago, Brian5671 said: Snow cover going here after yesterdays 41 degrees and rest will go this week with temps in the 30's and sun what in the world does no access to PR/OT mean? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1220 Posted Monday at 03:09 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:09 PM 9 minutes ago, Brian5671 said: Snow cover going here after yesterdays 41 degrees and rest will go this week with temps in the 30's and sun Patchy down here in places with full sun, on the south shore where full sun there’s little left. It’s nice to have the snow cover for the days we have and it definitely helped temps get down to the single digits overnight. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1220 Posted Monday at 03:10 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:10 PM 5 minutes ago, The 4 Seasons said: what in the world does no access to PR/OT mean? No access to our OT forum which is a complete cesspool so it’s for the best. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The 4 Seasons Posted Monday at 03:11 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:11 PM 1 minute ago, jm1220 said: No access to our OT forum which is a complete cesspool so it’s for the best. oh ok..and OT means? and PR im guessing is politics and religion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormlover74 Posted Monday at 03:15 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:15 PM 3 minutes ago, The 4 Seasons said: oh ok..and OT means? and PR im guessing is politics and religion? There is no more PR. OT is off topic and everything but weather 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted Monday at 03:15 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:15 PM 1 hour ago, EastonSN+ said: This could have actually happened in the past too thinking about it. How many times have they changed the measurement in and out of shade over the past 100 plus years. They did a great job with quality control at Central Park while the NWS was still at 30 Rock into early 1993. The new ASOS was established around 1995 when the NWS was already out at Upton. So the deep shade issues artificially cooling the site didn’t emerge until the 1990s. The site was always open exposure like every other climate station before then. So the temperature and snowfall measurements were always very reliable before the NWS left NYC and they made sure that the there was a proper siting for the sensors. You can see how a spot like New Brunswick doesn’t have the sensors underneath the trees. But in a open clearing like the guidelines specify. 1920 2021 New Brunswick proper siting 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibertyBell Posted Monday at 03:36 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:36 PM 15 hours ago, TheClimateChanger said: That’s the current steam flow map. I didn’t realize how dry it’s been in the Pacific Northwest, as well. Lots of streams at record low flow for today’s date. Isn’t it usually wet up there during La Niñas? yes, and very little snow in Alaska too....including the panhandle, where it usually snows A LOT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibertyBell Posted Monday at 03:38 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:38 PM 21 minutes ago, bluewave said: They did a great job with quality control at Central Park while the NWS was still at 30 Rock into early 1993. The new ASOS was established around 1995 when the NWS was already out at Upton. So the deep shade issues artificially cooling the site didn’t emerge until the 1990s. The site was always open exposure like every other climate station before then. So the temperature and snowfall measurements were always very reliable before the NWS left NYC and they made sure that the there was a proper siting for the sensors. 1920 2021 Summer 1993 and Winter 1993-94 were some of the most historically important temperature measurements ever there, as it was historically hot and then historically cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibertyBell Posted Monday at 03:39 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:39 PM 29 minutes ago, jm1220 said: Patchy down here in places with full sun, on the south shore where full sun there’s little left. It’s nice to have the snow cover for the days we have and it definitely helped temps get down to the single digits overnight. there's plenty of snowcover on the south shore in shady areas though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPizz Posted Monday at 04:26 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:26 PM 2 hours ago, Allsnow said: -3.8 for January isn’t cold? That’s pretty legit and less than 30 miles away it is closer to -6+. He's lost his marbles. The lower 48 is having it's coldest January in 37 years. But NYC and places NE of there are only -3 it isn't cold. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPizz Posted Monday at 04:27 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:27 PM 2 hours ago, SACRUS said: Just a bit inland Jan dep through the 26th: DOV: -6.7 ACY: -5.7 TTN: -5.7 PHL: -4.9 BLM: -3.9 Warm!! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allsnow Posted Monday at 04:28 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:28 PM 1 minute ago, FPizz said: and less than 30 miles away it is closer to -6+. He's lost his marbles. The lower 48 is having it's coldest January in 37 years. But NYC and places NE of there are only -3 it isn't cold. I can’t get behind the Great Lakes argument 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian5671 Posted Monday at 04:30 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:30 PM 1 minute ago, Allsnow said: I can’t get behind the Great Lakes argument I can see it. Think of how cold it would have been if the Lakes were colder/more frozen than years ago. Also Hudson's bay freezes a few weeks later than it did 50 yrs ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allsnow Posted Monday at 04:33 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:33 PM 2 minutes ago, Brian5671 said: I can see it. Think of how cold it would have been if the Lakes were colder/more frozen than years ago. Also Hudson's bay freezes a few weeks later than it did 50 yrs ago. A few degrees warmer and Hudson Bay freeze one week later isn’t going to make that big of a difference 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian5671 Posted Monday at 04:53 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:53 PM 18 minutes ago, Allsnow said: A few degrees warmer and Hudson Bay freeze one week later isn’t going to make that big of a difference No but it modifies airmasses coming from the NW (The great lakes) and then over our area. Sensible weather would not have been that much different-maybe a couple degrees colder if the same pattern happened in 1985. The warmth in Maine is more from the -NAO blocking this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allsnow Posted Monday at 04:55 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:55 PM Just now, Brian5671 said: No but it modifies airmasses coming from the NW (The great lakes) and then over our area. Sensible weather would not have been that much different-maybe a couple degrees colder if the same pattern happened in 1985. The warmth in Maine is more from the -NAO blocking this year. The coldest departures to our sw was 100% from the flow around the block. It had nothing to do with Hudson Bay time do freeze or the Great Lakes 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian5671 Posted Monday at 04:57 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:57 PM 1 minute ago, Allsnow said: The coldest departures to our sw was 100% from the flow around the block. It had nothing to do with Hudson Bay time do freeze or the Great Lakes I get that. I'm talking more in a general sense-background state etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted Monday at 04:58 PM Share Posted Monday at 04:58 PM 27 minutes ago, Allsnow said: A few degrees warmer and Hudson Bay freeze one week later isn’t going to make that big of a difference The reason for the delayed freeze-up on Hudson Bay plus the warmer lakes with less ice this winter is due to the lack of cold up in Canada. So the Northeast being closest to these influences muted the cold here this winter. In the old days Canada and the Northeast would have been much colder. A 7 station -2.6° average against the warmest 30 year climate normals would have been a run of the mill colder January before the 2020s. Same story as recent years with the coldest departures missing to our south and west. Canada warmth especially Hudson Bay and areas east January 2025 December 2024 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WX-PA Posted Monday at 05:17 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:17 PM 17 minutes ago, bluewave said: The reason for the delayed freeze-up on Hudson Bay plus the warmer lakes with less ice this winter is due to the lack of cold up in Canada. So the Northeast being closest to these influences muted the cold here this winter. In the old days Canada and the Northeast would have been much colder. A 7 station -2.6° average against the warmest 30 year climate normals would have been a run of the mill colder January before the 2020s. Same story as recent years with the coldest departures missing to our south and west. Canada warmth especially Hudson Bay and areas east January 2025 December 2024 It's been really below normal since Thanksgiving..January has been really cold. Very few people saw this in November. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WX-PA Posted Monday at 05:19 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:19 PM 51 minutes ago, FPizz said: Warm!! It's been cold coast to coast in January. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rjay Posted Monday at 05:24 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:24 PM 2 hours ago, jm1220 said: No access to our OT forum which is a complete cesspool so it’s for the best. Pin this somewhere 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rjay Posted Monday at 05:29 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:29 PM Deep winter near ISP 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkyfork Posted Monday at 05:35 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:35 PM 16 minutes ago, WX-PA said: It's been cold coast to coast in January. at the expense of most of the rest of the northern hemisphere 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkyfork Posted Monday at 05:37 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:37 PM meanwhile in the past Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Star Posted Monday at 05:39 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:39 PM 1 hour ago, Allsnow said: I can’t get behind the Great Lakes argument There is insufficient research to prove it. It would be nearly impossible to gather enough data of enough different scenarios to come even close to thinking that the Great Lakes would have any affect on NYC. I could see maybe a degree, but any more than that would be purely speculative. And why would the Great Lakes "effect" have more impact on night time temperatures than daytime temperatures? How can they have much of an effect more than 400 mile away? More than warming resulting from downslope over the Appalachians, wind preventing radiational cooling. heat island effects, other weather factors, such as where the core of the cold air entered the US? Again, there may be an effect, but not even close to any of the ones I mentioned, and most likely improbable to isolate and quantitate. Snow cover, besides providing a cold and reflective surface, provides a less frictional surface, allowing cold air to travel farther and become less moderated. So yes, a large water body can also have an effect, but again, not to that extent. And again, you get into the debate over a source of cold air coming directly down eastern Canada through the Hudson Valley. Not only is it direct cold air, but it will freeze Hudson Bay in a hurry. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rjay Posted Monday at 05:40 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:40 PM Some of you guys seems to be hung up on the negative departures. I'm not trying to downplay a below average (temp) winter. Those have become rare around here recently. But let's keep perspective here. Our normals are the warmest they've ever been. So a -3 departure while below normal, isn't frigid. It's definitely cold, well, bc it's winter. To our south and west the -5 to -10 departures are definitely cold in regards to a 30 year average from any decade in our past. Now if it were +3, well that's definitely warm bc our normals are so warm. I hope you guys understand what I'm getting at. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rjay Posted Monday at 05:44 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:44 PM 6 minutes ago, forkyfork said: meanwhile in the past Does this map use normals from the 70s or today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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