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NYC/PHL Dec 26-27 Potential - Part 7


am19psu

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I know that this has been said before, but what continues to defy me, is that it is now highly probable, and almost guaranteed that we will get a MLLER A type storm of this magnitude in a MOD/STRONG LA NINA.. It has not been done, ever, has it? The circumstances around this event alone will be one for the history books.. With this level of immense blocking that we have had in place over this last few weeks, it proves that ENSO cannot defy storms like this from developing if the conditions are ripe.

I for one, am stoked, and in complete awe of this situation.

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So, who's stoked? The UVV's and frontogenic forcing being modeled are extremely impressive. Somebody is going to get absolutely buried. This will be our first real shot at a legit blizzard in a while. A 980's or lower mb low deepening rapidly just off the coast. Many memories coming up in the next two days.

I haven't been this excited in a very long time! :snowman:

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Looking at that radar blossoming over TN/KY makes me wonder if that is the deformation band forming, if so I like the trajectory for that band for big snow west. This storm looks very potent already with current obs!

yea your right this storm is starting to get its act together and quick i wouldne be surprised to see this storm overperform even as forecasted now. i think 20+ inches on long island is going to be a pretty safe bet if that deformation band sets up over us

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I know that this has been said before, but what continues to defy me, is that it is now highly probable, and almost guaranteed that we will get a MLLER A type storm of this magnitude in a MOD/STRONG LA NINA.. It has not been done, ever, has it? The circumstances around this event alone will be one for the history books.. With this level of immense blocking that we have had in place over this last few weeks, it proves that ENSO cannot defy storms like this from developing if the conditions are ripe.

I for one, am stoked, and in complete awe of this situation.

according to popular ideology the world has been around for millions of years....we have 100 years of sampling of which 7 have been strong Nina's.....im sre it had been done before, many many times.

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according to popular ideology the world has been around for millions of years....we have 100 years of sampling of which 7 have been strong Nina's.....im sre it had been done before, many many times.

+1

Our understanding of what has and has never happened is limited to a nanoscopic slice of evolutionary time!

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according to popular ideology the world has been around for millions of years....we have 100 years of sampling of which 7 have been strong Nina's.....im sre it had been done before, many many times.

LOL, when you put it like that, then yeah, I am sure it has been done before..You get my point though, but relatively speaking, the odds are very much stacked against it based on the data that we have, and the fact that we have this storm to look forward to, is pretty cool. wink.gif

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according to popular ideology the world has been around for millions of years....we have 100 years of sampling of which 7 have been strong Nina's.....im sre it had been done before, many many times.

Exactly.....if we could go back in time we might find that there were bigger and more numerous storms in Nina years. Those claiming that they have it nailed because of a certain ENSO state are simply not thinking like a scientist, or they have another agenda.

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baroclinic instability put it better than I could on twitter:

"The phase is complete, the Gulf of Mexico is in play, it is lights out East Coast. A true Miller A classic Noreaster."

Get ready dudes. It has been a very long time since I have been this excited about a snowstorm.

Indeed. Enjoy guys! May the snow gods bless all of you!:weight_lift::snowman:

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PROBABILISTIC HEAVY SNOW AND ICING DISCUSSION

NWS HYDROMETEOROLOGICAL PREDICTION CENTER CAMP SPRINGS MD

520 PM EST SAT DEC 25 2010

VALID 00Z SUN DEC 26 2010 - 00Z WED DEC 29 2010

DAYS 1-3...

...SOUTHEAST/MID ATLANTIC/NORTHEAST...

MODELS ARE CONVERGING ON A CYCLONE TRACK FOR A LOW FORECAST TO

DEVELOP OFF THE SOUTHEAST COAST TONIGHT AND RAPIDLY INTENSITY

SUNDAY/SUNDAY EVENING OFF THE MID ATLANTIC/LONG ISLAND/NEW ENGLAND

COAST. EVERY OPERATIONAL MODEL SOLUTION RESULTS IN A HEAVY SNOW

FORECAST ACROSS THE MID ATLANTIC AND NORTHEAST...WITH

PROBABILITIES INCREASING FOR AN AXIS OF 1-2 FEET OF SNOW TO OCCUR.

THE METRO AREAS FROM NEW YORK TO BOSTON AND PORTLAND MAINE HAVE

THE HIGHEST PROBABILITY OF HEAVY SNOW/HEAVIEST FORECAST

ACCUMULATIONS...AND THE HIGHEST RESULTANT IMPACT. WASHINGTON DC

AND PHILADELPHIA INTO INTERIOR NY/VT/NH ARE IN A TIGHT QPF

GRADIENT WHERE SLIGHT ADJUSTMENTS IN THE CYCLONE TRACK AND

RESULTANT PLACEMENT OF THE MID LEVEL FRONTOGENESIS AXIS WILL HAVE

A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON THE ACCUMULATIONS.

A WELL DEFINED AXIS OF 850-500 MB FRONTOGENESIS AND DEFORMATION

AXIS SUPPORTS THE SNOW RAPIDLY INCREASING WITHIN A BAND WITHIN AN

AREA OF STRONG 700 MB THETA-E ADVECTION AND CONVERGENCE IN ADVANCE

OF THE LOW OVER THE MID ATLANTIC STATES SUNDAY INTO NEW

YORK/SOUTHERN NEW ENGLAND SUNDAY AFTERNOON...CONTINUING UP INTO

MAINE SUNDAY NIGHT.

THE PERIOD OF MOST RAPID DEEPENING SUNDAY AFTERNOON AND EVENING

FAVORS THE DEVELOPMENT OF A BAND OF INTENSE 1-2 INCH PER HOUR

SNOWFALL RATES IN NY/LONG ISLAND INTO SOUTHERN NEW ENGLAND...WITH

PEAK FRONTOGENESIS SHOWN IN THE 18Z NAM/GFS ACROSS LONG ISLAND TO

SOUTHEAST NEW ENGLAND DURING THIS PERIOD. THE MODEL CONSENSUS

SHOWS A CHANGE OVER FROM SNOW TO RAIN OVER CAPE COD MA AND THE

ISLANDS...KEEPING POTENTIALS NOW AMOUNTS LOWER THERE. THIS IS

ALSO THE CASE FOR EASTERN NC...WITH THE 850 MB LOW TRACK ONSHORE

OVERNIGHT TO 12Z SUN SUGGESTING THE CHANGEOVER TO SNOW OCCURS ONCE

THE LOW PASSES IN FAR EASTERN NC/COASTAL SOUNDS...WITH SUSTAINED

SNOW FURTHER NORTH IN CENTRAL NC AND SOUTHEAST VA ABOUT A DEGREE

TO THE LEFT OF THE 850 MB LOW TRACK.

THE MANUAL GRAPHICS USED A BLEND OF THE 12Z NAM/00-12Z ECMWF/12Z

ECMWF ENSEMBLE MEAN/12Z CANADIAN REGIONAL GEM/12Z UKMET QPFS AND

THERMAL PROFILES FOR THE SNOWFALL TOTALS

ACROSS THE EASTERN US. THE 12Z GFS HAD THE HIGHEST TOTAL

PRECIPITATION DUE TO BOTH MORE RAPID DEEPENING THAN OTHER

SOLUTIONS AND A SLIGHTLY SLOWER/FURTHER WEST LOW TRACK.

THE 12Z GEFS MEAN AND 18Z GFS ARE MUCH LOWER THAN THE OPERATIONAL

12Z GFS QPF ACROSS NJ...AND IN BETTER AGREEMENT WITH THE DOMINANT

MODEL/09-15Z SREF MEAN CLUSTER.

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baroclinic instability put it better than I could on twitter:

"The phase is complete, the Gulf of Mexico is in play, it is lights out East Coast. A true Miller A classic Noreaster."

Get ready dudes. It has been a very long time since I have been this excited about a snowstorm.

That guy was right on the money throughout this entire event!

And I am absolutely ready. That WV loop is absolutely staggering and beautiful. It's amazing how well you can see everything taking place.

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I know that this has been said before, but what continues to defy me, is that it is now highly probable, and almost guaranteed that we will get a MLLER A type storm of this magnitude in a MOD/STRONG LA NINA.. It has not been done, ever, has it? The circumstances around this event alone will be one for the history books.. With this level of immense blocking that we have had in place over this last few weeks, it proves that ENSO cannot defy storms like this from developing if the conditions are ripe.

I for one, am stoked, and in complete awe of this situation.

Yeah this storm is definitely going down in the history books for many reasons. Obviously its sheer intensity and very heavy snow amounts alone are looking like they will be historic, and combine that with the fact that this is in a moderate/strong La Nina as well as the amazing shift in the models so late in the game, and you have yourself quite a memorable and unprecedented storm. Take Philly, for instance: it's only had one 10+ inch storm in a moderate/strong La Nina, and it was all the way back in 1909!

This is going to be so much fun to track over the next two days; I can't wait. :thumbsup:

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Exactly.....if we could go back in time we might find that there were bigger and more numerous storms in Nina years. Those claiming that they have it nailed because of a certain ENSO state are simply not thinking like a scientist, or they have another agenda.

Very true, I am sure.. I guess, my point was that these types of set-ups are a rarity at the best of times, and to get a storm like this, when the 'statistics' were against it, makes it all the more special.

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baroclinic instability put it better than I could on twitter:

"The phase is complete, the Gulf of Mexico is in play, it is lights out East Coast. A true Miller A classic Noreaster."

Get ready dudes. It has been a very long time since I have been this excited about a snowstorm.

Goose and I were talking about this potential when it first appeared on the GFS at like hr 192....But Baroclinic nailed this sucker the other day....kudo's to him (and you)....

just have a feeling someone in the viewing area will pop in with 24-30". (i just know it wont be in SW Nassua Cty, its the snow hole of LI)..BUT the majority will be in 12-18" range.

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LOL, when you put it like that, then yeah, I am sure it has been done before..You get my point though, but relatively speaking, the odds are very much stacked against it based on the data that we have, and the fact that we have this storm to look forward to, is pretty cool. wink.gif

if you want to discuss modern times, then yes, it hasnt ever happened. Maybe the jets do have a chance to win the SB.....but i digress...

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Goose and I were talking about this potential when it first appeared on the GFS at like hr 192....But Baroclinic nailed this sucker the other day....kudo's to him (and you)....

just have a feeling someone in the viewing area will pop in with 24-30". (i just know it wont be in SW Nassua Cty, its the snow hole of LI)..BUT the majority will be in 12-18" range.

Maybe, just maybe SW Nassau county will make up for al lthose missed moments.

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Maybe, just maybe SW Nassau county will make up for al lthose missed moments.

SW Nassau really does seem to get less snow in many events, even JFK...you'll also notice that the thundersnow in many of the bigger events tends to miss these areas and setup more over LGA/EWR/NYC for whatever reason...I know in the 96 blizzard that only 15-18 inches generally fell in that region.

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