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Best spot for snow vacation home within 4 hours of NOVA


SnowenOutThere
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My dad tasked me with figuring out the best snowfall spot within 4 hours of Nova for a potential vacation home and figured this was the best place to ask! Requirements are high snowfall (he’s a weenie too) some sort of summer activity and within like 45 minutes of a ski resort. Already figured someplace like deep creek or seven springs would be good for this but any thoughts are appreciated. Ik some posters do have houses out there so lmk what you think. 

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I’ve been weighing doing this for years and think Canaan and Deep Creek are probably the best two spots. You could probably find some secluded mountain cabin in West Virginia if you want to really rough it, but I kinda like knowing a plow is coming.

I keep glancing at real estate out in those parts. Maybe one day I’ll pull the trigger and we can have an AmWx snow retreat.

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If you are solely looking for the most snow in the area, Snowshoe or Canaan would be that - I think both average about 150” a year.  I spent my 30th birthday at Snowshoe (first and only time I’ve been there) and I enjoyed the village aspect of that a lot.  Personally, I wouldn’t want a house there given the drive and lack of activities in the summer but it is very nice.   Of the two, I would pick Canaan given the snowfall, WV state parks nearby, easier drive, and towns of Davis/Thomas.  

While Wisp/Deep Creek gets less snow (averages 110” in McHenry), we chose to buy a place here back in 2016 because it checked off the most boxes for us - high snowfall, year round activities, 3 hour drive, and a lake.  It really is nice being here in the summer when it’s upper 70s with a lake to enjoy.  We intended to rent this out but immediately found that we loved coming out here too much to rent it out.  So we just use it for ourselves and host family/friends.   

I wouldn’t pick the PA ski resorts personally given the snowfall differences compared to western MD/WV.  

YMMV, happy researching!

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1 minute ago, nj2va said:

If you are solely looking for the most snow in the area, Snowshoe or Canaan would be that - I think both average about 150” a year.  I spent my 30th birthday at Snowshoe (first and only time I’ve been there) and I enjoyed the village aspect of that a lot.  Personally, I wouldn’t want a house there given the drive and lack of activities in the summer but it is very nice.   Of the two, I would pick Canaan given the snowfall, WV state parks nearby, easier drive, and towns of Davis/Thomas.  

While Wisp/Deep Creek gets less snow (averages 110” in McHenry), we chose to buy a place here back in 2016 because it checked off the most boxes for us - high snowfall, year round activities, 3 hour drive, and a lake.  We intended to rent this out but immediately found that we loved coming out here too much to rent it out.  So we just use it for ourselves and host family/friends.   

I wouldn’t pick the PA ski resorts personally given the snowfall differences compared to western MD/WV.  

YMMV, happy researching!

Good research, and useful for when I retire and buy a place in the mountains.

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If you decide to build at Deep Creek, recognize that it’s a 3 year process that is difficult to expedite under almost any circumstances.  The contractors here are a very tight and closed network, and care more about steady work than starting or finishing anything on time.  And there is an acute labor shortage here unlike anything you have observed in the city or suburbs/exurbs.  Anything already finished and for sale usually will require significant renovations, especially if it was previously rented, and often carry significant price premiums making new construction appear competitive (until you actually try and build something).

We bought our lot in summer 2020, and had provisional occupancy (read: unfinished) in Summer of 2021.  I was an active participant in construction and did about 40% of the work myself and subcontracted as much as I could.  That said, there are still significant areas of my project that remain unfinished to this day which I think is typical for up here.  The pace of work has slowed considerably, mostly just due to demands on my time and the fatigue of a multi year build.  I still think many who I talk to would argue my outcome is on the better side of average balancing what I have invested and what we’ve managed to get finished thus far.

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4 hours ago, RIC_WX said:

If you decide to build at Deep Creek, recognize that it’s a 3 year process that is difficult to expedite under almost any circumstances.  The contractors here are a very tight and closed network, and care more about steady work than starting or finishing anything on time.  And there is an acute labor shortage here unlike anything you have observed in the city or suburbs/exurbs.  Anything already finished and for sale usually will require significant renovations, especially if it was previously rented, and often carry significant price premiums making new construction appear competitive (until you actually try and build something).

We bought our lot in summer 2020, and had provisional occupancy (read: unfinished) in Summer of 2021.  I was an active participant in construction and did about 40% of the work myself and subcontracted as much as I could.  That said, there are still significant areas of my project that remain unfinished to this day which I think is typical for up here.  The pace of work has slowed considerably, mostly just due to demands on my time and the fatigue of a multi year build.  I still think many who I talk to would argue my outcome is on the better side of average balancing what I have invested and what we’ve managed to get finished thus far.

We need to meet up and compare notes! I started a ~2000sqft addition this fall and so far things are progressing. Rough electrical/plumbing is in, hvac starting this month. Having issues with framer but rest of the subs so far are decent, and have actually shown up! I've been fortunate that a local in my cove has put me in contact with several people, who probably would have never answered the phone if it wasn't for him. 

I agree with everything that has been posted. My recommendation would be to rent a condo/house in all the locations mentioned, both during winter and summer. We rented a couple of places in Western MD before deciding to look for real estate. Drive the roads, figure out how easy it is to get around. Resort areas are filled with rentals, and renters are usually loud and obnoxious. Our priority was lake access, walkable roads, and low amount of nearby rentals. 

Snowshoe has the best elevation, largest skiing, but outside the resort area is pretty isolated. Not sure what you can do there other than hiking during summer. 

Canaan/Timberline are probably second in terms of skiing, and do have Davis/Thomas close by with restaurants/things to do. 

Deep Creek is true four seasons with the lake activities in the summer. Even if you buy a place not near the lake, the state park has beach access and a boat ramp. There is a mix of dining options from pub/bar to white table cloth fine dining. Wisp is an okay resort. Definitely geared towards beginners. Timberline is 60 minutes away for more vertical / better snowmaking. We have passes to Wisp but drove to Timberline last year because I was fed up with the broken infrastructure at Wisp (Snowmaking system is old, water pipes were breaking all winter). 

What RIC_WX said is probably true in any of the resort areas right now. Most contractors are busy building 15 bedroom, indoor swimming pool, mega rental properties. Do your homework and don't overpay. Real estate in these areas went sky high during covid... Things are sitting on market longer but I haven't seen much reduction in pricing, yet. You are still competing with investors buying land/properties with the sole intent to maximize rental value. My gut says at some point the rental market will saturate and values will correct downward, but who knows when or if that will ever happen.

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My only problem with deep creek is traffic/people. It's personal though. I'm beyond burned out on rat race roads. However, if investment roi, 4 seasons, ease of access, and wide open recreational activities at your door is important, there are few better choices anywhere in the MA than Deep Creek. 

If it was my choice, WV all the way. I like driving country roads and don't care about distances so that is a serious consideration. With our property near sm mtn we are pretty out there. 10 miles for gas/diesel, 20mi for quick food, and 40-45mi for majors like wally/lowes. Running out "quick" isn't a thing and it won't be in WV either. But man, the peace and quiet and unspoiled beauty is so worth it if that's your jam. Only views from our property are forest and mountains. No houses or buildings. But there are tradeoffs with everything and no right or wrong. Just what makes the most sense based on your goals. My unspoiled view will cost me lots of diesel over the years lolol

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I'll agree with the above from @Bob Chill. Snowshoe is a wonderful place, but mostly remote. You have basically everything you'll need on the mountain or just down the road at the bottom, then... nothing lol. You have to drive to Elkins (about 50 miles) or Lewisburg (about 65 miles) to get to what most folks call civilization. Course Marlinton is 25 miles away, and there is stuff there (fast food/shopping) but not a lot. That said, there are still plenty of things to do all seasons there. Golf is right there, hiking and biking galore, and other fun stuff is within 15-20 miles. Cass RR and the Observatory are within 20 minutes, but not sure how often you'd want that lol. 

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2 hours ago, Bob Chill said:

My only problem with deep creek is traffic/people.

It's really only bad like that a handful of weeks a year, and very predictable.  Most of the time there is hardly anybody around.  Once away from the lake its even sparser.

But yes, on a 3 day holiday weekend in the summertime, you can't even get cell service.  And boy do the city dwellers get mad when they show up and can't find anywhere to charge up their toy cars.

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On 12/26/2023 at 5:55 PM, NorthArlington101 said:

I’ve been weighing doing this for years and think Canaan and Deep Creek are probably the best two spots. You could probably find some secluded mountain cabin in West Virginia if you want to really rough it, but I kinda like knowing a plow is coming.

I keep glancing at real estate out in those parts. Maybe one day I’ll pull the trigger and we can have an AmWx snow retreat.

Who needs a plow? Get that Jebman Shovel and DIG THAT SNOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I chose Garrett County area to move to permanently because (at least for now) I can work remotely and am obsessed with winter weather. Deep Creek has absolutely zero long term rentals so I ended up south, in Mountain Lake Park. I know you are looking to buy, but that's the real estate world here as prices literally doubled over Covid. A word of caution though - this is my second winter and TBH it has failed literally every expectation I had in terms of winter weather. My expectations, apparently, were wayyyyy too lofty. Almost without exception, the upslope events are 1-2, maybe 3 inches tops and then within a day or two, melts into a giant muddy mess and everything - everything - is just filthy from the road crap to the muddy yard. I know I haven't been here for very long but for you to invest that kind of money in a snow town, this pales in comparison to Davis/Canaan. I'm sure you follow the Davis 3SE weather report and he already has 37 or so inches. IMBY I have had a little over 15...and Wisp reports 19. The county could be drawn in half - the northern half are the million dollar vacation homes, the south (where I am) is small town America with much more reasonable housing prices. If you are in it for the snow, Davis/Canaan without a doubt. As others have said, if you yearn for activities, Deep Creek is it. 

The other area you might consider is Alpine Lake. I call it a poor man's Deep Creek just over the border in WV. Houses are half (or less) of Deep Creek/Davis areas and if I am going to end up staying here long term, that is most likely where I will buy to put down roots. Alpine Lake is mega quiet, however...more quiet than Davis/Canaan but as @Bob Chill wrote, I, too, am looking for quiet and solitude and that fits the bill for me personally. My guess is Alpine Lake gets 30% more snow on an annual basis than MBY as it is a bit higher and gets the first dose of the GL moisture.

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22 minutes ago, katabatic said:

I chose Garrett County area to move to permanently because (at least for now) I can work remotely and am obsessed with winter weather. Deep Creek has absolutely zero long term rentals so I ended up south, in Mountain Lake Park. I know you are looking to buy, but that's the real estate world here as prices literally doubled over Covid. A word of caution though - this is my second winter and TBH it has failed literally every expectation I had in terms of winter weather. My expectations, apparently, were wayyyyy too lofty. Almost without exception, the upslope events are 1-2, maybe 3 inches tops and then within a day or two, melts into a giant muddy mess and everything - everything - is just filthy from the road crap to the muddy yard. I know I haven't been here for very long but for you to invest that kind of money in a snow town, this pales in comparison to Davis/Canaan. I'm sure you follow the Davis 3SE weather report and he already has 37 or so inches. IMBY I have had a little over 15...and Wisp reports 19. The county could be drawn in half - the northern half are the million dollar vacation homes, the south (where I am) is small town America with much more reasonable housing prices. If you are in it for the snow, Davis/Canaan without a doubt. As others have said, if you yearn for activities, Deep Creek is it. 

The other area you might consider is Alpine Lake. I call it a poor man's Deep Creek just over the border in WV. Houses are half (or less) of Deep Creek/Davis areas and if I am going to end up staying here long term, that is most likely where I will buy to put down roots. Alpine Lake is mega quiet, however...more quiet than Davis/Canaan but as @Bob Chill wrote, I, too, am looking for quiet and solitude and that fits the bill for me personally. My guess is Alpine Lake gets 30% more snow on an annual basis than MBY as it is a bit higher and gets the first dose of the GL moisture.

Great post. I visited Deep Creek last year for my snow fix and it was really fun and nice. We loved it. So we looked at real estate prices, and I'm sorry, but those houses are waaaaaay overpriced. Even more stupidly priced than closer into the DMV area (which is high priced for valid reasons).

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2 minutes ago, Terpeast said:

Great post. I visited Deep Creek last year for my snow fix and it was really fun and nice. We loved it. So we looked at real estate prices, and I'm sorry, but those houses are waaaaaay overpriced. Even more stupidly priced than closer into the DMV area (which is high priced for valid reasons).

Exactly - they are midcity/downtown prices in McHenry/DCL without any business or industry to support it. It is exclusively DC and Pittsburgh money that comes in during the weekend and holidays.  Mountain Lake Park and Oakland might as well be on the other side of the moon as it relates to DCL. But, you can say that about most resort locales across the country.  I love it here overall, but since this post was about buying a home for a snow town, I was playing the pity party part. As a point of reference, in Alpine Lake, for $300,000, you can still get quite a bit of house. A small condo in McHenry starts at a half-million and since this is/will be my permanent home, I do not want to live beside an Airbnb. You can still Airbnb in Alpine Lake, but at least they are all single family homes and you won't hear the other person's toilet flush. 

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2 hours ago, Terpeast said:

Great post. I visited Deep Creek last year for my snow fix and it was really fun and nice. We loved it. So we looked at real estate prices, and I'm sorry, but those houses are waaaaaay overpriced. Even more stupidly priced than closer into the DMV area (which is high priced for valid reasons).

Not really overpriced.  I doubt I could sell my place for a whole lot more than what I put in it.  And this is not accounting for my sweat equity, which was substantial.  I did 100% of the HVAC, floorcovering, painting and trim installation, 50% of the drywall install and finishing, at least 50% of the electrical / plumbing rough in and finishing.  I rented heavy equipment and cleared 90% of the lot - because it was covid, because I had the time, because there was no one else to do it and I wanted it done!  The big outsourced projects were things like well and septic, roofing and gutters, exterior siding and soffits, etc.

Eventually, frustrated with our pace of progress my wife convinced me to outsource having a deck built around the cabin perimeter (like almost every other place up here has).  It cost $46K and took almost 9 months to complete.  No doubt this could have been completed for maybe 50%-70% of this cost in Leesburg and maybe taken a month.  Because there are contractors everywhere, there is immigrant labor, there are building materials available on demand, the weather is benign, makeup any excuse you want.

Go drive through basecamp, or even the comparatively cheaper properties irrespective if they have lake access or not.  There are empty lots everywhere ready to build.  Now ask the realtor trying to sell you these lots why.  They won't tell you.  Because if you heard the honest answer, most people would conclude they could never pull it off, because...most can't.  Either because they don't have the time, or the patience, or the capital, or the expertise, or whatever.  And that's why, when you find a property for sale, it appears overpriced.

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1 hour ago, RIC_WX said:

Not really overpriced.  I doubt I could sell my place for a whole lot more than what I put in it.  And this is not accounting for my sweat equity, which was substantial.  I did 100% of the HVAC, floorcovering, painting and trim installation, 50% of the drywall install and finishing, at least 50% of the electrical / plumbing rough in and finishing.  I rented heavy equipment and cleared 90% of the lot - because it was covid, because I had the time, because there was no one else to do it and I wanted it done!  The big outsourced projects were things like well and septic, roofing and gutters, exterior siding and soffits, etc.

Eventually, frustrated with our pace of progress my wife convinced me to outsource having a deck built around the cabin perimeter (like almost every other place up here has).  It cost $46K and took almost 9 months to complete.  No doubt this could have been completed for maybe 50%-70% of this cost in Leesburg and maybe taken a month.  Because there are contractors everywhere, there is immigrant labor, there are building materials available on demand, the weather is benign, makeup any excuse you want.

Go drive through basecamp, or even the comparatively cheaper properties irrespective if they have lake access or not.  There are empty lots everywhere ready to build.  Now ask the realtor trying to sell you these lots why.  They won't tell you.  Because if you heard the honest answer, most people would conclude they could never pull it off, because...most can't.  Either because they don't have the time, or the patience, or the capital, or the expertise, or whatever.  And that's why, when you find a property for sale, it appears overpriced.

Holy moly, $46k?  We replaced our existing wooden deck (that was part of the original build of the house in 2006) with a Trex deck this summer for ~$30k and it took 4 weeks to finish.  We used a local contractor that came recommended to us from other contractors we’ve used for projects on our house.

I think real estate is wildly overpriced here but its all driven by demand of the lake, Wisp, and four season activities.  As long as rental demand continues to be high, prices won’t budge much.  This is a pendulum so I do think eventually the market will saturate and/or a recession will hit that cuts back on second home/investment property activity and vacations.  Even with the improvements we’ve made, we’d still make a hefty profit from what we bought at in 2016 with how high prices have ballooned.  

And its not just here - even Canaan has seen prices rise dramatically since covid.

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36 minutes ago, nj2va said:

Holy moly, $46k?  We replaced our existing wooden deck (that was part of the original build of the house in 2006) with a Trex deck this summer for ~$30k and it took 4 weeks to finish.  We used a local contractor that came recommended to us from other contractors we’ve used for projects on our house.

I think real estate is wildly overpriced here but its all driven by demand of the lake, Wisp, and four season activities.  As long as rental demand continues to be high, prices won’t budge much.  This is a pendulum so I do think eventually the market will saturate and/or a recession will hit that cuts back on second home/investment property activity and vacations.  Even with the improvements we’ve made, we’d still make a hefty profit from what we bought at in 2016 with how high prices have ballooned.  

And its not just here - even Canaan has seen prices rise dramatically since covid.

Timing is everything.  House across from me sold in 2019 and he believes he can sell for 2x the 2019 price.  And I think once interest rates level off a bit he probably will.

Agreed the short term rental market is robust and definitely justifies the valuations.  Those $500K townhomes are examples of that.  I suspect plenty of homeowners there take 6-8 weekends a year, rent out as many of the rest as they can and still probably make money or at least break even.  
 

I did go for cable rail around my deck, including 2 full length staircases and admittedly that was expensive just for the materials.  I did not do Trex however and will have to refinish every couple summers I suspect.  With any luck the cable railing will survive the climate up here and look good for a long time.

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Anecdotal....

We have started the process to build our cabin on Meadow Mountain next to DCL.  We own the land already so it'll be build only.  Planning on a relatively modest A-frame at this point.  So far the process has been relatively painless. We have the concept and the architect has started work on construction drawings.  We are deciding between two builders at this point.  Goal is to begin construction in March and be completed by the holidays next year.  So far all guidance is that this is doable.

I'll build deadline penalties into the builder contract to keep them motivated, and we are doing everything with cash already on hand so maybe that helps too.  

So far we're being quoted around $220/sqft.  That's build only - like I said we already own the land.  Big variable will be cost to get electric from the nearest pole to the POE.  

 

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On 12/26/2023 at 7:28 PM, RIC_WX said:

If you decide to build at Deep Creek, recognize that it’s a 3 year process that is difficult to expedite under almost any circumstances.  The contractors here are a very tight and closed network, and care more about steady work than starting or finishing anything on time.  And there is an acute labor shortage here unlike anything you have observed in the city or suburbs/exurbs.  Anything already finished and for sale usually will require significant renovations, especially if it was previously rented, and often carry significant price premiums making new construction appear competitive (until you actually try and build something).

We bought our lot in summer 2020, and had provisional occupancy (read: unfinished) in Summer of 2021.  I was an active participant in construction and did about 40% of the work myself and subcontracted as much as I could.  That said, there are still significant areas of my project that remain unfinished to this day which I think is typical for up here.  The pace of work has slowed considerably, mostly just due to demands on my time and the fatigue of a multi year build.  I still think many who I talk to would argue my outcome is on the better side of average balancing what I have invested and what we’ve managed to get finished thus far.

Does anyone just buy a lot and plop down a pre-fab house?

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41 minutes ago, MN Transplant said:

Does anyone just buy a lot and plop down a pre-fab house?

It’s arguably what I did - pre cast superior wall foundation and ordered modular construction unfinished.  At the time, this was actually the fastest of the available alternatives.  It actually got a lot harder in 2021-22 because of the Covid and supply chain backlogs.  I finalized my design and order in September 2020 and the box sections were delivered in April of 2021.  People ordering a few weeks after me waited 12-24 months.

The problem is it still took 2 years to finish it and by the time it was all set up I was already a year in.

I suspect it could be easier today because of interest rates throttling some of the demand both for local labor and the factory built box sections.  But it’s pretty difficult to find contractors that want to work on any projects less than seven figures anymore.  At least here.

I learned a ton doing this and would do it again in a heartbeat, just not in a location quite so isolated as this.

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I’ve been weighing doing this for years and think Canaan and Deep Creek are probably the best two spots. You could probably find some secluded mountain cabin in West Virginia if you want to really rough it, but I kinda like knowing a plow is coming.

I keep glancing at real estate out in those parts. Maybe one day I’ll pull the trigger and we can have an AmWx snow retreat.

Canaan, Snowshoe and Deep Creek are your best bets. I’ve also explored/stayed at a few lesser known cabins on spruce knob just below its 4800 ft peak and it’s amazing there but even there it gets a bit of the snow shadow on the eastern side.

We chose not to go to canaan or deep creek because real estate is outrageous in both places and overpriced unless you’re a boomer sitting on a pile of cash (yes that’s a huge reason our housing market is wild right now)

A piece of me thinks I’ll still go Canaan someday but until then I’ll enjoy my 180 degree view of 3 states on 5 acres from 2000 feet, less than 2 hours from DC.

3cea6f000f83a476cb0d6c7564ca71c5.jpg
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2 hours ago, WeatherShak said:


Canaan, Snowshoe and Deep Creek are your best bets. I’ve also explored/stayed at a few lesser known cabins on spruce knob just below its 4800 ft peak and it’s amazing there but even there it gets a bit of the snow shadow on the eastern side.

We chose not to go to canaan or deep creek because real estate is outrageous in both places and overpriced unless you’re a boomer sitting on a pile of cash (yes that’s a huge reason our housing market is wild right now)

A piece of me thinks I’ll still go Canaan someday but until then I’ll enjoy my 180 degree view of 3 states on 5 acres from 2000 feet, less than 2 hours from DC.

3cea6f000f83a476cb0d6c7564ca71c5.jpg

Nice view! Where from?

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Nice view! Where from?

Thank you! Eastern Panhandle of West Virginia. Just outside Berkeley Springs. Looking east you can see the Potomac, Harper’s Ferry, WV, South Mountain in PA and Hagerstown.

We get enhanced snow here from coastal storms. We do rent from time to time if anyone wants a snowscape. Backs up to 20,000 acres of a wildlife management area with some great hiking.

http://www.LoveshakCabins.com

5ae05ab5d177df2fa56b04ff1b517de2.jpg
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19 minutes ago, WeatherShak said:


Thank you! Eastern Panhandle of West Virginia. Just outside Berkeley Springs. Looking east you can see the Potomac, Harper’s Ferry, WV, South Mountain in PA and Hagerstown.

We get enhanced snow here from coastal storms. We do rent from time to time if anyone wants a snowscape. Backs up to 20,000 acres of a wildlife management area with some great hiking.

http://www.LoveshakCabins.com

5ae05ab5d177df2fa56b04ff1b517de2.jpg

Just out of curiosity - did you buy the land and then build the cabin? Or was the cabin there?

And rental opportunity noted - seems like a great deal and a cool place if i need to flee west for snow-sanity reasons.

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On 12/26/2023 at 6:22 PM, SnowenOutThere said:

My dad tasked me with figuring out the best snowfall spot within 4 hours of Nova for a potential vacation home and figured this was the best place to ask! Requirements are high snowfall (he’s a weenie too) some sort of summer activity and within like 45 minutes of a ski resort. Already figured someplace like deep creek or seven springs would be good for this but any thoughts are appreciated. Ik some posters do have houses out there so lmk what you think. 

Definitely Canaan Valley area.  They get more snow than anywhere within 4 hours except maybe Snowshoe but you can't really buy there...the towns are in valleys and the resort itself is all corporate owned condos at the top.  The best place you can actually own a home would be Canaan Valley.  Somewhere near the two ski resorts there.

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Thank you! Eastern Panhandle of West Virginia. Just outside Berkeley Springs. Looking east you can see the Potomac, Harper’s Ferry, WV, South Mountain in PA and Hagerstown.

We get enhanced snow here from coastal storms. We do rent from time to time if anyone wants a snowscape. Backs up to 20,000 acres of a wildlife management area with some great hiking.

http://www.LoveshakCabins.com

5ae05ab5d177df2fa56b04ff1b517de2.jpg

I would just like to flag that my cabin is not available this weekend BECAUSE I WILL BE THERE!
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