Richmond Metro/Hampton Roads Area Discussion

[Conway7305]

LR snow maps are looking better 

[RIC Airport]

19 minutes ago, Conway7305 said:

LR snow maps are looking better 

Yup, and new hits popped up on the 12z EPS. Hopefully, these charts light up in the coming days. 

[Stormpc]

It's a very odd area down here. Southern Hampton Roads Northeast North carolina. I had between 8 and 9 inches of snow from that January event in 2022. Actually Shoveled the driveway. Stuck to the road and pavement very well. So it does snow here. And it can happen. I don't remember the last time DCA had 8 inches of snow during one event. Probably not since I moved out of that area in 2019. Very narrow stripe though. A good 6 inches was still prevalent down to Grandy but once south of Grandy (like a mile) there was basically nothing. Up to Moyock and into Chesapeake a few inches less as well. Most of the times during marginal events my neighborhood gets nothing while just a quarter mile inland can have a few inches. I got lucky or unlucky depending on how you look at it. A few times I've had nothing at my house while the front of the neighborhood, which is just a few hundred yards away, has had a dusting. I need the winds coming off the land. Any part of the Sound and I'm toast. 

[JFLETCHER]

30 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

Yup, and new hits popped up on the 12z EPS. Hopefully, these charts light up in the coming days. 

Today the LR looks good. Obviously, we don't want to take into account actual model runs, but primarily ensembles. Gotta say from Presidents Day through early March, I think we can score. What I would love is a good ole fashioned Miller A to come right up the coast and get us all in the action. Please no Miller Bs-they screw us 9 out of 10 times at our latitude unless the transfer happens in TN. I'm excited about this timeframe, just have to be patient.

[RIC Airport]

3 hours ago, Stormpc said:

It's a very odd area down here. Southern Hampton Roads Northeast North carolina. I had between 8 and 9 inches of snow from that January event in 2022. Actually Shoveled the driveway. Stuck to the road and pavement very well. So it does snow here. And it can happen. I don't remember the last time DCA had 8 inches of snow during one event. Probably not since I moved out of that area in 2019. Very narrow stripe though. A good 6 inches was still prevalent down to Grandy but once south of Grandy (like a mile) there was basically nothing. Up to Moyock and into Chesapeake a few inches less as well. Most of the times during marginal events my neighborhood gets nothing while just a quarter mile inland can have a few inches. I got lucky or unlucky depending on how you look at it. A few times I've had nothing at my house while the front of the neighborhood, which is just a few hundred yards away, has had a dusting. I need the winds coming off the land. Any part of the Sound and I'm toast. 

The winter of 2021-22 was frustrating, but there were numerous opportunities. I remember us tracking legit threats every week that were all happening on the weekends that January, from the 1/3/22 storm that trended too far north at the last minute to the two storms that tracked too far east barely giving coastal areas snow, but not enough in Richmond. Also, the 1/16/22 storm tracked up the Piedmont while we were in the upper teens to low 20s at the start but managed to reach the 50s six hours later. 

A couple maps I saved from that event. 

[RIC Airport]

21 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

The winter of 2021-22 was frustrating, but there were numerous opportunities. I remember us tracking legit threats every week that were all happening on the weekends that January, from the 1/3/22 storm that trended too far north at the last minute to the two the storms that tracked too far east barely giving coastal areas snow, but not enough in Richmond. Also, the 1/16/22 storm tracked up the Piedmont while we were in the upper teens to low 20s at the start but managed to reach the 50s six hours later. 

A couple maps I saved from that event. 

 

1/29/2014 is another SE VA/NE NC snowstorm that often gets overlooked, @Stormpc.

 

[RIC Airport]

3 hours ago, JFLETCHER said:

Today the LR looks good. Obviously, we don't want to take into account actual model runs, but primarily ensembles. Gotta say from Presidents Day through early March, I think we can score. What I would love is a good ole fashioned Miller A to come right up the coast and get us all in the action. Please no Miller Bs-they screw us 9 out of 10 times at our latitude unless the transfer happens in TN. I'm excited about this timeframe, just have to be patient.

I agree. I wish we could return to the old days when the Miller A's happened regularly. Another good scenario is a southern slider (some call it Miller C), like 12/9/2018, 2/16/2015, or 1/30/2010, where there is one moisture slug and no mixing issues. 

OTTOMH, the last Miller A's that worked out were 2/12/2014 and 3/1/2009. We are getting more hybrids now, like 1/23/2016. I also am okay with those that form off the SC/GA coast and move north, like 1/25/2000 or 2/16/1996.

[Stormpc]

10 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

1/29/2014 is another SE VA/NE NC snowstorm that often gets overlooked, @Stormpc.

 

That's another very tight gradient. I'm sure I was grieving that storm, missing it to my south. I still think we're going to have another good shot or two. Especially up where you are. Things are looking pretty good I must say. Possible suppressed pattern. Not bad for me. Not great for further north. Pretty rough to go from 7-8 inches in Williamsburg and barely an inch around richmond. That's tight.

[mikeeng92]

1/23/16, from what I remember we got pretty lucky in Richmond. Day 1 was a bust with plenty of sleet and mixing. Then on day 2 the wraparound over performed and put on an amazing show. 

[Stormpc]

7 minutes ago, mikeeng92 said:

1/23/16, from what I remember we got pretty lucky in Richmond. Day 1 was a bust with plenty of sleet and mixing. Then on day 2 the wraparound over performed and put on an amazing show. 

Yes you guys were killing it with the wrap around while places just east of DC and Baltimore could never get back in to the snow band. They got the initial thump then it hung out just to the west and snaked down through Richmond and Southern VA. I was lucky enough to be West enough to get back into that 2nd act of the storm which was awesome. Wind blown powder. Great day that was.

[RIC Airport]

1 hour ago, Stormpc said:

That's another very tight gradient. I'm sure I was grieving that storm, missing it to my south. I still think we're going to have another good shot or two. Especially up where you are. Things are looking pretty good I must say. Possible suppressed pattern. Not bad for me. Not great for further north. Pretty rough to go from 7-8 inches in Williamsburg and barely an inch around richmond. That's tight.

Yeah, and it happens more often than you'd think. Snowstorms like 1/4/2018, 1/29/2014, 12/26/2010, 12/26/2004, and 2/6/1980 where occasions where someone in Hampton Roads got 10-15"+, while RIC only got T-3".

Sometimes, we share, such as 1/7/2017, 2/26/2015, 1/3/2002 and 2/18/1989, where RIC gets 5-8", but Hampton Roads is in the bullseye.

1 hour ago, mikeeng92 said:

1/23/16, from what I remember we got pretty lucky in Richmond. Day 1 was a bust with plenty of sleet and mixing. Then on day 2 the wraparound over performed and put on an amazing show. 

Yeah, the coastal formed and stalled long enough, and the death band formed and stayed right along I-95. Part 1 was just light to moderate snow with the overrunning before we had precip-type issues. RIC still picked up 6.1" just from that, but it was far less than we were hoping for at the time, and having to wait on the low to crank up as the models indicated, was aggravating and almost suicidal, but it worked out. I was bracing for a repeat of 12/18/2009 or 2/16/2003, where we only got the initial and didn't get anything from the coastal like the models showed. 

1 hour ago, Stormpc said:

Yes you guys were killing it with the wrap around while places just east of DC and Baltimore could never get back in to the snow band. They got the initial thump then it hung out just to the west and snaked down through Richmond and Southern VA. I was lucky enough to be West enough to get back into that 2nd act of the storm which was awesome. Wind blown powder. Great day that was.

RIC missed reaching blizzard criteria because the one hour in the middle gusted to 32mph, not 35mph. We needed 3 consecutive hours of 35mph+.

*Year is wrong on the graphic.

[RIC Airport]

The 00z GFS has a storm for Valentine's Day. Plenty of time to watch, just happy to see storms popping up in the LR. 

[RIC Airport]

6z and 12z GFS were indeed less enjoyable than the 00z run. 6z GEFS had a handful of hits, and 12z GEFS even fewer. Everything at H5 still looks good toward the end, so hopefully, this was just a fluke run, and the EPS offers more hope. 

[RIC Airport]

Nothing notable, in terms of snowstorms at least, on the 12z EPS either. 

 

At the end of the run, we still have nice -NAO, -AO, and -EPO, a western ridge, and a split flow. There is also a nice vortex over SE Canada and lower highs in the 50/50 region, so it's hard to see why this "look" won't translate to a storm at some point, especially when all the teleconnections are where we want them to be.

 

[wasnow215]

18 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

Nothing notable, in terms of snowstorms at least, on the 12z EPS either. 

 

At the end of the run, we still have nice -NAO, -AO, and -EPO, a western ridge, and a split flow. There is also a nice vortex of SE Canada and lower highs in the 50/50 region, so it's hard to see why this "look" won't translate to a storm at some point, especially when all the teleconnections are where we want them to be.

 

I think there will be a ton of tracking starting a week from now and hopefully we cash in by President’s Day and beyond!

[RIC Airport]

The 00z GFS brought back a storm. This time, it's on 2/18. I'm sure there will continue to be fluctuations for at least the next 7 -10 days as we approach the next favorable "window" for snow. 

Posting the maps to keep hope alive, recognizing that 6z could take it away.

[Conway7305]

LR models look dry for the most part, hoping that will change in time.  Would hate to waste a good pattern change with no precip. 

[wasnow215]

1 hour ago, Conway7305 said:

LR models look dry for the most part, hoping that will change in time.  Would hate to waste a good pattern change with no precip. 

Shows some snow around the 16th ish. It’s gonna snow/ice. Conditions will be to ripe for it not to. 

[RIC Airport]

A few big hits on the 12Z GEFS on the 18th-19th.

[RIC Airport]

55 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

A few big hits on the 12Z GEFS on the 18th-19th.

People are floating around PD III because we had a KU on Presidents Day in 1979 and again in 2003. RIC recorded 10.9" from PD I, one of the coldest snowstorms in the period of record, rivaling the February 1899 Blizzard. Temperatures in Richmond during that snowstorm were only around 10°F. I would've loved to have been alive to experience it. 

Here are some photos I found of it. Does anyone recognize these areas?

 

Unfortunately, the 2003 storm (PD II) did not meet expectations for areas south of Fredericksburg, but it was still a very impactful event. I had the AKQ graphic saved for many years until an old hard drive crashed. The graphic had 14.2" for RIC. However, there was only about 3-5" across the RIC area because even though the surface temperatures were only around 20°F during the height of the event, precip was mainly in the form of IP. The storm came in 3 pieces over several days. It started as rain, then it was forecasted to turn to ZR/IP, and then +SN once the coastal got going. Instead, we got the IP/ZR as the colder air filtered in, then got dry slotted. Then, the coastal cranked too far north of us to reap the benefits, something that thankfully didn't happen in the 2016 storm. Perhaps, if and when there is a PD III, it'll be on par with PD I. 

[RIC Airport]

Still a great look at H5, but only a few minor hits on the EPS snow maps from about the 14th to the 19th. 

One thing that I am starting to get concerned about is the lack of true arctic air I'm seeing at the end of these ensemble runs, but perhaps with the right timing it can get "cold enough" if we get some good dynamics and a good storm track. 

[wasnow215]

42 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

People are floating around PD III because we had a KU on Presidents Day in 1979 and again in 2003. RIC recorded 10.9" from PD I, one of the coldest snowstorms in the period of record, rivaling the February 1899 Blizzard. Temperatures in Richmond during that snowstorm were only around 10°F. I would've loved to have been alive to experience it. 

Here are some photos I found of it. Does anyone recognize these areas?

 

Unfortunately, the 2003 storm (PD II) did not meet expectations for areas south of Fredericksburg, but it was still a very impactful event. I had the AKQ graphic saved for many years until an old hard drive crashed. The graphic had 14.2" for RIC. However, there was only about 3-5" across the RIC area because even though the surface temperatures were only around 20°F during the height of the event, precip was mainly in the form of IP. The storm came in 3 pieces over several days. It started as rain, then it was forecasted to turn to ZR/IP, and then +SN once the coastal got going. Instead, we got the IP/ZR as the colder air filtered in, then got dry slotted. Then, the coastal cranked too far north of us to reap the benefits, something that thankfully didn't happen in the 2016 storm. Perhaps, if and when there is a PD III, it'll be on par with PD I. 

Lived in Atlantic Co, NJ. Far enough inland it stayed all snow and had a foot and a half in 1979. Was in 5th grade and no school for a week. 
 

in 2003 was living in Cape May Co, NJ. Over 20”! Both storms amazing!!

[RIC Airport]

18Z GFS has a hybrid situation where snow turns to ice for President's Day. Then, somehow, as the coastal gets going, we lose the cold at the surface, and any ice turns to rain for everyone. 

This is at the end of the run, but bottom line there IS STILL a storm around that time. 

[Conway7305]

4 minutes ago, RIC Airport said:

18Z GFS has a hybrid situation where snow turns to ice for President's Day. Then, somehow, as the coastal gets going, we lose the cold at the surface, and any ice turns to rain for everyone. 

This is at the end of the run, but bottom line there IS a storm around that time. 

I wouldn’t be surprised if that LR storm fantasy storm turned into a bigger storm at mid range  or ushers in a bigger storm.  Sometime between the 18th-24th.  Upper level pattern screams storm. 

[Stormpc]

Going to be a busy week as we can see the transition now on the long range models becoming more consistent and stronger with each run. Might not get there by the 15th but certainly looks exciting after with possible Southern stream tracks which is probably good for most of us in this thread. Here is to a good week ahead with eyes on the long range. Love that Greenland block of all indices.

OT...You see what happened in Nova Scotia? 

[JB Fins]

18 hours ago, RIC Airport said:

People are floating around PD III because we had a KU on Presidents Day in 1979 and again in 2003. RIC recorded 10.9" from PD I, one of the coldest snowstorms in the period of record, rivaling the February 1899 Blizzard. Temperatures in Richmond during that snowstorm were only around 10°F. I would've loved to have been alive to experience it. 

Here are some photos I found of it. Does anyone recognize these areas?

 

Unfortunately, the 2003 storm (PD II) did not meet expectations for areas south of Fredericksburg, but it was still a very impactful event. I had the AKQ graphic saved for many years until an old hard drive crashed. The graphic had 14.2" for RIC. However, there was only about 3-5" across the RIC area because even though the surface temperatures were only around 20°F during the height of the event, precip was mainly in the form of IP. The storm came in 3 pieces over several days. It started as rain, then it was forecasted to turn to ZR/IP, and then +SN once the coastal got going. Instead, we got the IP/ZR as the colder air filtered in, then got dry slotted. Then, the coastal cranked too far north of us to reap the benefits, something that thankfully didn't happen in the 2016 storm. Perhaps, if and when there is a PD III, it'll be on par with PD I. 

Well, I was 8 but do remember this storm...

Pic 1 is the old Richmond/Petersburg Turnpike Toll Plaza.  When commuting to VCU I had toll tickets that you could buy from the bank to go through here.  I would get off at Belvedere.  Thankfully, this toll booth went the way of the dodo.

Pic 2 is Broad Street near MCV (now VCU Medical Center) looking down before that road heads up to Church Hill.

Pic 3 is Broad and Pic 4 appears to be East Grace Street.

Pic 5 is Broad looking at the MCV Main Hospital Building

Pic 6 is also Broad Street between Belvedere and 6th Street

Pic 7 is the toughest for me to identify but figure it's most likely Broad looking west, just from down the hill near Shockoe Valley but could easily be Grace or Main, scratch that, gotta be Broad with the street lights, Main never had them like that and don't think Grace did.

[JB Fins]

1 hour ago, Stormpc said:

Going to be a busy week as we can see the transition now on the long range models becoming more consistent and stronger with each run. Might not get there by the 15th but certainly looks exciting after with possible Southern stream tracks which is probably good for most of us in this thread. Here is to a good week ahead with eyes on the long range. Love that Greenland block of all indices.

OT...You see what happened in Nova Scotia? 

Wow!  Is it sad I had to google to convert centimeters to inches?  Yes, yes it is.

[ldub23]

15 hours ago, Conway7305 said:

I wouldn’t be surprised if that LR storm fantasy storm turned into a bigger storm at mid range  or ushers in a bigger storm.  Sometime between the 18th-24th.  Upper level pattern screams storm. 

Lets hope  so

[RIC Airport]

10 hours ago, JB Fins said:

Well, I was 8 but do remember this storm...

Pic 1 is the old Richmond/Petersburg Turnpike Toll Plaza.  When commuting to VCU I had toll tickets that you could buy from the bank to go through here.  I would get off at Belvedere.  Thankfully, this toll booth went the way of the dodo.

Pic 2 is Broad Street near MCV (now VCU Medical Center) looking down before that road heads up to Church Hill.

Pic 3 is Broad and Pic 4 appears to be East Grace Street.

Pic 5 is Broad looking at the MCV Main Hospital Building

Pic 6 is also Broad Street between Belvedere and 6th Street

Pic 7 is the toughest for me to identify but figure it's most likely Broad looking west, just from down the hill near Shockoe Valley but could easily be Grace or Main, scratch that, gotta be Broad with the street lights, Main never had them like that and don't think Grace did.

I found these in the RTD archives. They should have listed the location in the last photo, but it's probably the same area. I wasn't born until 6/1981, but I could recognize where these were taken. All the people, the buses, and the snow plows show how we were more accustomed to getting snow than we are today. 

The below was taken downtown after the January 2016 storm, notice no people, no cars/busses, no plows. 

Interestingly, there were already 3 to 4 inches of snow on the ground from a 6.4 inch snowstorm that hit back on 2/7/1979. Look at how deep the snow depth got on 2/19/1979. That was also a frigid month. Richmond hit -8°F a few days after that storm. It's too bad we haven't seen many months with this type of cold/snow combo since. February 2010 featured a 16-day stretch with snow on the ground, the longest stretch January 1996. 

[RIC Airport]

11 hours ago, Stormpc said:

Going to be a busy week as we can see the transition now on the long range models becoming more consistent and stronger with each run. Might not get there by the 15th but certainly looks exciting after with possible Southern stream tracks which is probably good for most of us in this thread. Here is to a good week ahead with eyes on the long range. Love that Greenland block of all indices.

OT...You see what happened in Nova Scotia? 

9 hours ago, ldub23 said:

Lets hope  so

I was not impressed with today's runs, but that doesn't mean things won't change come tomorrow or later this week. We need to wait until the pattern evolves. I think it's still early. And trust me, I am impatient. I truly hope we can score in our area, and we should if history is a clue.