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Pre-Christmas (Dec 21-23rd) Winter Storm Part 2


Chicago Storm
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52 minutes ago, RogueWaves said:

We don't have the Fujiwara effects of '78 in this case, so if we can indeed keep this track nudged east across Lk Erie this could certainly treat SEMI better than that did. 

To all the down-players of less SN total = storm cancel. Keep in mind that '78 did this in Mansfield OH on just 5-6" of new accums.

339528790_Blizof78-MansfieldOH.jpg.5b5aaea2285aabb9a560d0dbb2ee0799.jpg

1976605068_NWSBlizof78-HRCCSnowMap.PNG.13a3585b8a07f014217d89ab8eff97b8.PNG

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Awesome post! I appreciate the info. My parents have a picture of them on a drift level with a two story window for 78'. I definitely dont expect that but should be a fun storm here in Alpena.

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24 minutes ago, Roger Smith said:

That's all quite interesting about 1-26-78 but the actual storm track was closer to Sarnia-Port Huron and up Lake Huron, I was actually in a weather office drawing up a map at 0800h and still have the map. There was a pressure of 955 mb at Sarnia and at one point maybe around 09-10h London ON had hurricane force southerly winds that were wrap-around arctic air. This won't quite get that wrapped up anywhere. I realize the technology has improved but the 24h prog position of that storm was over western Lake Ontario (it came up from around central AL). We were expecting a snowstorm in Toronto and got one from the wrap-around instead of northeast winds, so the public were not that aware of a forecast bust. I think it probably came as more of a shock further west, the intensity was quite unforeseen in southwestern ON. Those winds knocked down several large hydro-electric towers in that region. You don't often see arctic air blowing from the south in that part of the world. 

I'm well aware. The shooting NNW of the S Low pulled a bubble of warm layer with it that caused a prolonging of mixing issues at DTW and a lot of SEMI reducing eventual snow totals. Why I said a track a bit east over Erie could treat this area better than '78 did. You can see that blob of lighter green over Wayne Cnty and a bit north indicating 7.5-10"

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15 minutes ago, RogueWaves said:

I'm well aware. The shooting NNW of the S Low pulled a bubble of warm layer with it that caused a prolonging of mixing issues at DTW and a lot of SEMI reducing eventual snow totals. Why I said a track a bit east over Erie could treat this area better than '78 did. You can see that blob of lighter green over Wayne Cnty and a bit north indicating 7.5-10"

Apologies if my comment seemed related to that, I was just commenting on a graphic in somebody's post showing the low tracking further east in Ontario than what I recall. That was possibly the track of the triple point though. In Toronto we went from 40F and rain at 0700h to 18F and snow two hours later. The fropa had wind gusts over 70 mph locally whether that was picked up at airport or not, in fact where I normally parked there was a big a/c unit that had blown off the roof five minutes before I arrived for work. So that plus the fact it was still mild at 0700h tipped me off that the prog position had busted. 

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Hoping everyone is preparing for possible power outages with this system and frigid cold...even areas that don't get a lot of snow. We lost power during the November 5th wind event with winds between 60 and 70 mph. This event won't be as strong but with the cold temps any power outages could become a big problem if you can't keep warm. 

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29 minutes ago, Frog Town said:

The December and January prior to the Blizzard of 78 was mild

Yes, but across much of S Lakes/OHV there was a decent remnant snowpack. 5" was typical across non-LES regions of SMI as the storm set in. This was a slushy compacted base which rapidly re-froze and did aid in allowing the new snow which was of a high ratio type to blow and drift quickly. An ideal state most of us will not have from an impact standpoint. As mentioned there was the 1st in the series of triple blizzards that had run through the OHV around the 19th iirc. It was a big deal for IN and OH and eastward. Then the bomb cut N over the remnant snow cover.

 285093488_1978-01-19SnowDepth.png.531ff43953a808839e03ae47436e2c41.png

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13 minutes ago, Stevo6899 said:

I feel like dtx are snow weenies like us and are so jaded and upset with how much we suck, that they have no motivation to write an afd.

New here, so not gotten a feel for weenie-isms or not. Their overnight crew AFD's the past couple/few days have been awesome and in depth without seeming too upbeat or downbeat. But right when you think they'd issue something or at least express some concerns for public safety, they 99'd us. It is a few days before the holidays and notoriously in these situations in big storms of the past GRR's better Mets would be out and we'd get total BS from "04"

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5 minutes ago, Kaner88 said:

Can't believe I'm spending my Tuesday evening comparing 500mb vorticity ribbons across Wyoming and Colorado from the 0z NAM to previous runs

Rock_Bottom.webp

I find myself saying I can't believe I'm doing this during every snow tracking event, like staying up for the euro when I gotta start work at 5am.

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6 minutes ago, RogueWaves said:

New here, so not gotten a feel for weenie-isms or not. Their overnight crew AFD's the past couple/few days have been awesome and in depth without seeming too upbeat or downbeat. But right when you think they'd issue something or at least express some concerns for public safety, they 99'd us. It is a few days before the holidays and notoriously in these situations in big storms of the past GRR's better Mets would be out and we'd get total BS from "04"

DTX is always like this. They dont issue watches until way late,  like sometimes watch, then next cycle warning. Totally negates the point of a watch...

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1 minute ago, RogueWaves said:

Yep. It makes very little sense though

 

No it doesn't.. I mean it could happen but that would mean the models are screwing the pooch with the upper level features etc.. Really have not paid enough attention to know which it is the models are screwing with? Regardless to get better snows ( even Les here ) down this way back to Chicago that northern stuff needs to go. 

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7 minutes ago, Stevo6899 said:

I find myself saying I can't believe I'm doing this during every snow tracking event, like staying up for the euro when I gotta start work at 5am.

Same here but ima wait till I get to my job site at 6 and set up my work/storm tracking station in my work truck lol. I will be up late as hell next few days tho

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1 minute ago, LansingWeather said:

DTX is always like this. They dont issue watches until way late,  like sometimes watch, then next cycle warning. Totally negates the point of a watch...

 

Amazing thing about the watch here ( GRR ) is who did it here. They are usually on the  conservative side. 

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28 minutes ago, Harry said:

 

No it doesn't.. I mean it could happen but that would mean the models are screwing the pooch with the upper level features etc.. Really have not paid enough attention to know which it is the models are screwing with? Regardless to get better snows ( even Les here ) down this way back to Chicago that northern stuff needs to go. 

Globals aren't showing that though. Seems like the models do like to amplify the N stream Lows more for some reason. Due to proximity to the thermal boundary perhaps. I don't see this returning to a CF passage. 

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8 minutes ago, Baum said:

oddly, i still think this will be a memorable event and NWS offices will have been justified in the early lead time watches.

Can you image the range of model solutions we'd be forced to endure with the '78 mega-merger scenario :wacko:

Or the board crashing because EC Weenies were already salivating at Feb 5th on LR runs?

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