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Monitoring a potential important TV to East Coastal storm: Jan 17


Typhoon Tip
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Just now, Ginx snewx said:

I agree and that rain Flys by. Thumper looks better for you. An hour or 2 holding off rain will be key. An hour if sleet will help as well. Think surface warmth oversold for you anyway. We know the drill here. I will torch you will briefly hit near 40. Nice snow squall post rain with bottom shelf ULL should give us a half inch on top. Just my opinion 

I can think of a bunch of examples over the years like this where IJD hits 48 or something and it stays in the upper 30’s here. I’m not ruling anything out, but I have been skeptical of hours of 40’s. That period of snow tomorrow night has been showing up on most models for a couple days. Probably a lot .5 -1” stuff as it moves thru 

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Just now, Damage In Tolland said:

I can think of a bunch of examples over the years like this where IJD hits 48 or something and it stays in the upper 30’s here. I’m not ruling anything out, but I have been skeptical of hours of 40’s. That period of snow tomorrow night has been showing up on most models for a couple days. Probably a lot .5 -1” stuff as it moves thru 

For the record, I don't think you bake in the 40s all day, I don't think any model has ever shown that.

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1 minute ago, JC-CT said:

For the record, I don't think you bake in the 40s all day, I don't think any model has ever shown that.

Should be a few hours of low 40s. Even if he holds u30s during the warm conveyor he'll have the front come through from the SW to mix it out and he'll end up with some low 40s with weak CAA anyway. The caveat will be breaks in the overcast during midday while the airmass is still relatively warm. Pop some sun for an hour or so and it shoots up to 45+.

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4 minutes ago, JC-CT said:

You've got good eyes...looks almost identical to me. Looks a little more juiced with qpf though especially in CNE.

Think on all runs today more precip before mid levels torch. You can see it in the available precip rates. There are some spots who get 2 to 4 in an hour some carry that for 2 plus hours, hence why the Berks and Hunchiehubbymville might luck out. Sierra cement.  Power outage stuff. Get over 6 and shit goes downhill fast.

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1 hour ago, Sey-Mour Snow said:

Will, what do you think of the 3km and HRRR being so cold, big difference down here in CT as well...

Honestly not sure what to make of this. There’s arguments both ways. Synoptically this is pretty awful for snow with that rapid high pressure retreat and the pressure falls mostly being to the west rather than southeast when redevelopment is attempting my to take place  when we get a typical front ender…however, this antecedent airmass is really strong so there’s a case to be made for the models trying to flush that high a little too quickly. If it hangs back even a couple hours longer than models think, then it’s going to bust positive for snow. 
 

I’d prob still hedge mostly on the lower side of guidance but I would put a little bit of weight on the HRRR/3km type solutions. I do think there should be a few hours of moderate to heavy snow even down in CT at the start. Sfc temps may dictate how well that accumulates. If the heaviest stuff is at 33-34F then it won’t be that efficient obviously. 
 

It’s a semi-interesting nowcast. We can see how the short term guidance keeps trending today. Esp this afternoon. I will say that the last 4-5 cycles of HRRr keep slowing the high retreat. 15z coming in right now is doing it again. 

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3 minutes ago, Greg said:

I know.. Read what I wrote.

The 3KM clown map seems to be the realistic outcome on this storm. It takes the sleet into consideration here.

I dont get it. It clearly doesn't take sleet into consideration...it only does 10-1 snow vs liquid.

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1 minute ago, ineedsnow said:

wont be much sleet in my opinion

There's going to be big bust potential with the clowns given the precip rates and deep layers in the low levels approaching +1C. The clowns could be calling 2 hours of 0.20"/hr @ 34F 4" of snow when it may not be accumulating much anymore. Like Will said, it's an interesting nowcast.

My intuition is to undercut the clowns a bit.

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7 minutes ago, ineedsnow said:

wont be much sleet in my opinion

Not sure either. It could go from a heavy snow to rain without much sleet getting in at all. Interesting situation. The duration of the true snowfall rates of the front end and rain will be paramount to how it all plays out.

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6 minutes ago, ORH_wxman said:

Honestly not sure what to make of this. There’s arguments both ways. Synoptically this is pretty awful for snow with that rapid high pressure retreat and the pressure falls mostly being to the west rather than southeast when redevelopment is attempting my to take place  when we get a typical front ender…however, this antecedent airmass is really strong so there’s a case to be made for the models trying to flush that high a little too quickly. If it hangs back even a couple hours longer than models think, then it’s going to bust positive for snow. 
 

I’d prob still hedge mostly on the lower side of guidance but I would put a little bit of weight on the HRRR/3km type solutions. I do think there should be a few hours of moderate to heavy snow even down in CT at the start. Sfc temps may dictate how well that accumulates. If the heaviest stuff is at 33-34F then it won’t be that efficient obviously. 
 

It’s a semi-interesting nowcast. We can see how the short term guidance keeps trending today. Esp this afternoon. I will say that the last 4-5 cycles of HRRr keep slowing the high retreat. 15z coming in right now is doing it again. 

Do you think a longer period of IP/ZR? Really cold to start in many areas

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Just now, dendrite said:

There's going to be big bust potential with the clowns given the precip rates and deep layers in the low levels approaching +1C. The clowns could be calling 2 hours of 0.20"/hr @ 34F 4" of snow when it may not be accumulating much anymore. Like Will said, it's an interesting nowcast.

My intuition is to undercut the clowns a bit.

This likely becomes very elevation-dependent in the final couple hours before the flip to rain. We could see a scenario where after 2” of snow, I get 2 hours of 0.20” QPF/hour of massive wet aggregates at 34F but it only adds another inch or less while ORH grabs another 3” of paste in that same 2 hour span. 

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