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Upstate/Eastern New York-Into Winter!


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12 minutes ago, tombo82685 said:

not sure if this was posted, but this is probably the best annual snow map I have seen so far 

buffalo+snow+belt (1).png

Actually, that map is a pretty poor map.  Way too low on snow for the Northern Tug and Syracuse area. Too high for the Finger Lakes area around Dansville. I made the mistake of trusting that map when I lived in SOUTH Redfield for a winter. The snow maxima over the Tug is actually farther north and west than what you see here. The area where Jefferson, Oswego, and Lewis counties meet is the snowiest area.

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53 minutes ago, tombo82685 said:

not sure if this was posted, but this is probably the best annual snow map I have seen so far 

buffalo+snow+belt (1).png

 

41 minutes ago, TugHillMatt said:

Actually, that map is a pretty poor map.  Way too low on snow for the Northern Tug and Syracuse area. Too high for the Finger Lakes area around Dansville. I made the mistake of trusting that map when I lived in SOUTH Redfield for a winter. The snow maxima over the Tug is actually farther north and west than what you see here. The area where Jefferson, Oswego, and Lewis counties meet is the snowiest area.

While still having its big flaws, I would say this map is "best" at showing areas that get the heaviest and least lake effect snowfalls in general. It shows the general primary belts based on wind direction, and the secondary belts that still get decent snowfall on a WNW flow, etc. I would still move the Tug maxima a bit farther north, and move the "120 inch line" farther south into much of Onondaga county...based on averages and the facts that the hills to the south of Syracuse and up to Cazenovia average about that much from orographic lift and heavier synoptic snowfall. It's also too low in the northern half of Erie County...and for the Chautauqua Ridge. Many areas along the ridge average close to 200 inches. Also, the southern burbs of Buffalo definitely average more than 100 inches of snowfall.

But, like I said, all the maps miss out on some key microclimates.

Tug Hill - Wikiwand

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BGM updated their HWO for 1 to 3 inches for the Syracuse region (higher elev. getting the most). Hopefully the band gets here sooner in the morning when the sun plays less of a factor.

Onondaga-Madison-Southern Oneida-
1054 PM EST Thu Nov 18 2021

This Hazardous Weather Outlook is for central New York.

.DAY ONE...Tonight and Friday.

A lake effect snow band will drop south through the area mid morning
Friday into the early afternoon hours. This lake effect band could
produce a quick 1 to 3 inches of snow, especially for the Mohawk
Valley region and other surrounding higher elevations. Be prepared
for the early season winter weather, especially if you are planning
to be on the roads during this timeframe.
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https://kamala.cod.edu/ny/latest.nous41.KBUF.html
...SNOWFALL REPORTS...

Location                     Amount    Time/Date       Provider

...New York...

...Allegany County...
West Almond 3.6 SW           1.6 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Wellsville 2.4 ENE           0.8 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Wellsville                    T in     0500 AM 11/19   COOP

...Cattaraugus County...
Franklinville 3.5 E          2.0 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Little Valley                2.0 in    0700 AM 11/19   COOP
Ischua 0.4 SSE               1.6 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Franklinville 0.5 NNE        1.0 in    0701 AM 11/19   COCORAHS

...Chautauqua County...
Jamestown                    4.3 in    0600 AM 11/19   Trained Spotter
Jamestown 4ENE               3.6 in    0700 AM 11/19   COOP
Falconer 0.3 WSW             3.5 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS

...Erie County...
Springville 0.4 NE           0.5 in    1200 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Boston 2.5 NE                0.4 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
3 ENE Holland                0.4 in    0700 AM 11/19   Trained Spotter
Glenwood 1.0 SE              0.3 in    0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
East Aurora 0.1 ENE           T in     0700 AM 11/19   COCORAHS

...Jefferson County...
4 SW Barnes Corners          1.8 in    0600 AM 11/19   Trained Spotter

...Lewis County...
Constableville 1.2 NW        2.0 in    0600 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Highmarket 2W                2.0 in    0600 AM 11/19   COOP
Chases Lake                  0.3 in    0600 AM 11/19   COOP
Glenfield 0.9 SSW             T in     0600 AM 11/19   COCORAHS
Lowville                      T in     0700 AM 11/19   COOP

...Oswego County...
Mexico 2SW                   0.5 in    0700 AM 11/19   COOP

...Wyoming County...
Warsaw 4W                    2.0 in    0700 AM 11/19   COOP
Portageville 1W              0.7 in    0700 AM 11/19   COOP
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10 hours ago, TugHillMatt said:

 

 It's also too low in the northern half of Erie County...and for the Chautauqua Ridge. Many areas along the ridge average close to 200 inches. Also, the southern burbs of Buffalo definitely average more than 100 inches of snowfall.

But, like I said, all the maps miss out on some key microclimates.

Tug Hill - Wikiwand

I think it does a decent job of capturing the gradient between Ken-Ton and the 215-220 heading that seems to be the northern limit of steady lake effect bands in recent years. In fact, they could draw that line even further south - I don't have any issues with estimating roughly 75" as the average annual snowfall for the northern 1/3rd of Buffalo. You don't have to drive very far to the east to get to the airport, where LES sets up much more regularly on a heading that also crosses South Buffalo.

On the other hand, that map paints 80"-100" incorrectly over a broad area of the metro, including West Seneca, the southern half of Lancaster, most of Hamburg, and a good chunk of Orchard Park, and that's way off. If anything, the 120" line needs to be up around where the 100" line was drawn in the eastern part of the Buffalo metro. Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me if my mother-in-law in Gardenville got close to 2x the snowfall totals that I used to get in Parkside or that I get now in Kensington.

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5 minutes ago, WNash said:

I think it does a decent job of capturing the gradient between Ken-Ton and the 215-220 heading that seems to be the northern limit of steady lake effect bands in recent years. In fact, they could draw that line even further south - I don't have any issues with estimating roughly 75" as the average annual snowfall for the northern 1/3rd of Buffalo. You don't have to drive very far to the east to get to the airport, where LES sets up much more regularly on a heading that also crosses South Buffalo.

On the other hand, that map paints 80"-100" incorrectly over a broad area of the metro, including West Seneca, the southern half of Lancaster, most of Hamburg, and a good chunk of Orchard Park, and that's way off. If anything, the 120" line needs to be up around where the 100" line was drawn in the eastern part of the Buffalo metro. Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me if my mother-in-law in Gardenville got close to 2x the snowfall totals that I used to get in Parkside or that I get now in Kensington.

Agreed, the map is pretty bad. I think Carol in Redfield averages 250"+ doesn't she? 

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The highest number I can find is 388" but obviously some years are missing..

2006-2007

..OSWEGO COUNTY...

.REDFIELD..... 388 INCHES
.PALERMO...... 275 INCHES
.PARISH....... 269 INCHES
.BENNETTS BRG. 242 INCHES
.MEXICO....... 227 INCHES
.PULASKI...... 221 INCHES
.MINETTO...... 221 INCHES
.WEST MONROE.. 217 INCHES
.FULTON....... 217 INCHES
.SCRIBA....... 213 INCHES
.CONSTANTIA... 207 INCHES
.HANNIBAL..... 198 INCHES
.OSWEGO SW.... 196 INCHES
.OSWEGO....... 160 INCHES  (CITY)
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The following year a little over 300"..

.OSWEGO COUNTY...

.REDFIELD.......308 INCHES
.BENNETTS BRG...280 INCHES
.PULASKI........248 INCHES
.LACONA.........219 INCHES
.PALERMO........198 INCHES
.OSWEGO.........193 INCHES (CITY)
.FULTON.........187 INCHES
.MEXICO.........184 INCHES
.MINETTO........179 INCHES
.OSWEGO.........173 INCHES (SW)
.SCRIBA.........172 INCHES
.W. MONROE......165 INCHES
.OSWEGO.........160 INCHES (EAST)
.HANNIBAL.......154 INCHES
.CONSTANTIA......104 INCHES
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3 minutes ago, wolfie09 said:

The following year a little over 300"..

.OSWEGO COUNTY...

.REDFIELD.......308 INCHES
.BENNETTS BRG...280 INCHES
.PULASKI........248 INCHES
.LACONA.........219 INCHES
.PALERMO........198 INCHES
.OSWEGO.........193 INCHES (CITY)
.FULTON.........187 INCHES
.MEXICO.........184 INCHES
.MINETTO........179 INCHES
.OSWEGO.........173 INCHES (SW)
.SCRIBA.........172 INCHES
.W. MONROE......165 INCHES
.OSWEGO.........160 INCHES (EAST)
.HANNIBAL.......154 INCHES
.CONSTANTIA......104 INCHES

I knew i saw a 400+ reading before, it was hooker, but back in the 1970s lol. So may not help much. They had 466" in 1977

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1 hour ago, WNash said:

I think it does a decent job of capturing the gradient between Ken-Ton and the 215-220 heading that seems to be the northern limit of steady lake effect bands in recent years. In fact, they could draw that line even further south - I don't have any issues with estimating roughly 75" as the average annual snowfall for the northern 1/3rd of Buffalo. You don't have to drive very far to the east to get to the airport, where LES sets up much more regularly on a heading that also crosses South Buffalo.

On the other hand, that map paints 80"-100" incorrectly over a broad area of the metro, including West Seneca, the southern half of Lancaster, most of Hamburg, and a good chunk of Orchard Park, and that's way off. If anything, the 120" line needs to be up around where the 100" line was drawn in the eastern part of the Buffalo metro. Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me if my mother-in-law in Gardenville got close to 2x the snowfall totals that I used to get in Parkside or that I get now in Kensington.

Your last paragraph is what I was referring to.

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