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Upstate/Eastern New York-Into Winter!


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4 hours ago, TugHillMatt said:

The one good thing is the CFS almost always show torch.... lol.... But does look much worse than what they were showing. I think winters are lost anymore. It's quite sad.

It's mid November...let's not throw in the towel just yet.  

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10 minutes ago, MJO812 said:

It's funny seeing people already throwing the towel

I'm not throwing in the towel, and I'm not snowman19. I'm glad you're amused.

I have said it many times that as long as we have this raging Pacific Jet, that we have had for years, our winters are mostly going to suck. The cold air yet again settling over Alaska is not helping the cause.

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20 minutes ago, TugHillMatt said:

I'm not throwing in the towel, and I'm not snowman19. I'm glad you're amused.

I have said it many times that as long as we have this raging Pacific Jet, that we have had for years, our winters are mostly going to suck. The cold air yet again settling over Alaska is not helping the cause.

I guess our definition of sucking is different . My average down here is 28 inches. Your average is 100?

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4 minutes ago, MJO812 said:

I guess our definition of sucking is different . My average down here is 28 inches. Your average is 100?

We've gone over this the past couple winters. :)  The "average" here is 130 inches, so when the past couple winters have been 70 to 80 inches, that is well below usual. Plus, lake effect snow melts in torchy weather waaaaaay faster than synoptic snow. When you move to a lake effect snow belt for snow, it's pretty underwhelming when there is no cold to actually produce what you're excited to move there for originally. It's hard to explain, but the climate since living here really isn't much different than the I-95 corridor. It's just 5,000 times more dustings that melt the second the sun comes out.

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More favorable conditions for lake effect will then arrive very late
Monday and Monday night as slightly colder air aloft overspreads the
lakes...background synoptic moisture deepens/inversion heights rise
for a time...and upstream connections to Lake Huron/Georgian Bay
potentially become better established. This said...the low level
flow also looks to become increasingly northwesterly through this
period...which will result in a shortening fetch across the lakes
and the lake bands also moving around a bit more than what previous
model guidance had advertised. Taking all these factors into
consideration...feel that a period of potentially advisory-worthy
snows appears to be the most likely outcome east-southeast and
southeast of both lakes late Monday into Monday night...with the
best chances for these found across Wayne and Northern Cayuga
counties southeast of Lake Ontario. With this in mind...have
maintained a mention of this in the HWO. As the bands migrate
further south...some of the accumulating snows will also likely
overspread the Niagara to Monroe county corridor Monday night...
where somewhat lower amounts of 1-3" will be possible where snow
showers are more persistent. Outside of the main lake effect
areas... expect a few scattered lighter snow showers with otherwise
mainly dry and cold weather prevailing Monday night. Lows will
mostly range through the 20s...except across interior portions of
the North Country where readings may dip into the mid-upper teens.

 

 

Next chances of precipitation arrives Thursday night as
the next longwave trough moves into the Great Lakes with an
associated sharp cold front. Precipitation could mix with wet snow
across higher terrain later Thursday night as colder air arrives
behind the front. Post cold frontal airmass Friday into Saturday
will be cold enough for a typical westerly flow lake effect regime
east of the lakes with the likelihood for accumulating snows.
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My feeling is this is going to be too much of NW flow for us in Northern Onondaga county. Here's BGM's take though:

Monday evening, we have around a six hour window for a lake band to set up along the Thruway with persistent westerly flow off of Lake Ontario. Lapse rates will be steepening with ongoing cold air advection, and weak instability will be maximized amid a deepening snow growth zone. This indicates a good potential for some heavier bursts of snow into the night and a few inches of snow across the Thruway corridor and around the Syracuse metro before midnight. After midnight, the upper trough swings through, with with a shift to more northwest than westerly flow. This should help our band migrate southward towards the Finger Lakes, and as we lose the long fetch off of Lake Ontario, we may turn over more to a multi-band structure. Soundings continue to show pretty robust flow and a fairly deep, nearly saturated snow growth zone the rest of the night. So, some heavier snowfall rates and squall- like activity could be possible through the pre-dawn hours. An additional couple of inches will be possible southeast immediately of Lake Ontario, towards the northern Finger Lakes.

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5 hours ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Some of the climate numbers are insane. Saw this posted in NYC forum. Its moving so rapidly the last 10 years its insane.

NYC average DJF 30 year  climate normals….

1991-2020….2020s….36.2

1981-2010…..2010s….35.1

1971-2000…..2000s…34.7

1961-1990…..1990s….33.9

At the current rate,  in 20 years NYC will have Winters closer to DC and Northern VA.  Average Temps will be 38-39 and snowfall will be about 15 inches. 

Not to be a debbie “upper” but snowfall has gone up over much of the same period.  If things keep going at the same rate....

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5 hours ago, TugHillMatt said:

We've gone over this the past couple winters. :)  The "average" here is 130 inches, so when the past couple winters have been 70 to 80 inches, that is well below usual. Plus, lake effect snow melts in torchy weather waaaaaay faster than synoptic snow. When you move to a lake effect snow belt for snow, it's pretty underwhelming when there is no cold to actually produce what you're excited to move there for originally. It's hard to explain, but the climate since living here really isn't much different than the I-95 corridor. It's just 5,000 times more dustings that melt the second the sun comes out.

I would take 5000 dustings  than 1 big Blizzard and that's it for the winter.

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10 minutes ago, rochesterdave said:

Noooo. Keep the dustings and give me one big one. All in for a big one. I don’t even care if it melts in 3 days. 

Same here all about the big one.

Happy 1 year binghamton crew. craziest synoptic storm I've ever seen in Upstate. 40-45" across areas just west of Bing with 3-5"+ rates.

May be an image of snow

May be an image of snow

 

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3 hours ago, cleetussnow said:

Not to be a debbie “upper” but snowfall has gone up over much of the same period.  If things keep going at the same rate....

Yep 30 years averages are up across the board. I'm all about getting a big storm regardless if it stays or not, but for those that like snow retention like @TugHillMatt a big storm and a big melt doesn't cut it and that's what we've been getting the last 10 years.

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2 hours ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Same here all about the big one.

Happy 1 year binghamton crew. craziest synoptic storm I've ever seen in Upstate. 40-45" across areas just west of Bing with 3-5"+ rates.

May be an image of snow

May be an image of snow

 

The mother of all defo zones. It had a life of its own. In my mind, 40” of synoptic is equal to like 60” of LES. Just nutty that storm. The NWS could’ve gotten some use out of their crazy new snowfall scale. Lol

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12 hours ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Same here all about the big one.

Happy 1 year binghamton crew. craziest synoptic storm I've ever seen in Upstate. 40-45" across areas just west of Bing with 3-5"+ rates.

May be an image of snow

May be an image of snow

 

This storm happened on 12/16/21. You’re a month early on this anniversary. 

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12 minutes ago, rochesterdave said:

Pretty far north on HRDPS. Pretty far south on 3k. These are often forecasted too far south. My pick is north. Good luck Wolfie and Freak. image.thumb.png.fec5200719f1b51e2c96a44804748eaf.png

That's before it transitions to NW winds...which some models aren't showing much of. If, and once that happens, we know it could be anywhere from Oneida to Canandaigua that gets under the main band (if it actually transitions) Lol

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