Met Summer Banter

[HoarfrostHubb]

10 minutes ago, WhitinsvilleWX said:

I’m torn on employer mandates. I hate hate hate government interference in people lives. I’m basically a libertarian. But schools mandate vaccines. Hospitals mandate flu shots or you wear a mask. The amount of circulating virus needs to go down. Yea, this will always be here. Measles and mumps are out there. But they don’t circulate much because the population is vaxed. 
I’m honesty torn. But I had no idea there would be 100 million not get vaxed. Sure there’s always the anti vaxers, but I really thought the uptake would be better. 

Well, a chunk of the unvaccinated are kids under 12.  Not sure of how many that is.  
 

I get the initial hesitancy.  Now the data is very clear. 

[WhitinsvilleWX]

5 minutes ago, Baroclinic Zone said:

I know you're closer to my age but I was once in that realm but we as Americans are not as educated/woke as you or I.  There's a whole lotta dumb individuals that believe some of the fringe therapeutics to remedy this virus.   It sucks that the CDC feels some masking should be reimplemented but thats where they feel we are as a Country.

We’ll, I’m not woke but def educated. You know I don’t think masks do anything except under a few specific settings like long term hours on an assembly line or the like. But let’s stipulate for just a milli second I agree they do. People in New England and highly vaxed states don’t need too. It’s the low vax states that could benefit (again, just playing the other side of the fence for a second) but they’ll never do it, so what’s the use. (Now back to my anti mask self )

People listen to those idiots like Wakefield and Del Big Tree, and won’t get vaxed with anything. 

[Baroclinic Zone]

1 minute ago, WhitinsvilleWX said:

We’ll, I’m not woke but def educated. You know I don’t think masks do anything except under a few specific settings like long term hours on an assembly line or the like. But let’s stipulate for just a milli second I agree they do. People in New England and highly vaxed states don’t need too. It’s the low vax states that could benefit (again, just playing the other side of the fence for a second) but they’ll never do it, so what’s the use. (Now back to my anti mask self )

People listen to those idiots like Wakefield and Del Big Tree, and won’t get vaxed with anything. 

I agree.

[WhitinsvilleWX]

6 minutes ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

Well, a chunk of the unvaccinated are kids under 12.  Not sure of how many that is.  
 

I get the initial hesitancy.  Now the data is very clear. 

I had read it was 100 million adults that are eligible. But it pretty clear that we need about 70% uptake 

[PhineasC]

56 minutes ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

The Delta variant of the coronavirus, now dominant in the U.S. and many other countries, may induce a viral load that is 1,000 times higher than the level that was typically associated with the ancestral lineage of the virus in early 2020. This higher viral load makes Delta infections more contagious, which has led to a greater number of breakthrough cases, albeit many mild or asymptomatic. But the mRNA-based vaccines still provide strong protection, with efficacy against symptomatic infection in the range of 80 to 90 percent. And the ability of these vaccines to substantially reduce viral load in breakthrough cases could be a valuable tool in containing spread of the Delta variant.

Seems like it's a bit worse than your article indicated:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/cdc-says-fully-vaccinated-people-spread-the-delta-variant-and-should-wear-masks-this-new-science-is-worrisome/ar-AAMCNdt

Quote

CDC says fully vaccinated people spread the Delta variant and should wear masks: 'This new science is worrisome'

Quote

The CDC said in May that vaccinated people don't need masks, a recommendation based partly on data indicating that vaccinated people were less likely to transmit the virus to others. But the Delta variant - now the dominant strain in the US - behaves differently than previous versions of the virus, Walensky said.

"Information on the Delta variant from several states and other countries indicates that, on rare occasions, some vaccinated people infected with the Delta variant after vaccination may be contagious and spread the virus to others," Walensky said during a press call on Tuesday. "This new science is worrisome and unfortunately warrants an update to our recommendations."

Walensky said CDC investigations have found that the amount of virus present in vaccinated people infected with Delta is similar to the levels found in unvaccinated people with Delta infections. That's an indication that vaccinated people can easily transmit the virus - even if they're less likely to get sick on the whole.

Seems like the vaccinated spread this enough to warrant a major reversal of the guidance from May.

[PhineasC]

44 minutes ago, WeatherX said:

To be direct, if you consider yourself a patriot and love this country, you should be moved to get vaxxed. Unfortunately, many people are not able to grasp that the act is about saving others, not just themselves. We pay heavy costs for this mindset. It really is a shame.

The rhetoric out there sure is getting really divisive now, not to mention jingoistic. Maybe some do want a war over this.

[STILL N OF PIKE]

Just a weekly mask update from the very liberal training studio I work at in Lexington .

No masks tonite . 11 clients .
 

One of the clients is a researcher for BioNTech. Much against  anti vaxx mentality in general , wasn’t moved to wear a mask indoors tonite and did mention something I wasn’t aware of , she said that the viral load of those infected with delta variant maybe much higher than the other strains . Haven’t read that . 

 

[PhineasC]

24 minutes ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

Show me data?  Or is everything being hidden in the vast conspiracy world

 

It doesn't even make sense at a basic level. If they vaccinated 170 million people, just simple allergic reactions would account for more than 3 deaths. Even if 1,000 people died that would be an incredibly low death rate and nothing to be worried about.

Stats are nearly impossible to find because no one is tracking them, which is odd considering this isn't even a fully approved vaccine. You would think Pfizer and the FDA would want to know this data but apparently not...

Here is what the CDC is saying:

Quote

• Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare. More than 339 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through July 19, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 6,207 reports of death (0.0018%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine. FDA requires healthcare providers to report any death after COVID-19 vaccination to VAERS, even if it’s unclear whether the vaccine was the cause. Reports of adverse events to VAERS following vaccination, including deaths, do not necessarily mean that a vaccine caused a health problem. A review of available clinical information, including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records, has not established a causal link to COVID-19 vaccines. However, recent reports indicate a plausible causal relationship between the J&J/Janssen COVID-19 Vaccine and TTS, a rare and serious adverse event—blood clots with low platelets—which has caused deaths.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/adverse-events.html

That seems to indicate at least that J&J has caused some deaths.

There are thousands of deaths in VAERS in people who had just received the vaccine. I think it's safe to say more than 3 people have died...

Looks like the UK system has recorded 1,332 deaths after the vaccine up through the middle of June: 

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-covid-vaccine-idUSL2N2O01W8

Kinda neat how when someone dies of a heart attack with COVID, it's a COVID death, but when someone dies of a heart attack right after getting the vaccine, it's just a heart attack. Again, I expect studies in the future to sort this all out and then be buried.

[WhitinsvilleWX]

8 minutes ago, STILL N OF PIKE said:

Just a weekly mask update from the very liberal training studio I work at in Lexington .

No masks tonite . 11 clients .
 

One of the clients is a researcher for BioNTech. Much against  anti vaxx mentality in general , wasn’t moved to wear a mask indoors tonite and did mention something I wasn’t aware of , she said that the viral load of those infected with delta variant maybe much higher than the other strains . Haven’t read that . 

 

That’s why the vax is important, keeps the viral load to a minimum even if there happens to be a replicating and shedding infection. That’s why even a 60-70% effective vax works. Keeps the viral load down. 

[ineedsnow]

6 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

It doesn't even make sense at a basic level. If they vaccinated 170 million people, just simple allergic reactions would account for more than 3 deaths. Even if 1,000 people died that would be an incredibly low death rate and nothing to be worried about.

Stats are nearly impossible to find because no one is tracking them, which is odd considering this isn't even a fully approved vaccine. You would think Pfizer and the FDA would want to know this data but apparently not...

Here is what the CDC is saying:

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/adverse-events.html

That seems to indicate at least that J&J has caused some deaths.

There are thousands of deaths in VAERS in people who had just received the vaccine. I think it's safe to say more than 3 people have died...

Looks like the UK system has recorded 1,332 deaths after the vaccine up through the middle of June: 

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-covid-vaccine-idUSL2N2O01W8

Kinda neat how when someone dies of a heart attack with COVID, it's a COVID death, but when someone dies of a heart attack right after getting the vaccine, it's just a heart attack. Again, I expect studies in the future to sort this all out and then be buried.

A guy I work with wife got the vax 2 months ago she died the same night..  incredibly  sad but definitely  think more die from it then what is reported.  

[Baroclinic Zone]

I'm anxious to see how the trials with those under 12 go with the vaccines.   Having approval for use in that age group will go a long way to reduce transmission.

[PhineasC]

5 minutes ago, ineedsnow said:

A guy I work with wife got the vax 2 months ago she died the same night..  incredibly  sad but definitely  think more die from it then what is reported.  

Obviously, there is zero appetite for the authorities to report vaccine deaths since it really hurts their messaging campaign, and I don't think it matters anyway. The vaccines are killing some people like any medical procedure can, but they are still very safe and the benefits at the moment still far outweigh the cons for most people. 

One exception is small children. It's less clear if the risk/reward ratio is the same for them since so few get serious COVID. A couple hundred deaths in American children from the vaccine would make it about as risky as COVID, if not a little more so.

[Baroclinic Zone]

1 hour ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

The Delta variant of the coronavirus, now dominant in the U.S. and many other countries, may induce a viral load that is 1,000 times higher than the level that was typically associated with the ancestral lineage of the virus in early 2020. This higher viral load makes Delta infections more contagious, which has led to a greater number of breakthrough cases, albeit many mild or asymptomatic. But the mRNA-based vaccines still provide strong protection, with efficacy against symptomatic infection in the range of 80 to 90 percent. And the ability of these vaccines to substantially reduce viral load in breakthrough cases could be a valuable tool in containing spread of the Delta variant.

 

20 minutes ago, STILL N OF PIKE said:

Just a weekly mask update from the very liberal training studio I work at in Lexington .

No masks tonite . 11 clients .
 

One of the clients is a researcher for BioNTech. Much against  anti vaxx mentality in general , wasn’t moved to wear a mask indoors tonite and did mention something I wasn’t aware of , she said that the viral load of those infected with delta variant maybe much higher than the other strains . Haven’t read that . 

 

See post above.  It's a higher viral load because the Delta strain resides more in the nasal cavities/passages vs throat/lungs of the others.

[Damage In Tolland]

3 minutes ago, Baroclinic Zone said:

I'm anxious to see how the trials with those under 12 go with the vaccines.   Having approval for use in that age group will go a long way to reduce transmission.

Most parents would never dream of having their kids get it. Especially that young . Good lord 

[Baroclinic Zone]

10 minutes ago, WhitinsvilleWX said:

That’s why the vax is important, keeps the viral load to a minimum even if there happens to be a replicating and shedding infection. That’s why even a 60-70% effective vax works. Keeps the viral load down. 

It's like a kid in a candy store obvious yet there are some kids who would rather eat the mud.

[HoarfrostHubb]

So no data equals people covering up.  Got it. 
 

[Baroclinic Zone]

1 minute ago, Damage In Tolland said:

Most parents would never dream of having their kids get it. Especially that young . Good lord 

  Do they have them get the DTaP/Tdap, polio, MMR, Hepatitis B, and Varicella vaccines or do they not believe in those as well?

[PhineasC]

3 minutes ago, Damage In Tolland said:

Most parents would never dream of having their kids get it. Especially that young . Good lord 

We should be vaxxing fetuses to protect the nurses in the delivery ward, bro.

[Damage In Tolland]

Just now, Baroclinic Zone said:

  Do they have them get the DTaP/Tdap, polio, MMR, Hepatitis B, and Varicella vaccines or do they not believe in those as well?

There is not a parent in their right mind that would inject their kids with this poison, Risking later in life pregnancy issues in females amongst many other things. I mean come on 

[HoarfrostHubb]

We live in the dumbest of times

[HoarfrostHubb]

Omg. The fertility bullshit.  
 

you are an idiot

[PhineasC]

1 minute ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

So no data equals people covering up.  Got it. 
 

If you believe only 3 people have died out of 350 million doses... OK. Safest medical procedure ever created by man, I guess. 

It's going to be a total meltdown for some of you when the CDC announces a variant that fully bypasses the vaccine in 30%-50%+ of cases with the reality bubble you have created around yourselves.

[Baroclinic Zone]

1 minute ago, PhineasC said:

We should be vaxxing fetuses to protect the nurses in the delivery ward, bro.

Seems like you're upset.  Perhaps a move to an even more isolated place will do you better.

[Damage In Tolland]

Wow 

[HoarfrostHubb]

1 minute ago, PhineasC said:

If you believe only 3 people have died out of 350 million doses... OK. Safest medical procedure ever created by man, I guess. 

It's going to be a total meltdown for some of you when the CDC announces a variant that fully bypasses the vaccine in 30%-50%+ of cases with the reality bubble you have created around yourselves.

Grasping at straws.  Tilting at windmills.  Making shit up.   No data=failed argument

[Baroclinic Zone]

1 minute ago, Damage In Tolland said:

There is not a parent in their right mind that would inject their kids with this poison, Risking later in life pregnancy issues in females amongst many other things. I mean come on 

We had our daughter at the front of the line in February to get the vaccine.  They are safe and effective.

[HoarfrostHubb]

You know what causes pregnancy issues... Covid

https://www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/covid-19-but-not-the-vaccine-may-reduce-male-fertility-11627308667

[PhineasC]

It's pretty twisted how the media has you guys convinced that we need to forcefully vaccinate small children so that maybe, just maybe, the government will allow us to go back to normal. It's a crazy way to think.

What are you guys going to say when some guy from Africa or India brings another variant here and it breaks through the vaccine? 

[Baroclinic Zone]

Just now, HoarfrostHubb said:

Grasping at straws.  Tilting at windmills.  Making shit up.   No data=failed argument

It's his MO.   Been doing it for over a decade.  Even if the number was 100x that, I'd still say they are safe and effective.

[HoarfrostHubb]

Albert Hsu, MD, a reproductive endocrinologist at MU Health Care, said he frequently hears COVID-19 vaccine concerns from patients who are trying to conceive.

“While studies are ongoing, there is no data that the COVID-19 vaccines may cause infertility and no credible scientific theories for how the COVID-19 vaccine may cause female infertility,” Hsu said. “Statements linking COVID-19 vaccines to female infertility are currently speculative at best.”