Spring Banter

[PhineasC]

7 minutes ago, fujiwara79 said:

i think the pandemic will eventually result in the education system improving and better serving a larger segment of their students.  do you guys think throwing 30 kids into a classroom and lecturing them all day was always the best way for kids to learn?  for some kids, sure.  but for many kids - absolutely not.  does anyone question why kids hate school?  too many people assume that's the best way to teach kids because "that's how we've always done it".  we've had the technology to adopt a more flexible model for teaching kids based upon the diverse needs of students, and yet it took a pandemic to force people to reimagine the old one-size-fits-all model.

but the boomers, doomers and gloomers will continue to lament that we're headed for societal ruin.

Do you have school-age kids? Not trying to be rude, but I find a lot of people who don't see any issue with the schools don't even have kids enrolled in them...

What you are suggesting sounds great, but that's not at all what is happening in the schools now, nor is it where they are headed. It's turned into dumbed-down one-size-fits-all Youtube-esque lessons beamed out to every student whether they are in a classroom staring at a laptop or at home staring at a laptop. Things are demonstrably worse in the schools now. It's not debatable.

I'm sorry, but whenever I hear anyone try to argue that 2020 will be a good thing for the kids, I just cringe laugh. 

[Juliancolton]

10 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

It didn't impact what is arriving today/this week... but the state of CT (for instance) is going from about 60k J&J doses this week to only 6k next week. So it is going to be a pretty sharp drop off for a couple weeks.

Does it look like the other two can fill that supply gap? That's a heck of a drop at this stage of the rollout. Either way, I appreciate the heads-up on that. Who knows how long they'll wait to tell us that other options should be pursued.

[Ginx snewx]

6 hours ago, CT Rain said:

It didn't impact what is arriving today/this week... but the state of CT (for instance) is going from about 60k J&J doses this week to only 6k next week. So it is going to be a pretty sharp drop off for a couple weeks.

Going for 2nd Moderna today, just saw Bob Maxon say it kicked his butt. Hopefully not.

[HIPPYVALLEY]

  Initial reports are now saying that the vaccines have reduced efficacy on Covid strains which have the E484K (EEK)protein spike mutation. Apparently that mutation has reduced antibody binding properties and a decreased neutralizing antibody response triggered by the current mRNA vaccines.  It is present in the B.1.351 variant (South Africa) and the P.1variant (Brazil).    We are probably moving towards Covid becoming endemic but human adaptability is pretty remarkable so I for one am not going to get too rattled about it.   The new variants will eventually become dominant (Brazil is on fire with P.1) and I doubt Americans will tolerate another round of lock downs, regardless of reduced effectiveness of vaccines against emerging strains. America seems done with the pandemic even if it is not done with us.

[dryslot]

3 hours ago, Ginx snewx said:

Going for 2nd Moderna today, just saw Bob Maxon say it kicked his butt. Hopefully not.

It did my brother inlaw too, Good luck.

[tamarack]

14 hours ago, DotRat_Wx said:

Nice. 

FYI.. Take it easy on alcohol for the 2 weeks after. I went to opening day a week after, I was so fatigued since then. I didn't feel normal the last four days or so. Did some googling. Turns out docs are saying don't drink after. I didn't know that. 

Fortunately I stepped away from recreational alcohol years ago.  However, the day after Moderna #2 I became surprisingly fatigued while gardening and pruning the apple trees.  Following day, a long and active Easter Sunday, no fatigue beyond the expected.  I probably (and thankfully) had it easier than many.

[Ginx snewx]

2 minutes ago, dryslot said:

It did my brother inlaw too, Good luck.

Just got it. Sitting here for the mandatory 15 minutes. Lady who gave me the shot said she had a headache for a day and tired. Hopefully nothing bad. The paper work says it doesn't give you Covid-19 but apparently sets off your immune response.

[SouthCoastMA]

The only instructions after my first Pfizer shot was to drink a ton of water for the first 2-3 days

[Ginx snewx]

I have been a good Doobie with isolation pretty much since March 6th last year. I really don't like crowds so other than the occasional outdoor concert, indoor pro lacrosse,and baseball games I didn't miss much. Saw my kids and grandkids on occasion so in 2 weeks its back to full contact with everyone. Feel safer at least.

[PhineasC]

12 minutes ago, HIPPYVALLEY said:

  Initial reports are now saying that the vaccines have reduced efficacy on Covid strains which have the E484K (EEK)protein spike mutation. Apparently that mutation has reduced antibody binding properties and a decreased neutralizing antibody response triggered by the current mRNA vaccines.  It is present in the B.1.351 variant (South Africa) and the P.1variant (Brazil).    We are probably moving towards Covid becoming endemic but human adaptability is pretty remarkable so I for one am not going to get too rattled about it.   The new variants will eventually become dominant (Brazil is on fire with P.1) and I doubt Americans will tolerate another round of lock downs, regardless of reduced effectiveness of vaccines against emerging strains. America seems done with the pandemic even if it is not done with us.

Texas and Florida are where we are headed if things are left to naturally open up. If someone thinks those states are just "two weeks away" from mass death, then life is going to remain hard for that person, because the TX and FL examples are how things are going to go across the country soon enough.

[CoastalWx]

1 minute ago, PhineasC said:

Texas and Florida are where we are headed if things are left to naturally open up. If someone thinks those states are just "two weeks away" from mass death, then life is going to remain hard for that person, because the TX and FL examples are how things are going to go across the country soon enough.

It does help to be in warm weather states. TX just recently opened up and FL is basically summer all year around except for the Panhandle. We know this is primarily aerosol transmission....so outdoors FTW. 

[dryslot]

16 minutes ago, Ginx snewx said:

Just got it. Sitting here for the mandatory 15 minutes. Lady who gave me the shot said she had a headache for a day and tired. Hopefully nothing bad. The paper work says it doesn't give you Covid-19 but apparently sets off your immune response.

Ha, Mine was set off after my J&J shot.

[dryslot]

23 minutes ago, tamarack said:

Fortunately I stepped away from recreational alcohol years ago.  However, the day after Moderna #2 I became surprisingly fatigued while gardening and pruning the apple trees.  Following day, a long and active Easter Sunday, no fatigue beyond the expected.  I probably (and thankfully) had it easier than many.

I must of missed the don't drink part after my shot, I had plenty of water but it was mixed with something else.

[tamarack]

10 hours ago, fujiwara79 said:

i think the pandemic will eventually result in the education system improving and better serving a larger segment of their students.  do you guys think throwing 30 kids into a classroom and lecturing them all day was always the best way for kids to learn?  for some kids, sure.  but for many kids - absolutely not.  does anyone question why kids hate school?  too many people assume that's the best way to teach kids because "that's how we've always done it".  we've had the technology to adopt a more flexible model for teaching kids based upon the diverse needs of students, and yet it took a pandemic to force people to reimagine the old one-size-fits-all model.

but the boomers, doomers and gloomers will continue to lament that we're headed for societal ruin.

That describes my grade school experience, but it was about 65 years ago.  Today's classroom is more likely to be tables with groups working together under the teacher's guidance rather than in tidy rows and staring at the chalkboard.

[PhineasC]

1 minute ago, tamarack said:

That describes my grade school experience, but it was about 65 years ago.  Today's classroom is more likely to be tables with groups working together under the teacher's guidance rather than in tidy rows and staring at the chalkboard.

2019's classroom...

"Today's classroom" is kids sitting 3-6 feet apart, all facing forward, masks on, and watching a zoom lesson on a laptop run by the teacher who is at home. There may also be plastic barriers between each desk.

[SouthCoastMA]

2 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

2019's classroom...

"Today's classroom" is kids sitting 3-6 feet apart, all facing forward, masks on, and watching a zoom lesson on a laptop run by the teacher who is at home. There may also be plastic barriers between each desk.

My wife is a teacher and she has been physically at the school since last September. Has there really been situations where kids are at the school and the teachers aren't? 

[CoastalWx]

Just now, SouthCoastMA said:

My wife is a teacher and she has been physically at the school since last September. Has there really been situations where kids are at the school and the teachers aren't? 

Virtually all MA teachers are at school too. MD FTL?

[PhineasC]

1 minute ago, SouthCoastMA said:

My wife is a teacher and she has been physically at the school since last September. Has there really been situations where kids are at the school and the teachers aren't? 

Yep.

I can't speak to MA schools, just local MD schools.

That said, even if the teachers get vaccinated and return, it hardly matters because many kids are still remote, and it isn't "fair" to teach the in-person kids differently from the remote kids, so everyone gets the remote package (some are just sitting in a school building instead of on their couch). Maybe it is different in MA, not sure. 

[mreaves]

1 hour ago, tamarack said:

Fortunately I stepped away from recreational alcohol years ago.  However, the day after Moderna #2 I became surprisingly fatigued while gardening and pruning the apple trees.  Following day, a long and active Easter Sunday, no fatigue beyond the expected.  I probably (and thankfully) had it easier than many.

Only drink professionally now? 

[HIPPYVALLEY]

1 hour ago, dryslot said:

I must of missed the don't drink part after my shot, I had plenty of water but it was mixed with something else.

I’ve been using alcohol to ward off illnesses for years. It seems to have worked.

[weatherwiz]

You can kinda "choose" which shot you want. 

For example, if you want Pfizier and have your heart set on Pfizier...then work on getting an appointment with Walgreens b/c they only deal with the Pfizier vaccine. On the VAMS site I think it also states which vaccines each location has so you can look for one that only deals with whatever one you're interested in.

 

[Typhoon Tip]

Some posts over recent pages touched on this a little...

At first I tended to a smidge of attitude about the logic of consignment practices myself, I mean considering the average household.

For the bell curve of population density ... the vast majority of household do not come along with state of the art ventilation systems like you get in these 750,000 $ luxurious baronial modern homes up therein N. Westford Mass...  Whatever the numbers are, but 70...80...90 % of median edifices are like the grid layout housing of the San Fernando Valley, ... Or worse yet, "the projects" of common vernacular ..etc, up through lower mid class apartment complexes ...perhaps built 20 years standards, and probably most likley do not provide ICU ventilation filtration ( obviously).  These are homes where ventilation is achieved by opening a window. Moreover, they cannot leave those vulnerabilities unattended, not for very long given to the travails of 'common socioeconomic stressing' - to put it nicely.

SO, those environments in fact "concentrate" pathogenic agents - that seems to be in paradox wrt open "distancing" physical settings. In the latter sense, one might immediately suspect spreading out, huh - that is what lowers concentration from parts per thousand toward millions ... or billions.  Considering the theoretical particle load requirement for C-19, it seems less is best.

But that's the 'surface logic' ?    'lockdown' ensured what?

Well, ...I think it all still just comes down to the original concept of needing to slow the rate transmission through an otherwise nakedly vulnerable population. We can't forget, the medical infrastructure ...and science for that matter et al, was immediately assessed as inadequate. 

I can picture the seen. The room smells of old coffee in a pall tinged by stale cologne, together not completely damping out the sterility of a typical Pentagon Nat security conference room setting.  It's closed-door session with WHO representation,

"So what you are telling me is that as bad as I think this is, it's much worse, or -" 

"I'm trying to impress that you don't know - you cannot make assumptions based on those exmples.  SAR 2003... the Flu, 1918. Irrelevant.  This is unknown vector, sir, and considering where this appears to have originated --" 

"Uh, hold on. Wait right there.  I must interrupt to remind the members of present meeting and to any party privy to or affiliated to this information, this cannot be made public - go ahead. You were saying"

"Ah...right. So early indications, this caries a very real chance to cripple society."

"OH c'mon - cripple."

"Quite please. Please... people, let her finish" 

Stronger exhale precedes, "What we are suggesting is a messy event, sir" fashioning double quotations in the air.

Chuckles reverberate.   "Excuse me - I'm sorry. Uh "Messy" ? 

"It's, ah, what we refer to as an M - S - E event ... uh, a modern setback event. Basically, it could very well bring the Industrial civilities of the world for that matter back to before --"

"Relax. Relax. I get it. Despite the incredulity of the others," panning his eyes across the retinue briefly, "You sold me at 'considering where it originated.'  

"Okay. Okay. I'm on the same page - you're talking about panic and social order."

"You have to understand," the head of Sociological Stability Research Division intercedes, " ...We are already dealing with self- propagating force in culture and society, already nearing a break-point where social trust cannot be restored, and --"

"Oh god"

They had to give medicine and science a chance to catch up.  Offering no advice given the novel nature and the early infectious rates, when mass media was only offering dour dystopian fear scenarios with images of intubation and other horrors, ...panic was also a concern - no doubt.   Break down of social order becomes a national and perhaps Global security risk..It domino dimensions.  Hind sight being 20/20 has it's advantages, but it is too easy to forget the utter conundrum of unknowns faced 18 months ago.

There was also going to have to be an assumption of 'process of discovery' built into this. I mean, the hint there was in the term, 'NOVEL' when this was first described.   Novel SAR-CoV-2 virus ...etc...  So to be fair.

Yeah, the poor household that succumbs ..but that is a control - sort of - environment that is thus containable ...because when quarantine is implement, containment can take place... spread in the total population is slowed and those infrastructures can keep up.

 

[Ginx snewx]

18 minutes ago, weatherwiz said:

You can kinda "choose" which shot you want. 

For example, if you want Pfizier and have your heart set on Pfizier...then work on getting an appointment with Walgreens b/c they only deal with the Pfizier vaccine. On the VAMS site I think it also states which vaccines each location has so you can look for one that only deals with whatever one you're interested in.

 

Lol I just my second Moderna.....at Walgreens 

[Brian5671]

1 hour ago, PhineasC said:

Yep.

I can't speak to MA schools, just local MD schools.

That said, even if the teachers get vaccinated and return, it hardly matters because many kids are still remote, and it isn't "fair" to teach the in-person kids differently from the remote kids, so everyone gets the remote package (some are just sitting in a school building instead of on their couch). Maybe it is different in MA, not sure. 

teachers are in classroom here-we were "hybrid" for most of the year-abruptly went back full time 3/8, about 10% chose to remain remote-they have separate teachers for that program.   Whole thing has been a mess, should have gone back full time in Sept....yeah some kids will be out on Quarantine but on any given day here 85-90% are in school (remote kids not included in that #)   Our system has already said there will be no all remote option come Sept.

[weatherwiz]

2 minutes ago, Ginx snewx said:

Lol I just my second Moderna.....at Walgreens 

hmmm that's strange. My friend is a pharmacy tech at a Walgreens and said Walgreens only is dealing with the Pfizier one. Maybe it depends on district? 

[PhineasC]

21 minutes ago, Brian5671 said:

teachers are in classroom here-we were "hybrid" for most of the year-abruptly went back full time 3/8, about 10% chose to remain remote-they have separate teachers for that program.   Whole thing has been a mess, should have gone back full time in Sept....yeah some kids will be out on Quarantine but on any given day here 85-90% are in school (remote kids not included in that #)   Our system has already said there will be no all remote option come Sept.

It'll be interesting to see how many districts enforce a "no-remote" rule. That will cause issues with some parents (and some teachers).

[PhineasC]

47 minutes ago, HIPPYVALLEY said:

I’ve been using alcohol to ward off illnesses for years. It seems to have worked.

You have to cultivate a bodily environment that is simply too hostile for even a virus to survive. Something akin to the Earth's mantle or perhaps the surface of an asteroid baked in solar radiation should do it. 

[Brian5671]

6 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

It'll be interesting to see how many districts enforce a "no-remote" rule. That will cause issues with some parents (and some teachers).

it will be an issue mainly at the elementary level as 12 and up will have vaccines by Sept most likely

[Lava Rock]

Some posts over recent pages touched on this a little...
At first I tended to a smidge of <_ attitude about the logic of consignment practices myself i mean considering average household.> For the bell curve of population density ... the vast majority of household do not come along with state of the art ventilation systems like you get in these 750,000 $ luxurious baronial modern homes up therein N. Westford Mass...  Whatever the numbers are, but 70...80...90 % of median edifices are like the grid layout housing of the San Fernando Valley, ... Or worse yet, "the projects" of common vernacular ..etc, up through lower mid class apartment complexes ...perhaps built 20 years standards, and probably most likley do not provide ICU ventilation filtration ( obviously).  These are homes where ventilation is achieved by opening a window. Moreover, they cannot leave those vulnerabilities unattended, not for very long given to the travails of 'common socioeconomic stressing' - to put it nicely.
SO, those environments in fact "concentrate" pathogenic agents - that seems to be in paradox wrt open "distancing" physical settings. In the latter sense, one might immediately suspect spreading out, huh - that is what lowers concentration from parts per thousand toward millions ... or billions.  Considering the theoretical particle load requirement for C-19, it seems less is best.
But that's the 'surface logic' ?    'lockdown' ensured what?
Well, ...I think it all still just comes down to the original concept of needing to slow the rate transmission through an otherwise nakedly vulnerable population. We can't forget, the medical infrastructure ...and science for that matter et al, was immediately assessed as inadequate. 
I can picture the seen. The room smells of old coffee in a pall tinged by stale cologne, together not completely damping out the sterility of a typical Pentagon Nat security conference room setting.  It's closed-door session with WHO representation,
"So what you are telling me is that as bad as I think this is, it's much worse, or -" 
"I'm trying to impress that you don't know - you cannot make assumptions based on those exmples.  SAR 2003... the Flu, 1918. Irrelevant.  This is unknown vector, sir, and considering where this appears to have originated --" 
"Uh, hold on. Wait right there.  I must interrupt to remind the members of present meeting and to any party privy to or affiliated to this information, this cannot be made public - go ahead. You were saying"
"Ah...right. So early indications, this caries a very real chance to cripple society."
"OH c'mon - cripple."
"Quite please. Please... people, let her finish" 
Stronger exhale precedes, "What we are suggesting is a messy event, sir" fashioning double quotations in the air.
Chuckles reverberate.   "Excuse me - I'm sorry. Uh "Messy" ? 
"It's, ah, what we refer to as an M - S - E event ... uh, a modern setback event. Basically, it could very well bring the Industrial civilities of the world for that matter back to before --"
"Relax. Relax. I get it. Despite the incredulity of the others," panning his eyes across the retinue briefly, "You sold me at 'considering where it originated.'  
"Okay. Okay. I'm on the same page - you're talking about panic and social order."
"You have to understand," the head of Sociological Stability Research Division intercedes, " ...We are already dealing with self- propagating force in culture and society, already nearing a break-point where social trust cannot be restored, and --"
"Oh god"
They had to give medicine and science a chance to catch up.  Offering no advice given the novel nature and the early infectious rates, when mass media was only offering dour dystopian fear scenarios with images of intubation and other horrors, ...panic was also a concern - no doubt.   Break down of social order becomes a national and perhaps Global security risk..It domino dimensions.  Hind sight being 20/20 has it's advantages, but it is too easy to forget the utter conundrum of unknowns faced 18 months ago.
There was also going to have to be an assumption of 'process of discovery' built into this. I mean, the hint there was in the term, 'NOVEL' when this was first described.   Novel SAR-CoV-2 virus ...etc...  So to be fair.
Yeah, the poor household that succumbs ..but that is a control - sort of - environment that is thus containable ...because when quarantine is implement, containment can take place... spread in the total population is slowed and those infrastructures can keep up.
 

Cliff notes. And please tell me you don't bang that out on a phone

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

[PhineasC]

1 minute ago, Brian5671 said:

it will be an issue mainly at the elementary level as 12 and up will have vaccines by Sept most likely

Many, many parents are not even going to get themselves vaccinated, much less vaccinate their 12-18 year old kids...