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Feb Long Range Discussion (Day 3 and beyond) - MERGED


WinterWxLuvr
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4 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

Jokes aside I can’t really look right now but I care more about the trend then verbatim what it shows. The last few runs went from a snowstorm to some snow to mix to rain for us. Did that reverse or is it still trending warmer?

Verbatim we get a couple inches of snow, then zr then heavy a cold rain. Temps get into low 40's even here by 18z friday before the front sweeps through. The run was warmer overall. Slow death  

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7 minutes ago, Ji said:
11 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:
Jokes aside I can’t really look right now but I care more about the trend then verbatim what it shows. The last few runs went from a snowstorm to some snow to mix to rain for us. Did that reverse or is it still trending warmer?

Thursday was never shown as a pure snowstorm and you know that. Euro shows snow to wintry mix to rain

This would be a win for us imo Ji. It's a long ways away and future changes will keep coming. Any run that shows the knife edge within a reasonable distance is a net positive. Who knows what we'll be looking at in a few short days. Real cold is nearby. Lots of precip is overhead. I'm not jumping to any conclusions yet. We've trended the wrong way a lot last few weeks. Now that it's ugly instead in the mid range, maybe... just maybe the trend works the other way. 

After what we've all experienced since mid/late Jan, I'm def not spiking any footballs before the short range starts agreeing... and even then....

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14 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

Jokes aside I can’t really look right now but I care more about the trend then verbatim what it shows. The last few runs went from a snowstorm to some snow to mix to rain for us. Did that reverse or is it still trending warmer?

Better HP this run vs. 0Z. 1037 vs. 1034. It helps in the upper levels just enough to snow us at the start. 

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9 minutes ago, Ji said:
13 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:
Jokes aside I can’t really look right now but I care more about the trend then verbatim what it shows. The last few runs went from a snowstorm to some snow to mix to rain for us. Did that reverse or is it still trending warmer?

Thursday was never shown as a pure snowstorm and you know that. Euro shows snow to wintry mix to rain

About 36 hours ago the euro was mostly a snow to dryslot event for us and kept the snow pack destroying warm sector to our southeast. There was no rain. It’s trended warmer every run since. The eps also. Had the max snow just NW of 95 a couple days ago but shifted up into central pa last night.  I’m not that interested in a minor front end snowfall that’s immediately washed away by 45 degree rain. Those storms are depressing. I want to see signs the storm stays southeast of us.  Also...in case you haven’t noticed models at range are always way too optimistic on front end frozen with a west track system. It can work but it’s rare. Models show that a lot at range but it typically is a mirage and the mid level warm layer comes blasting in before the heavy precip arrives.  Without a suppressed flow it hard to prevent that. So I was asking doc the euro make a real trend towards a meaningful frozen event or did it continue trending towards a minor front end frozen before the main storm cuts way west and we get rain?  

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17 minutes ago, HighStakes said:

Verbatim we get a couple inches of snow, then zr then heavy a cold rain. Temps get into low 40's even here by 18z friday before the front sweeps through. The run was warmer overall. Slow death  

That sounds like what I was afraid it showed. I know some might see some blue over them to start and celebrate but I don’t buy medium range guidance that shows that with a cutting system and the mid level flow is all from the south. Imo that’s unlikely to work out. I want to see signs the wave is suppressed south of us. That would be meaningful. 

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1 minute ago, clskinsfan said:

Better HP this run vs. 0Z. 1037 vs. 1034. It helps in the upper levels just enough to snow us at the start. 

The trend is the trend but verbatim its like a 2 to 5 " thump from South to north then atleast 6 to  12 hours of icing for areas NW of the metros.longer for the M/D crew . Would be a fairly sig winter storm for areas  N+W. But the trend hasn't been great for anything next week so who knows.

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1 hour ago, fujiwara79 said:

if the arctic air dumps into the south central states before trudging east, then yes that's how it works.  not all arctic outbreaks do that.  some directly target the northeast.  but we haven't had one of those in years.

look at 2004 in new england.  one of the coldest winters ever in new england.  those arctic blasts targeted them and didn't dump into the south central states at all.

True. Being off the ocean does moderate the extreme stuff. Still cold as a mofo, though. Last week the arctic outbreak over the midwest was so cold they ran out of colors on the map...the purple turned into gray, lol.

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22 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

About 36 hours ago the euro was mostly a snow to dryslot event for us and kept the snow pack destroying warm sector to our southeast. There was no rain. It’s trended warmer every run since. The eps also. Had the max snow just NW of 95 a couple days ago but shifted up into central pa last night.  I’m not that interested in a minor front end snowfall that’s immediately washed away by 45 degree rain. Those storms are depressing. I want to see signs the storm stays southeast of us.  Also...in case you haven’t noticed models at range are always way too optimistic on front end frozen with a west track system. It can work but it’s rare. Models show that a lot at range but it typically is a mirage and the mid level warm layer comes blasting in before the heavy precip arrives.  Without a suppressed flow it hard to prevent that. So I was asking doc the euro make a real trend towards a meaningful frozen event or did it continue trending towards a minor front end frozen before the main storm cuts way west and we get rain?  

Can you post a gif of the trend those always work out when you do

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About 36 hours ago the euro was mostly a snow to dryslot event for us and kept the snow pack destroying warm sector to our southeast. There was no rain. It’s trended warmer every run since. The eps also. Had the max snow just NW of 95 a couple days ago but shifted up into central pa last night.  I’m not that interested in a minor front end snowfall that’s immediately washed away by 45 degree rain. Those storms are depressing. I want to see signs the storm stays southeast of us.  Also...in case you haven’t noticed models at range are always way too optimistic on front end frozen with a west track system. It can work but it’s rare. Models show that a lot at range but it typically is a mirage and the mid level warm layer comes blasting in before the heavy precip arrives.  Without a suppressed flow it hard to prevent that. So I was asking doc the euro make a real trend towards a meaningful frozen event or did it continue trending towards a minor front end frozen before the main storm cuts way west and we get rain?  
I could careless about snowpack. I like snow on models and when its falling. After that...i dont care either way. I loved the feb 2006 event even though it melted in 5 minutes
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@Ji I was finally able to look at the run. It SUCKED. I didn’t look at the precip or pretty colors. None of those details matter at 140 hours out. This matters. 
This was 0z (which was slightly worse then the runs before even) 

09D339D3-5E66-4EB9-A6ED-FDD06DF44AC3.gif.074e5db79c9f2b44a04cfe20288438db.gif

That was a hopeful progression.  That looked like a possible frozen event here. 

This is 12z 

93ABB55B-FB1B-495B-874C-C1ED4CF85E3D.gif.4d3287ea1e191d8886530f84113dcc30.gif

thats puke. That looks like a big ass rain event. 
 

I didn’t look at the precip. I don’t care what it shows. Qpf and precip type at range is incredibly inaccurate and will adjust to climo for storm progression 90% of the time. That 12z progression was a major step towards rain from 0z regardless of what the pretty clown colors say. 

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Just now, Bob Chill said:

Psu just said it's ovah. See ya next year or the one after that or the... 

Lol. Nothings ever over. Crazy stuff happens. But I hate when people grasp for straws for false comfort. The 12z euro was way worse then 0z. Maybe not on the clown maps but in every way that actually matters. 

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If we want to grasp at real straws this pattern isn’t that bad for going into March.
49042B90-861D-4090-B44F-16E73D1EB402.thumb.jpeg.1abf8134cf042064808636e6a513ea36.jpeg

Yea the pac is puke but in March it’s less important actually. This is very close. Get slightly more NAO and suddenly systems will cut west to east under the block. You can see the eastern ridge is mostly flat already there. It’s a typical error from a good look. 

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