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December 2020 Discussion


40/70 Benchmark
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4 minutes ago, Snowstorms said:

My point was that Nina Marches are generally colder than Nino Marches due to the background ENSO state or at least they have been of late. That's all I was trying to say from the start. Snowfall is subjective because it depends on geographic location especially by March. There are exceptions but ideally you want a colder month than a warmer month. I’m not familiar with everyone’s snowfall records/averages in March. 

Oh, okay. Well, my point was that el nino winters are usually more back loaded for SNE than la nina, but the caveat being that that maybe mostly due to February. You may have a case for March temps, however, I am more confident that el nino is better for March snow in SNE than la nina. Obviously its subjetive...I am talking about SNE because I live here and its a NE subforum.

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6 minutes ago, Typhoon Tip said:

Definitely watch D9's space - 

More so than the average ... GEF individual members carrying coherent signal into 80 - 70 longitudes ... with typical spread as to geography for this range - they all have something. That in itself is sufficient at this range to warrant -

And as you/we've been noting - ongoing -AO probably not being assessed entirely correctly as to how it influences ...particularly when on-going PNA's neutral - the latter conceptually sprays buckshot Pac waves capable of getting things done, while gambling on polar boundary placements out ahead.

One other things folks, - be advised that the pattern we are being handed by the blends and individual runs is an anomalously progressive one.  "Accuracy" in timing and placement becomes premium... It's an interesting philosophical quandary of sorts...because - to me - we are above normal confidence in systems of interest, while simultaneously below the threshold of confidence in visualizing what those will entail.. 

I tend to agree with Will that an icer/mixier look for C-NNE is on the table of the weekend... But again, the D9 is red flagged and has been showing up in the EPS and GEFs with unusual coherence ... Could be a PD-model ordeal in that time span -

 

Can we get that icy mix into interior SNE? Or is it just too much to bleed the cold that far south?

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15 minutes ago, Damage In Tolland said:

Can we get that icy mix into interior SNE? Or is it just too much to bleed the cold that far south?

Short answer: Not impossible ... but low probability - 

We've obviously experienced some significant errors in handling these flat flows where open Pac waves with strong wind maxes get forced S of the Canadian lower hgts - yesterday I referred to this as 'inverse blocking' ... Whatever works, the PV or general lower heights N have a flow around the bottom ( polar jet) that prevents turning N without phasing... and the the flow is too fast to allow that... so, we end up forcing/correcting the angle of polarward turn S given time.  

Is this one of those ?   

That sort of error was more common in the mid 1990s through early 2000s... In fact, 2008 as others referenced...  Don't know about recently however.  Given to modeling "upgrades" ... Euro's had two and the GFS three since 2010 I think, in a time span where I don't even recall a -AO/neutral PNAP frenzy type patter.  In other words, this sort of scenario may not really be tested in recent winter to be blunt. 

We'll have to see... If it were not for the -AO with the arguable -NAO both in play, it'd be a different discussion entirely -

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36 minutes ago, Typhoon Tip said:

Short answer: Not impossible ... but low probability - 

We've obviously experienced some significant errors in handling these flat flows where open Pac waves with strong wind maxes get forced S of the Canadian lower hgts - yesterday I referred to this as 'inverse blocking' ... Whatever works, the PV or general lower heights N have a flow around the bottom ( polar jet) that prevents turning N without phasing... and the the flow is too fast to allow that... so, we end up forcing/correcting the angle of polarward turn S given time.  

Is this one of those ?   

That sort of error was more common in the mid 1990s through early 2000s... In fact, 2008 as others referenced...  Don't know about recently however.  Given to modeling "upgrades" ... Euro's had two and the GFS three since 2010 I think, in a time span where I don't even recall a -AO/neutral PNAP frenzy type patter.  In other words, this sort of scenario may not really be tested in recent winter to be blunt. 

We'll have to see... If it were not for the -AO with the arguable -NAO both in play, it'd be a different discussion entirely -

Like how many times would Wiz mention the word CAPE in each post.

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16 minutes ago, 40/70 Benchmark said:

Its very easy to shovel...low reality content.

My 400” average remains intact on the GGEM.

All joking aside though it had several gradient type events which would fit with NINA DEC and just the overall evolution is good to see and matches with what some of you have talked about.

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5 minutes ago, ORH_wxman said:

Euro is coming in pretty flat so far

 

Dec8_12zECMWF_108.png

Yeah ..that's a pretty striking already - 

thing is ... if/when any polar air bends around the corner it's game over for warm intrusion NE of NYC without some sort of unusually powerful S anomalous firehose .. that's precariously close there -

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