Fall Banter and General Discussion

[HIPPYVALLEY]

31 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

I'm willing to bet in a couple Fridays the endless stream of black SUVs with NY/NJ/CT plates will be racing up I-91. I can't imagine that the ski areas are expecting compliance with this otherwise why even open for the year? Have to imagine most of the revenue from the bigger resorts is from out of state guests who would not be able to quarantine in most situations. 

Yeah and many of them will be stopping in Greenfield for gas, groceries and dinner.  

[powderfreak]

36 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

I'm willing to bet in a couple Fridays the endless stream of black SUVs with NY/NJ/CT plates will be racing up I-91. I can't imagine that the ski areas are expecting compliance with this otherwise why even open for the year? Have to imagine most of the revenue from the bigger resorts is from out of state guests who would not be able to quarantine in most situations. 

Wear a mask, social distance, avoid large groups, be respectful of the situation, but beyond that it’s hard to enforce.  Meet in the middle.

[weathafella]

Heinsohn gone-part of my childhood.

 

I remember going to a basketball clinic at the old Madison Sq Garden with Bob Cousy and his youthful assistant Tommy Heinsohn.  I was about 10-12 years old.  A true renaissance man-accomplish graphic artist and of course great athlete and all around interesting character.  RIP.

[Ginx snewx]

54 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

I'm willing to bet in a couple Fridays the endless stream of black SUVs with NY/NJ/CT plates will be racing up I-91. I can't imagine that the ski areas are expecting compliance with this otherwise why even open for the year? Have to imagine most of the revenue from the bigger resorts is from out of state guests who would not be able to quarantine in most situations. 

On the cusp of unsustainable growth rate ,shutdowns to follow

[PhineasC]

54 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

I'm willing to bet in a couple Fridays the endless stream of black SUVs with NY/NJ/CT plates will be racing up I-91. I can't imagine that the ski areas are expecting compliance with this otherwise why even open for the year? Have to imagine most of the revenue from the bigger resorts is from out of state guests who would not be able to quarantine in most situations. 

That’s why the VT rules are kind of silly. The resorts are still saying “come on up” as if it’s situation normal. 

[CT Rain]

29 minutes ago, powderfreak said:

Wear a mask, social distance, avoid large groups, be respectful of the situation, but beyond that it’s hard to enforce.  Meet in the middle.

For sure. I mean everyone I know with an IKON or EPIC pass is 100% expecting to ski in VT this winter. Not even contemplating not going. 

[CT Rain]

8 minutes ago, Ginx snewx said:

On the cusp of unsustainable growth rate ,shutdowns to follow

Yeah, we're in a very bad place. There's also no appetite for shutdowns like we had in March which will make this that much harder. Thankfully outcomes are better with better treatments but man it's not going to pretty. 

[Connecticut Appleman]

Don't know economically if it is better to have a 3+/- week shutdown (would need to be on a regional basis to be effective) to try to bring this back under control or the death by a thousand paper cuts approach.

[Skivt2]

33 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

For sure. I mean everyone I know with an IKON or EPIC pass is 100% expecting to ski in VT this winter. Not even contemplating not going. 

Powder freak is right.  I have a full time condo rental in VT.  So yes.  No equity.  Just throwing money away.  And I’ve been there 4 nights in 8 months even though prior to that I lived there 165 days a year.  I work from home full time and get everything delivered to avoid people.  My husband is a full time remote student.  I have season passes and can walk about 50 years to the lift.  So we also will have parking hang tags (no reservations necessary) and no need to use a base lodge at all for any reason. Yet I’m feeling like we should not be going to Vermont because of all this.  Vermonters are very vocal about not wanting anyone out of state to go there.  I suspect that once the skiers start going and as the infection rates rise the folks there will blame the outsiders and it will be very uncomfortable to be there if you are a rule follower and care what people think.  Our condo building has a laundry mat and it’s a small condo (2 rooms -550 sq feet). If we leave our house for the condo we have to leave our food stockpile (freezers of meat and stocked non perishables - we probably have 4+ months of food on hand at least).  And I worry about running out of oil or if we have a lot of snow at our house.  Honestly, if we could be there all winter but could travel the 2 hours home for a day every few weeks without stopping along the way we could get our laundry done and resupply food without people contact.  But VT won’t allow that.  So if we go we have to stay and use common laundry facilities and go to stores which is far riskier.  The quarantine is making us WAY less safe.  I honestly stress about all this.  But I see people I know at Killington putting together their share houses same as always.  CT Appleman is right.  I think most people probably don’t even know there is a travel restriction. A woman I know from CT posted about her trip to the VT general store and yankee candle yesterday with pictures and everything.  Said she was bummed she could not stay overnight in VT because of the quarantine. She obviously thinks there is some 24 hour exemption like CT has for people coming to CT.  Part of me is ready to think we just can’t go to VT at all this year and yet I see people clearly all thinking they are just going to go for weekends etc. Who loses?  The safe person like me who is absolutely no threat to anyone and worries about the rules.

I do think the ski season could get shut down in the near future in Vermont at this rate anyway.

[HoarfrostHubb]

Good news on that Eli Lilly antiviral yesterday.  Got overshadowed by the Pfizer news.  Another tool in the arsenal 

[PhineasC]

25 minutes ago, Connecticut Appleman said:

Don't know economically if it is better to have a 3+/- week shutdown (would need to be on a regional basis to be effective) to try to bring this back under control or the death by a thousand paper cuts approach.

Hate to sound like a heartless asshole, but the deaths don’t really affect the economy. The people dying are mostly old and sick already. Not really engines of economic production. Lockdowns of healthy young workers and consumers definitely affects the economy. 

[HoarfrostHubb]

A stimulus that is well done could help with a lockdown.   Tamp down the cases for a little while.  Get us through some of the winter. 

[TauntonBlizzard2013]

4 minutes ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

A stimulus that is well done could help with a lockdown.   Tamp down the cases for a little while.  Get us through some of the winter. 

The appetite for another lockdown I think is close to zero, especially since people feel misled about timelines and what was closed or open when it happened.

Unless you plan on literally giving businesses enough money to close for x amount of time and then enough money to rehire every single employee when they can reopen, in addition to supporting citizens with real money (not a one time $1200 payment) it’ll never work.

A starting point for compliance is probably going to be thousands of dollars per month per person. 

[PhineasC]

4 minutes ago, TauntonBlizzard2013 said:

The appetite for another lockdown I think is close to zero, especially since people feel misled about timelines and what was closed or open when it happened.

Unless you plan on literally giving businesses enough money to close for x amount of time and then enough money to rehire every single employee when they can reopen, in addition to supporting citizens with real money (not a one time $1200 payment) it’ll never work.

A starting point for compliance is probably going to be thousands of dollars per month per person. 

Like some of us tried to say... the majority of Americans are simply willing to accept some level of death amongst the old and sick part of the populace in exchange for keeping their jobs, businesses, and mental health intact. It doesn’t help that the media spent six months trying to convince everyone that young people were dying from this disease in any appreciable way when it is clear to anyone paying attention that is totally false. 

[NorEastermass128]

3 minutes ago, TauntonBlizzard2013 said:

The appetite for another lockdown I think is close to zero, especially since people feel misled about timelines and what was closed or open when it happened.

Unless you plan on literally giving businesses enough money to close for x amount of time and then enough money to rehire every single employee when they can reopen, in addition to supporting citizens with real money (not a one time $1200 payment) it’ll never work.

A starting point for compliance is probably going to be thousands of dollars per month per person. 

Ain’t happening.  Extended unemployment, money for testing, targeted PPP, maybe extend the student loan deferment for a few more months is probably all we’ll muster. I doubt stimulus checks get sent out again either, especially if the Rs look to keep Senate control. Nothing happening until the next administration though I think, so February is the earliest anything will show up. Just my 2 cents. 

[CT Rain]

7 minutes ago, TauntonBlizzard2013 said:

The appetite for another lockdown I think is close to zero, especially since people feel misled about timelines and what was closed or open when it happened.

Unless you plan on literally giving businesses enough money to close for x amount of time and then enough money to rehire every single employee when they can reopen, in addition to supporting citizens with real money (not a one time $1200 payment) it’ll never work.

A starting point for compliance is probably going to be thousands of dollars per month per person. 

Unless the federal government steps up to pay bars/restaurants/etc to stay closed (which of course they should) and keep their employees whole I'm not sure what can be done. 

[NorEastermass128]

Just now, CT Rain said:

Unless the federal government steps up to pay bars/restaurants/etc to stay closed (which of course they should) and keep their employees whole I'm not sure what can be done. 

That’s basically what some EU countries did. Nationalized payroll for the spring lockdown. Not sure if their outcomes were better though. 

[PhineasC]

4 minutes ago, CT Rain said:

Unless the federal government steps up to pay bars/restaurants/etc to stay closed (which of course they should) and keep their employees whole I'm not sure what can be done. 

Paying businesses to stay open is not a sustainable approach. 

[PhineasC]

3 minutes ago, NorEastermass128 said:

That’s basically what some EU countries did. Nationalized payroll for the spring lockdown. Not sure if their outcomes were better though. 

Europe is hardly a model for us. They are not doing any better, even with stricter lockdowns and vast social welfare programs. 

[Hoosier]

1 hour ago, CT Rain said:

Yeah, we're in a very bad place. There's also no appetite for shutdowns like we had in March which will make this that much harder. Thankfully outcomes are better with better treatments but man it's not going to pretty. 

I think we are in pretty deep trouble with almost a perfect storm of factors coming together.  Rapid growth now and a series of upcoming holidays when people will be tempted to gather, even if it's in smaller numbers than usual.   

[NorEastermass128]

11 minutes ago, Hoosier said:

I think we are in pretty deep trouble with almost a perfect storm of factors coming together.  Rapid growth now and a series of upcoming holidays when people will be tempted to gather, even if it's in smaller numbers than usual.   

Agreed. I think we easily shoot past 200k cases per day by Christmas or sooner. Also, 2-2.5k deaths per day and still trending upward?  We need that vaccine. Hopefully it’s real and not just a carrot at the end of a stick to get us through the winter. 

[natedizel]

3 hours ago, HoarfrostHubb said:

A stimulus that is well done could help with a lockdown.   Tamp down the cases for a little while.  Get us through some of the winter. 

I know some people need the stimulus but im not a fan. Im in the food distribution industry and let me tell you, we could not find enough help especially with people getting an extra 600 dollars a week to sit at home. 

Nobody wanted to work. No one would show for interviews, and some people even tried to get purposely fired thinking they gonna be able to collect.

It was a mess, and the worst part is the people at home getting paid more than the essential worker who put themselves at risk for contracting the virus and keeping food on the table. 

[blizzard24]

restaurants should be open normal hours you have better chance getting the virus at a food store than restaurant and mask dont help totally support them that reason cases going  . sooner later every one will will see that . im dem i know many people dont support mask .i go out dont cover my nose will not . many people wont get the shot for or vaccine .

[Modfan2]

How do I look at rainfall amounts since October for a specific area? It has rained so much since October I have fish walking in my driveway

[RUNNAWAYICEBERG]

5 hours ago, blizzard24 said:

restaurants should be open normal hours you have better chance getting the virus at a food store than restaurant and mask dont help totally support them that reason cases going  . sooner later every one will will see that . im dem i know many people dont support mask .i go out dont cover my nose will not . many people wont get the shot for or vaccine .

Studies say otherwise:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/covid-19-superspreading-venues-restaurants.html

CDC on masks:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/10/health/masks-cdc-updated-guidance/index.html

[HoarfrostHubb]

6 hours ago, natedizel said:

I know some people need the stimulus but im not a fan. Im in the food distribution industry and let me tell you, we could not find enough help especially with people getting an extra 600 dollars a week to sit at home. 

Nobody wanted to work. No one would show for interviews, and some people even tried to get purposely fired thinking they gonna be able to collect.

It was a mess, and the worst part is the people at home getting paid more than the essential worker who put themselves at risk for contracting the virus and keeping food on the table. 

Yeah. I don’t think a stimulus like the previous one or a lockdown like earlier would be the answer.  Targeted to high risk activities and focus $$$ on businesses and industries that would be affected.   Have it be for a definite time period (3-4 weeks?) and have it decisive.      We can’t afford to stay at 100k-150k new cases and 1000+ daily deaths from this.    

[klw]

15 hours ago, powderfreak said:

Those rules were for New York, I just don’t know if they are followed or now.  But I Gotcha, yeah I’ve always agreed that a “rule” without quarantine isn’t anything.  Like telling people the state law is 65mph on the interstate but there won’t be any state troopers to enforce it, so the other drivers can sort it out themselves.

At least NY has a $10,000 fine for failure to comply or failure to even sign their form.  I guess a lot of places have some sort of travel restrictions it seems...but I just don’t have any idea if people follow it there because I’m here.  Are people taking a COVID test on entrance to NY?

This VT newspaper cartoon says it well... like the honor box at an unoccupied roadside farm stand, just put your money in the box but no one is checking if you steal.

 

Cartoon looks familiar:

Shorter but not the lowest quality video on the net like the above:

 

[Baroclinic Zone]

At this point all we can do is take all the necessary precautions to minimize/mitigate our exposure by following the basic protocols.  Pandora's box has been opened once we opened up the Country again.  We're in a transitional time until a vaccine becomes available that will reduce risk more but not eliminate it.  I fell this will become another "seasonal" virus, bit one that occurs year round.  Maybe over the long haul, we are able to build up a herd immunity, but I feel that's a long ways off.

[Lava Rock]

Apparently Maine is now the worst in the country for virus reproduction rate. Just exploding here.

[HoarfrostHubb]

3 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

Apparently Maine is now the worst in the country for virus reproduction rate. Just exploding here.

Oof.   Of course Maine had a really low floor so it will take a little while