Upstate NY Banter and General Discussion..

[BuffaloWeather]

9 minutes ago, DeltaT13 said:

Let's say they give 200 million dollars to the performing arts, which is something that has the potential to actually help normal Americans, that accounts for less than .1% of the 2 TRILLION dollar bailout but somehow you are fine with $500 BILLION (25%!!) for corporate bailouts even though these companies just got a massive tax cut and have been buying back stock like crazy.  

Either you are really bad at math or you are you awful human, because that is decimal dust in the grand scheme of it all.  I'm starting to think its the latter...

I checked out NYS budget. 5% goes to welfare. 41% goes towards Healthcare, 26% towards education. Fix those and the budget gets a lot easier to manage.

[BuffaloWeather]

35 minutes ago, WesterlyWx said:

Again though this is of tested cases which is going to skew the numbers a lot. Right now the only people getting tested at least locally are the ones with the most severe symptoms or those who have been exposed to someone with an already positive test which is very limited since there were several days that Erie County had no reagents to preform test so basically you need to either be extremely ill or have come in direct contact with the 122 in Erie county that already tested positives and show symptoms to even get tested. I know numerous people who have been in DIRECT CONTACT with someone testing positive and are now showing symptoms but because they are young they are being told they will not receive any testing and to just monitor their symptoms at home. This doesn’t even include the thousands of not hundreds or thousands that likely have the virus and are asymptomatic and will never be counted since they don’t know they have it (still dangerous, if not more dangerous to the public since they can still spread it). This is a serious serious illness and I am taking every precaution I can to protect my family but I know that these death rates are definitely skewed with lack of/testing availability.

Yes, but with any sickness/disease. You only get tested when you're showing symptoms. My mom went to the doctor with a bad sinus infection Jan 2019 that would not go away. 1 week later she had stage 4 cancer near her brain. There are lots of people walking around with cancer, hypertension, etc... that don't know about it. Only when people get symptoms do they go to the doctors. The mortality rate has to be based on those officially diagnosed with the virus, just like any disease is.

[vortmax]

9 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Yes, but with any sickness/disease. You only get tested when you're showing symptoms. My mom went to the doctor with a bad sinus infection Jan 2019 that would not go away. 1 week later she had stage 4 cancer near her brain. There are lots of people walking around with cancer, hypertension, etc... that don't know about it.

So it's very likely the true mortality rate for cancers are too high then. Similarly, until there is broad based testing for Covid 19 we won't know the true mortality rate.

Just read your edits, makes sense. 

[Buckeyes_Suck]

35 minutes ago, DeltaT13 said:

Let's say they give 200 million dollars to the performing arts, which is something that has the potential to actually help normal Americans, that accounts for less than .1% of the 2 TRILLION dollar bailout but somehow you are fine with $500 BILLION (25%!!) for corporate bailouts even though these companies just got a massive tax cut and have been buying back stock like crazy.  

Either you are really bad at math or you are you awful human, because that is decimal dust in the grand scheme of it all.  I'm starting to think its the latter...

How do the performing arts help Americans who are out of work or sick? Those corporations you hate so much are who puts Americans to work. Let all the large corporations fail and then see what happens. You are completely clueless as to how the world works. 

[lakeeffectkid383]

47 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Yes, but with any sickness/disease. You only get tested when you're showing symptoms. My mom went to the doctor with a bad sinus infection Jan 2019 that would not go away. 1 week later she had stage 4 cancer near her brain. There are lots of people walking around with cancer, hypertension, etc... that don't know about it. Only when people get symptoms do they go to the doctors. The mortality rate has to be based on those officially diagnosed with the virus, just like any disease is.

I agree with you on the symptomatic aspect, however when there are people that are showing symptoms and are still being denied testing due to very limited kits available that is still skewing the numbers. Those illnesses that you listed you can get tested/screened for if there's a concern where here you can not. You can't just say that doesn't have an effect on the total number of cases which in turn has an effect on the mortality rate... I agree with what Delta said that it seems you have a 4-5% mortality rate among those who are moderate/severely sick with this virus but I still think it's still somewhat lower because as I stated I have a friend that is very ill who's mother tested positive and now he and his father are both very sick and are trying to be tested but are told by the county that they can not be tested at this time because of their age and overall health in good condition prior to this virus and that they test need to be saved for essential personnel... 

[DeltaT13]

19 minutes ago, Luke_Mages said:

How do the performing arts help Americans who are out of work or sick? Those corporations you hate so much are who puts Americans to work. Let all the large corporations fail and then see what happens. You are completely clueless as to how the world works. 

I’m sorry but performing arts supports workers just like you mentioned and is run and supported by the average American. It also supplies a creative product that many millions of Americans enjoy and will need after months of social isolation. 

We gave corporations a 1.5 trillion dollar tax cut 2 years ago and now are going to hand them a 500 billion dollar slush fund because not a single one of them could manage to save any sort of rainy day fund.  It’s absolutely outrageous. 

And to be really specific, 200 million dollars is actually .01 percent of the total bailout. You thinking that .01% of the bailout is somehow a disgusting amount of money automatically makes you far more clueless than me. 

[Buckeyes_Suck]

5 minutes ago, DeltaT13 said:

I’m sorry but performing arts supports workers just like you mentioned and is run and supported by the average American. It also supplies a creative product that many millions of Americans enjoy and will need after months of social isolation. 

We gave corporations a 1.5 trillion dollar tax cut 2 years ago and now are going to hand them a 500 billion dollar slush fund because not a single one of them could manage to save any sort of rainy day fund.  It’s absolutely outrageous. 

And to be really specific, 200 million dollars is actually .01 percent of the total bailout. You thinking that .01% of the bailout is somehow a disgusting amount of money automatically makes you far more clueless than me. 

Yup...lets give the place that already charges up to $600 per ticket to see a show $35 Million because some politician made a promise to their constituents instead of using that $35 Million to:

• Buy respirators
• Temporary hospitals
• Uninsured patient reimbursement
• I could list 35 million things more important here

This is exactly what was meant by "drain the swamp". Complete bullshit. Your argument of being such a small percentage of an EMERGENCY STIMULUS PLAN is bullshit.

[DeltaT13]

10 minutes ago, Luke_Mages said:

Yup...lets give the place that already charges up to $600 per ticket to see a show $35 Million because some politician made a promise to their constituents instead of using that $35 Million to:

• Buy respirators
• Temporary hospitals
• Uninsured patient reimbursement
• I could list 35 million things more important here

This is exactly what was meant by "drain the swamp". Complete bullshit. Your argument of being such a small percentage of an EMERGENCY STIMULUS PLAN is bullshit.

Let’s buy those things with the 500 billion dollars set aside for the greedy corporations who can’t save a dime on their own. Can we agree on that?   I never said we shouldn’t be spending money on a strategic stockpile of medical supplies (that you would think should have already existed) 

Why do Americans get scolded and told to have a 6 month emergency saving plan yet we don’t hold corporations to the same standard.   You can’t be serious about drain the swamp either, trump is the king of swamp monsters and has brought on the swampiest pieces of shit in history. 

And this part shouldn’t even be up for debate. Conservatives are the all time pros when it comes to swampy pork barrel add ons to bills. They created that game and are working it again.  

[Buckeyes_Suck]

1 minute ago, DeltaT13 said:

Let’s buy those things with the 500 billion dollars set aside for the greedy corporations who can’t save a dime on their own. Can we agree on that?   I never said we shouldn’t be spending money on a strategic stockpile of medical supplies (that you would think should have already existed) 

Why do Americans get scolded and told to have a 6 month emergency saving plan yet we don’t hold corporations to the same standard.   You can’t be serious about drain the swamp either, trump is the king of swamp monsters and has brought on the swampiest pieces of shit in history. 

And this part shouldn’t even be up for debate. Conservatives are the all time pros when it comes to swampy pork barrel add ons to bills. They created that game and are working it again.  

Because of tax law. Corporations can’t save for a rainy day without paying tax on it. So they either give it back to the employees, stock holders, or capital investments. Only the most profitable companies have sizable cash on hand. Ideally corporations operate at a theoretical break even point. 
last I checked the money for large corporations will all have to be paid back anyways, only small businesses will have the loans forgiven. 

[tim123]

Delta is full blown socialist communist. Never goin to convince him of anything.  Orange man bad blah blah blah.

[DeltaT13]

8 minutes ago, Luke_Mages said:

Because of tax law. Corporations can’t save for a rainy day without paying tax on it. So they either give it back to the employees, stock holders, or capital investments. Only the most profitable companies have sizable cash on hand. Ideally corporations operate at a theoretical break even point. 
last I checked the money for large corporations will all have to be paid back anyways, only small businesses will have the loans forgiven. 

I’d also like to add that they know the government will bail them out when anything bad happens.  

I just feel if there was ever a time when you would think big corps could survive several tough months it would be right now.  Economy was roaring and they just got massive tax cuts. Sad state of affairs.

[DeltaT13]

Just now, tim123 said:

Delta is full blown socialist communist. Never goin to convince him of anything.  Orange man bad blah blah blah.

Orange man is an idiot.

Socialism is good.

Not sure where communism comes in other than you probably don’t understand what socialism is and are confusing the two.

Do you know what this bailout is.......socialism!!  

[Buckeyes_Suck]

Just now, DeltaT13 said:

I’d also like to add that they know the government will bail them out when anything bad happens.  

I just feel think if there was ever a time when you would think big corps could survive several tough months it would be right now.  Economy was roaring and they just got massive tax cuts. Sad state of affairs.

The big benefit of the economy doing so well is that we’re about to basically print $2T and inflation isn’t going to skyrocket nor the dollar tank against global currency. So if there’s a silver lining...

 

[Hoosier]

Popped over here to read this thread and, well, this is why we try to avoid political discussions on this site.  

I realize that it is hard to keep politics completely out of the discussion about the virus, but please try to keep your posts focused on the virus as much as possible.   

[tim123]

Actually what our government has become is fascism. Government corporations. ****ing everyone over. Been this way for a long time. Just now it's out in open.

[vortmax]

In light of the current virus situation, it's smart to both support the American people directly via checks and unemployment boosters, as well as providing incentives to both small and large corporations to keep their employees by supplementing a percentage of their income. It takes a large amount of cash ($500B+) to do this - in order to keep things as close to normal as possible when this virus is behind us. Even the Democrats will support this...all the other stuff is just partisan fluff and not necessary at this time. I think there should've been a part 1 and part 2 with the partisan fluff in part 2.

[WNash]

3 hours ago, DeltaT13 said:

Let's say they give 200 million dollars to the performing arts, which is something that has the potential to actually help normal Americans, that accounts for less than .1% of the 2 TRILLION dollar bailout but somehow you are fine with $500 BILLION (25%!!) for corporate bailouts even though these companies just got a massive tax cut and have been buying back stock like crazy.  

Either you are really bad at math or you are you awful human, because that is decimal dust in the grand scheme of it all.  I'm starting to think its the latter...

Not going to bother unhiding the original that you are responding to, but Boeing is getting 20x the money that all the arts are getting, and the failure that led to their financial ruin has absolutely nothing to do with COVID-19.

[WNash]

4 hours ago, tim123 said:

Its serious but so are heart attacks and car crashes. 6600 deaths on any normal day. Going to have to find a balance here. What is concerning in the numbers out of china. That's not helping situation. They are lying out there asses about cases and deaths. 

Does it really need to be explained to you that car crashes and heart attacks don’t increase exponentially every few days?

[WNash]

Not the least bit surprising that the same crew that for years has screamed about how many people have been killed by “socialism” are dismissive of the enormity of the death toll caused by forcing a return to capitalism far before we have flattened the curve.

[WNash]

1 hour ago, Hoosier said:

Popped over here to read this thread and, well, this is why we try to avoid political discussions on this site.  

I realize that it is hard to keep politics completely out of the discussion about the virus, but please try to keep your posts focused on the virus as much as possible.   

Unless we’re talking about virology, there are no non-political facts to discuss. Somehow, a small elite desperate to ensure they stay ungodly richer than everyone else is ignoring epidemiology and the scale under which the healthcare system can operate without breaking down.

[cleetussnow]

3 hours ago, DeltaT13 said:

Let's say they give 200 million dollars to the performing arts, which is something that has the potential to actually help normal Americans, that accounts for less than .1% of the 2 TRILLION dollar bailout but somehow you are fine with $500 BILLION (25%!!) for corporate bailouts even though these companies just got a massive tax cut and have been buying back stock like crazy.  

Either you are really bad at math or you are you awful human, because that is decimal dust in the grand scheme of it all.  I'm starting to think its the latter...

Pretty brutal.  It’s pork, but we won’t get bills passed without pork, no matter what the national emergency is.  I’m from a small town but 200 million is a lot of money.  Seems like a bailout to me, so I won’t judge. 

If corporations don’t get a backstop there won’t be any jobs for people to return to.  My wife is a teacher and her pension will go bust.  Yes public employees own massive massive pieces of those corporations and without them...they aren’t any public pension systems period.  My wife is a huge stakeholder in American corporations.. and she works for the government! 

If you don’t  like corporations it’s easy to resolve....all you have to do is stop buying Nike, iPhones, Fords, band aids, soap, tape, carpet, gas, food, etc.  no big deal. Then you are good.  You make the necessities yourself like soap, and grow food.

An alternative is to get in on it!  Go buy a share of Apple for example.  Let’s say you like iPhones but the company is too greedy.  Well, you get an envelope in the mail each year and you get to vote on who’s on the board!  You can decide if they are too greedy.  It’s YOUR money.  If you don’t like how it goes, sell it and get a Samsung.  It’s pretty democratic actually, and amazing you have that right as a shareholder.  

[Buckeyes_Suck]

34 minutes ago, WNash said:

Not going to bother unhiding the original that you are responding to, but Boeing is getting 20x the money that all the arts are getting, and the failure that led to their financial ruin has absolutely nothing to do with COVID-19.

I don’t agree with Boeing getting a bailout. 

[wolfie09]

In several hours on Tuesday, Dr. Ashley Bray performed chest compressions at Elmhurst Hospital Center on a woman in her 80s, a man in his 60s and a 38-year-old who reminded the doctor of her fiancé. All had tested positive for the coronavirus and had gone into cardiac arrest. All eventually died.

Elmhurst, a 545-bed public hospital in Queens, has begun transferring patients not suffering from coronavirus to other hospitals as it moves toward becoming dedicated entirely to the outbreak. Doctors and nurses have struggled to make do with a few dozen ventilators. Calls over a loudspeaker of “Team 700,” the code for when a patient is on the verge of death, come several times a shift. Some have died inside the emergency room while waiting for a bed.

A refrigerated truck has been stationed outside to hold the bodies of the dead. Over the past 24 hours, New York City’s public hospital system said in a statement, 13 people at Elmhurst had died.

Continue reading

[rochesterdave]

3 hours ago, tim123 said:

Actually what our government has become is fascism. Government corporations. ****ing everyone over. Been this way for a long time. Just now it's out in open.

And when the democrats try and reign in the corporations, in favor of the worker, you fail to recognize it. I’m sorry Tim but you honestly represent the base Trump voter: uneducated, angry, reactionary and easily deceived into voting opposite your self interest. 
Our government isn’t fascist. Throwing about reckless proclamations, such as that, is counter productive to having anyone take you seriously. Really. 

[BuffaloWeather]

US arguing over $1200 stimulus payment to pay my mortgage for one month.

UK:

Unveiling an unprecedented intervention by the state in the British economy, finance minister Rishi Sunak told reporters that the government will cover 80% of worker salaries for at least the next three months up to a maximum of £2,500 ($2,900) a month, which is more than the average income.

CANADA:

The bill would give C$2,000 a month for the next four months for people who lost their job because of Covid-19. It would apply to people who are quarantined, helping a sick family member, have been laid off or have not received payment from their employer.

NORWAY:

After 17 days without an income, the government will step in and ensure payments of 80 per cent of the average income the person has had for the last three years (up until income level equivalent to an annual salary of around 600 000 NOK). Rights to child care benefits and sick leave have also been improved.

The day after, on Tuesday, the government said they would find temporary ways of also covering the 17 days without income.

Parents who have to look after their children because kindergartens and schools are closed will receive child care benefits from NAV, the Norwegian Labour and Welfare Administration. Where previously each parent to a child below the age of 12 years old could take ten days off to care for a sick child – this has been increased to 20 days and can be used by parents who now have to stay home with their children.

On Tuesday March 17, the government also announced that parents will not have to pay for kindergarten and after-school-care for the duration of these institutions being closed due to the coronavirus. The kindergartens will continue to receive government funding, so as to not have to lay off any staff.

 

[wolfie09]

Don't forget about the unemployment package.. This is huge for people that lose their job at no fault of their own..My girl for example would bring home more if she was fully laid off for a couple months lol

(CNN)In a historic expansion of unemployment insurance, the federal government would give jobless workers an extra $600 a week on top of their state benefits for four months as part of the $2 trillion stimulus deal lawmakers agreed to early Wednesday.

"It has unemployment insurance on steroids," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer said Tuesday of the package. "But, and most importantly, the federal government will pay your salary, your full salary for now four months."

While the extra money in the deal wouldn't fully replace the lost wages of some higher-paid workers, it would significantly add to everyone's regular state benefits, which range from $200 to $550 a week, on average, depending on the state.

However, several Republican senators raised objections Wednesday to the jobless benefits provision, saying it would provide larger checks to unemployed workers than they would receive in wages.

 

 

"This bill pays you more not to work than if you were working," said South Carolina Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham. "You're literally incentivizing taking people out of the workforce at a time when we need critical infrastructure supplied with workers. If this is not a drafting error, then it's the worst idea I've seen in a long time."

[BuffaloWeather]

33 minutes ago, wolfie09 said:

Don't forget about the unemployment package.. This is huge for people that lose their job at no fault of their own..My girl for example would bring home more if she was fully laid off for a couple months lol

(CNN)In a historic expansion of unemployment insurance, the federal government would give jobless workers an extra $600 a week on top of their state benefits for four months as part of the $2 trillion stimulus deal lawmakers agreed to early Wednesday.

"It has unemployment insurance on steroids," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer said Tuesday of the package. "But, and most importantly, the federal government will pay your salary, your full salary for now four months."

While the extra money in the deal wouldn't fully replace the lost wages of some higher-paid workers, it would significantly add to everyone's regular state benefits, which range from $200 to $550 a week, on average, depending on the state.

However, several Republican senators raised objections Wednesday to the jobless benefits provision, saying it would provide larger checks to unemployed workers than they would receive in wages.

 

 

"This bill pays you more not to work than if you were working," said South Carolina Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham. "You're literally incentivizing taking people out of the workforce at a time when we need critical infrastructure supplied with workers. If this is not a drafting error, then it's the worst idea I've seen in a long time."

Did this get approved? Had no idea about this. My wife would make more too and the health insurance is under me so we would actually benefit from this. I take what I said back.

Looks like NYS max unemployment is $504 per week, with the $600 it would equate to $1104 per week if you qualify for maximum benefits.

The New York State Department of Labor (NYSDOL) determines your weekly unemployment benefit amount by dividing your earnings for the highest paid quarter of the base period by 26, up to a maximum of $504 per week.

$13,100/26=$504

So you'd need to make $52,400 per year to get the max unemployment.

 

[BuffaloWeather]

Per week checks:

$20,000: $192+600= $792

$30,000: $288+600= $888

$40,000: $385+600=$985

$50,000: $481+600=$1,081

Anything above $52,400 you get $504+600=$1,104

[wolfie09]

Looks like it BW, part of the agreed upon stimulus package.. It's also up to 39 weeks instead of 26..

Min wage workers only come home with like $350 a week lol

The stimulus bill is giving a federally funded weekly pay boost to those who are unemployed. 

In addition to regular state unemployment insurance, individuals will receive an additional $600 per week for up to four months. In total, unemployed workers will receive 39 weeks of unemployment benefits, which will carry them through to the end of 2020.

State unemployment benefits vary from state to state but averaged $385 a week nationwide in January. Adding the $600 boost included in the stimulus package would bring an average weekly unemployment check to $985, which exceeds the median weekly earnings of $936 in the fourth quarter. (Women had median weekly earnings of $843; men took home a median of $1,022.) 

Source

 

[BuffaloWeather]

1 minute ago, wolfie09 said:

Looks like it BW, part of the agreed upon stimulus package.. It's also up to 39 weeks instead of 26..

Min wage workers only come home with like $350 a week lol

The stimulus bill is giving a federally funded weekly pay boost to those who are unemployed. 

In addition to regular state unemployment insurance, individuals will receive an additional $600 per week for up to four months. In total, unemployed workers will receive 39 weeks of unemployment benefits, which will carry them through to the end of 2020.

State unemployment benefits vary from state to state but averaged $385 a week nationwide in January. Adding the $600 boost included in the stimulus package would bring an average weekly unemployment check to $985, which exceeds the median weekly earnings of $936 in the fourth quarter. (Women had median weekly earnings of $843; men took home a median of $1,022.) 

Source

 

Every state is different in the way its calculated and what you receive. This map is outdated. NY is $504