Upstate NY Banter and General Discussion..

[Syrmax]

7 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

What happens over there should stay over there. Cut off all travel on flights that connect to the middle east and ban all passengers from that country from international travel. 

i hear you...though not sure such sanctions will mean much in that place.  It's not like the average Afghani Taliban supporter is shopping online at Amazon or taking vacations in St. Tropez.  This is probably a big win for Iran and assuredly Putin will seek to exploit it as well.  Pakistan's government probably not thrilled either, or at least their military who tend to step in to right the ship every so often, so to speak.

[BuffaloWeather]

15 minutes ago, Syrmax said:

i hear you...though not sure such sanctions will mean much in that place.  It's not like the average Afghani Taliban supporter is shopping online at Amazon or taking vacations in St. Tropez.  This is probably a big win for Iran and assuredly Putin will seek to exploit it as well.  Pakistan's government probably not thrilled either, or at least their military who tend to step in to right the ship every so often, so to speak.

Yeah I don't know the correct method of solving the middle east issue. I'd say the majority of those living there do not want the Taliban in power. My friends who toured over there all said the Afghan people all hugged them when they came to their cities. It's a sad situation, especially for women. I'd rather be dead than a women over there right now. 

[Buckeyes_Suck]

1 hour ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Well all the trump supporters wanted our troops to come home, Biden agreed and look what happens. It's a bipartisan issue, both are blaming the other side as usual. Did you see what the taliban has now? 100+ humvees, tanks, enough weapons and ammo for decades of fighting. They interviewed a few leaders over there already and want Islamic law worldwide, but they are "patient". 9/11 take two is a matter of when not if. 

Didn't trump have some sort of peace agreement with the taliban? 

I don't want to dive too far into politics but it seems like things were much more manageable under the prior policies. Now you literally have people clinging to C17s and falling to their deaths to escape the country. At first glance this seems like a bigger failure than Vietnam.

[vortmax]

7 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Yeah I don't know the correct method of solving the middle east issue. I'd say the majority of those living there do not want the Taliban in power. My friends who toured over there all said the Afghan people all hugged them when they came to their cities. It's a sad situation, especially for women. I'd rather be dead than a women over there right now. 

Yeah, seeing all the citizens running to the America planes to get the heck outta there is a sure sign of that. Sharia Law implementation will suck for just about everyone except those in power: public hangings, subordinate women, killing of all who oppose Islam, Western-hate propaganda, and 'educating' children to birth future terrorists. Just dandy.

[BuffaloWeather]

Just now, Luke_Mages said:

Didn't trump have some sort of peace agreement with the taliban? 

I don't want to dive too far into politics but it seems like things were much more manageable under the prior policies. Now you literally have people clinging to C17s and falling to their deaths to escape the country. At first glance this seems like a bigger failure than Vietnam.

I am not well versed over there, but I know 2 close friends/family members that are ruined for life due to that war and all for nothing. Trump paraded about bringing home the troops for years so it would have eventually led to the same result? I doubt a peace treaty was only with trump and not with the United States. Does the treaty break due to him not winning reelection? 

[Buckeyes_Suck]

Just now, BuffaloWeather said:

I am not well versed over there, but I know 2 close friends/family members that are ruined for life due to that war and all for nothing. Trump paraded about bringing home the troops for years so it would have eventually led to the same result? I doubt a peace treaty was only with trump and not with the United States. Does the treaty break due to him not winning reelection? 

No but a change in policy would have. The moment the treaty was broken military force should have been used.

[BuffaloWeather]

1 hour ago, Luke_Mages said:

No but a change in policy would have. The moment the treaty was broken military force should have been used.

I expect our military thought after 20 years of training the Afghan army would at least put up a fight. It all happened so quickly, they didn't even attempt to stop them. Something doesn't add up. 

[BuffaloWeather]

Just a side point but here I am worried about bringing microspikes on a vacation out west while people are throwing themselves at the wheels of planes attempting to get out of their country. Never forget how well we have it here. 

[BuffaloWeather]

My friend threatened to quit being a Physican Assistant if they did this. The only exception is medical or religious reasons. 

https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-announces-covid-19-vaccination-mandate-healthcare-workers

[Syrmax]

46 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

I expect our military thought after 20 years of training the Afghan army would at least put up a fight. It all happened so quickly, they didn't even attempt to stop them. Something doesn't add up. 

Good read from Matt Taibbi (as usual)...not sure if its paywalled  by substack.  HIghlights:

Afghanistan: We Never Learn

As the Taliban waltzes into Kabul, the look of surprise on the faces of top officials should frighten us most of all

Secretary of State Anthony Blinken, when asked months ago about the possibility that there might be a “significant deterioration” of the security picture in Afghanistan once the United States withdrew its forces, said, “I don’t think it’s going to be something that happens from a Friday to a Monday.”

 

Blinken’s Nostradamus moment was somehow one-upped by that of his boss, Joe Biden, who on July 8th had the following exchange with press:

Q: Your own intelligence community has assessed that the Afghan government will likely collapse.

BIDEN: That is not true, they did not reach that conclusion… There is going to be no circumstance where you see people lifted off the roof of an embassy… The likelihood that you’re going to see the Taliban overrunning everything and owning the whole country is highly unlikely.

 

[Syrmax]

A fair chunk of the rest of Taibbi's piece:

The pattern is always the same. We go to places we’re not welcome, tell the public a confounding political problem can be solved militarily, and lie about our motives in occupying the country to boot. Then we pick a local civilian political authority to back that inevitably proves to be corrupt and repressive, increasing local antagonism toward the American presence.

In response to those increasing levels of antagonism, we then ramp up our financial, political, and military commitment to the mission, which in turn heightens the level of resistance, leading to greater losses in lives and treasure. As the cycle worsens, the government systematically accelerates the lies to the public about our level of “progress.”

Throughout, we make false assurances of security that are believed by significant numbers of local civilians, guaranteeing they will later either become refugees or targets for retribution as collaborators. Meanwhile, financial incentives for contractors, along with political disincentives to admission of failure, prolong the mission.

This all goes on for so long that the lies become institutionalized, believed not only by press contracted to deliver the propaganda (CBS’s David Martin this weekend saying with a straight face, “Everybody is surprised by the speed of this collapse” was typical), but even by the bureaucrats who concocted the deceptions in the first place.

The look of genuine shock on the face of Tony Blinken this weekend as he jousted with Jake Tapper about Biden’s comments from July should tell people around the world something important about the United States: in addition to all the other things about us that are dangerous, we lack self-knowledge.

Even deep inside the machine of American power, where everyone paying even a modicum of attention over the last twenty years should have known Kabul would fall in a heartbeat, they still believe their own legends. Which means this will happen again, and probably sooner rather than later.

 

[vortmax]

Great read and very true. Everyone in the government should complete a Belbin profile for some self - realization. 

Massive disconnect in our government is frightening. Much more than Delta. 

[BuffaloWeather]

8 minutes ago, vortmax said:

Great read and very true. Everyone in the government should complete a Belbin profile for some self - realization. 

Massive disconnect in our government is frightening. Much more than Delta. 

How much could we give every american above 18 years old if we dedicated 3 trillion to our people? About 10-12k? 

[StormfanaticInd]

4 hours ago, Syrmax said:

354 deaths attributed to Covid-19 from 1/1/20 till 8/11/21 in the 0-17 y.o. demographic per CDC tracking...gonna take a looooooong time if you think mortality is going to be increased much by the 0-17 y.o. age group...

It is just starting to affect this age group seriously. Hopefully it doesn't get too bad

[DeltaT13]

55 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

My friend threatened to quit being a Physican Assistant if they did this. The only exception is medical or religious reasons. 

https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-announces-covid-19-vaccination-mandate-healthcare-workers

And she should quit.  If she doesnt believe the science she shouldnt be treating people.  If I found out the medical staff treating me weren't following medical science I'd ask for someone else.  

[BuffaloWeather]

7 minutes ago, DeltaT13 said:

And she should quit.  If she doesnt believe the science she shouldnt be treating people.  If I found out the medical staff treating me weren't following medical science I'd ask for someone else.  

Its a dude and he makes 130k a year working 3 days a week, I'll believe it when I see it. Georgia is requiring the same thing by Oct. 1st. 

[DeltaT13]

4 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Its a dude and he makes 130k a year working 3 days a week, I'll believe it when I see it. Georgia is requiring the same thing by Oct. 1st. 

Man those PA positions are cushy (sometimes).  I have 2 friends that are PA's.  Mid 20's, work a few days a week in orthopedics.  Making about 120k a year.  What a gig.   

Back to the main point though, I should say that mandates are big deal and the gov't should be cautious with them, but I would assume most of the medical community would trust the peer reviewed science that says the vaccines are pretty damn safe.  We are 18-19 months since clinical trials began and there really isn't anything damning that has come out.  If the FDA gives full approval, it's going to get a lot harder to avoid getting the shot.   All I know is that I'm glad I'm not making these decisions right now, what a shit show we are in.  

[Buckeyes_Suck]

25 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Its a dude and he makes 130k a year working 3 days a week, I'll believe it when I see it. Georgia is requiring the same thing by Oct. 1st. 

I doubt they'd follow through. Hiring PA's and MDs is hard enough. Imagine the public shit show that firing all of the medical staff who were unvaccinated would create when the primary reason for vaccines/masks is to flatten the curve and not overwhelm said medical staff...

[Syrmax]

1 hour ago, BuffaloWeather said:

My friend threatened to quit being a Physican Assistant if they did this. The only exception is medical or religious reasons. 

https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-announces-covid-19-vaccination-mandate-healthcare-workers

I could see a concern about unknown long term effects from vaccines, particularly this one,...witness the 1976 Swine Flue vaccine disaster. But at this point...one would think any unknown adverse reactions would have surfaced.  We do know that about 12,000 have apparently died as a direct, or indirect result of taking C19 vaccines in the US.  But... in the context of what, 150+M total doses administered, seems like its the usual very low risk (~ 0.008% using my rough #s).

For those of you that weren't around or don't remember the Government Flu (h/t The Dead Kennedys)... Here is some interesting reading.  The "Science" isn't always as settled as some would have us believe...

[BuffaloWeather]

3 minutes ago, Syrmax said:

I could see a concern about unknown long term effects from vaccines...witness the 1976 Swine Flue vaccine disaster. But at this point...one would think any unknown adverse reactions would have surfaced.  We do know that about 12,000 have apparently died as a direct, or indirect result of taking C19 vaccines in the US.  But... in the context of what, 150+M total doses administered, seems like its the usual very low risk (~ 0.008% using my rough #s).

For those of you that weren't around or don't remember the Government Flu (h/t The Dead Kennedys)... Here is some interesting reading.  The "Science" isn't always as settled as some would have us believe...

wow first time hearing about this. 

[BuffaloWeather]

16 minutes ago, Luke_Mages said:

I doubt they'd follow through. Hiring PA's and MDs is hard enough. Imagine the public shit show that firing all of the medical staff who were unvaccinated would create when the primary reason for vaccines/masks is to flatten the curve and not overwhelm said medical staff...

I just know back in middle school they put a hard date on if I didn't have the hepatitis b shots I couldn't step foot in school. 

[Syrmax]

7 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

I just know back in middle school they put a hard date on if I didn't have the hepatitis b shots I couldn't step foot in school. 

Yeah, I don't think legal challenges to vax mandates will hold water.  At least not for schools, universities where many already require some form of Vax proof against certain diseases.  I actually have a problem with religious exemptions. What has gone on down near, and in, NYC amongst the Hassidic Jewish population with Covid 19 (and other recent disease outbreaks) is Example A of why religious objections should carry no weight when they can, and have, been repeatedly shown to affect the larger public health & safety.

[Buckeyes_Suck]

13 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

I just know back in middle school they put a hard date on if I didn't have the hepatitis b shots I couldn't step foot in school. 

UB was/is the same way. 

[Buckeyes_Suck]

[Syrmax]

2 hours ago, Luke_Mages said:

I wonder what the covid numbers will be like in Afghanistan now. The population will be "safe" at least!  I'm assuming this means Afghanistan comes off of the CDCs do not travel list now? 

[StormfanaticInd]

84,739 hospitalizations

[brentrich]

1 hour ago, StormfanaticInd said:

84,739 hospitalizations

So still think we need a lockdown? 

[StormfanaticInd]

16 minutes ago, brentrich said:

So still think we need a lockdown? 

A good argument could be made for one. Especially come fall and winter 

[StormfanaticInd]

As contagious as this variant is we are going to need about 85-90 percent vaccination 

[wolfie09]

“State law allows marijuana use anywhere tobacco use is permitted,” Bullard said. “Smoking is not permitted in Fairgrounds buildings or in the open concert venues at Chevy Court and Chevy Park but is allowed elsewhere outdoors. We encourage those who smoke to be considerate of others around them.”