Coronavirus

[NEOH]

41 minutes ago, A-L-E-K said:

get a load of this narc^

 I own the business -- these are people I pay. Can't imagine what your %'s would be - 90% internet trolling? 

[Stebo]

1 hour ago, NEOH said:

  You watch too many sitcoms. What type of environment do you work in?! So instead of wasting time IN the office (see examples above), many employees are now losing productivity OUT of the office with the many distractions at home. As a business owner I will say that employees are more productive in the office. This may be somewhat unique to my industry but we have software to track employee productivity -- and it has fallen off of a cliff since people started working from home. There's just no disputing the reporting I receive. 

They have done studies on this for years, and people who work from home are statistically 8-12% more productive, so your anecdote doesn't match actual studies.

[A-L-E-K]

that's why i get the big bucks

[Stebo]

1 hour ago, IWXwx said:

This graph from the New York Times shows that our subforum sucks.

It's only going to get much worse after that state supreme court ruling for Michigan that nullified the EOs of Whitmer. I am already seeing more people not wearing masks.

[JoMo]

Europe is locking back down in places as they have had tremendous spikes there recently. Germany just recorded their highest # since the pandemic began. https://news.yahoo.com/germany-sees-6-638-daily-035339283.html

France just declared a public health emergency.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-france-emergency/france-declares-public-health-state-of-emergency-over-covid-19-idUSKBN26Z2PQ

[A-L-E-K]

500k here we come!

[BuffaloWeather]

Lots of videos showing up in Europe of pre lockdown parties in the streets and bars. Everyone around the world is experiencing covid fatigue. 

[Guest ovweather]

10 hours ago, Inverted_Trough said:

 

But some people argued that T-cell memory was the reason the virus basically disappeared from NYC and other northern states.  I thought that was bunk - the real reason is seasonality.  There appears to be a strong seasonal component to this virus.  I mentioned back in July how the Southern Hemisphere (and southern latitudes of the US) had most of the cases.  As the seasons change in the northern latitudes, cases are now decreasing in Brazil, India and South Africa, but drastically increasing in the northern US as well as Europe.

As far as how it relates to being asymptomatic....I'm not sure about that either.  I think the amount of viral exposure (viral load) has more to do with whether someone becomes symptomatic.  There also appears to be more symptomatic cases right now, compared to back over the summer.

Think about this scenario - 3 people are in the same small room together for the same amount of time. One of these people is positive for Covid, the other two aren’t. A week later, one of the two is now positive and has developed symptoms of Covid. The other person also tests positive but has no symptoms and never develops any. Why? Could it be because of their current health / immune system status? Maybe T-cell memory at work? Maybe genetics? Being exposed to a high viral load doesn’t necessarily mean one will get sick. There are so many other variables at play.

[madwx]

I think the biggest lesson is that you can't completely eradicate the disease in western societies, so the big goals are the slow the spread by encouraging mask wearing, not allowing mass gatherings and letting people who can work from home work from home and other common sense measures to keep hospital numbers down

[Snowstorms]

3 minutes ago, BuffaloWeather said:

Lots of videos showing up in Europe of pre lockdown parties in the streets and bars. Everyone around the world is experiencing covid fatigue. 

It's been a long year. Everyone, including myself, are tired of Covid. It's been negatively impacting everyone's mental health. We're limited to what we can do due to various restrictions and at the same time, too afraid to do the things that we are allowed to do with the fear we may encounter someone who has the virus. 

[dan11295]

40 minutes ago, JoMo said:

Europe is locking back down in places as they have had tremendous spikes there recently. Germany just recorded their highest # since the pandemic began. https://news.yahoo.com/germany-sees-6-638-daily-035339283.html

France just declared a public health emergency.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-france-emergency/france-declares-public-health-state-of-emergency-over-covid-19-idUSKBN26Z2PQ

Unlike the spring, eastern Europe is also being significant impacted now. 8,000 cases in Poland today, almost 10k in Czechia yesterday.

[NEOH]

1 hour ago, Stebo said:

They have done studies on this for years, and people who work from home are statistically 8-12% more productive, so your anecdote doesn't match actual studies.

Are there any recent studies that take into account home schooling kids, having significant others at home, etc? I'd be surprised if they still showed increased productivity. 

[Stebo]

1 minute ago, NEOH said:

Are there any recent studies that take into account home schooling kids, having significant others at home, etc? I'd be surprised if they still showed increased productivity. 

The things you listed weren't related to either of those things though...

[dta1984]

1 hour ago, Stebo said:

They have done studies on this for years, and people who work from home are statistically 8-12% more productive, so your anecdote doesn't match actual studies.

You need to look at data during the covid era.  There are studies that support both.  It depends of course on the home life of the employee, integrity, the business etc.   

His data is based on his business, so I wouldn't say it doesn't match.  Data is data. 

[NEOH]

13 minutes ago, dta1984 said:

You need to look at data during the covid era.  There are studies that support both.  It depends of course on the home life of the employee, integrity, the business etc.   

His data is based on his business, so I wouldn't say it doesn't match.  Data is data. 

Yep. Pre-COVID data really doesn't hold up. The point I was trying to make is that it is even harder for employees to work/focus from home with kids, spouses, etc. around -- now throw in all of the other time they waste on the items I posted and its not a recipe for success. 

[OSUmetstud]

Mental health issues/stress are quite high right now. That in of itself would cause productivity loss. 

[StormfanaticInd]

Another record day here in Indiana with 1962 cases. This virus is taking off everywhere now

[nwohweather]

2 hours ago, Stebo said:

They have done studies on this for years, and people who work from home are statistically 8-12% more productive, so your anecdote doesn't match actual studies.

Nah I have to disagree with your rebuttal. You can be more productive from home, but with kids and the wife working there as well, that goes out the window. I've always worked from home periodically, especially after days of travel, but this is unlike anything I've ever done with everyone removed and distanced.

Also co-worker cohesion seems to be going down, I've noticed some HEATED arguments lately that would have never happened if we were all still together. Being in your own space all the time makes it easier to be combative.

[WestMichigan]

2 hours ago, Stebo said:

It's only going to get much worse after that state supreme court ruling for Michigan that nullified the EOs of Whitmer. I am already seeing more people not wearing masks.

MDHHS issued basically the same thing as Gov. Whitmer had in place.  Nothing has changed other than where the source of the mandate is coming from.  There are even penalties associated with the MDHHS order.  The governor and legislature are even working together now to pass laws.  I know that you don't like that but that is the way it is supposed to work.

[Stebo]

1 minute ago, WestMichigan said:

MDHHS issued basically the same thing as Gov. Whitmer had in place.  Nothing has changed other than where the source of the mandate is coming from.  There are even penalties associated with the MDHHS order.  The governor and legislature are even working together now to pass laws.  I know that you don't like that but that is the way it is supposed to work.

Except that isn't a law and will be brought to the court as well plus you already have people reacting to the last decision as if the MDHHS thing doesn't exist. When the state legislation came out against every EO and wanted things open they compromised their position as well. I will always side on the side of safety in this state as would the other 60% of people who agreed with Whitmer's EOs.

[Hoosier]

51 minutes ago, StormfanaticInd said:

Another record day here in Indiana with 1962 cases. This virus is taking off everywhere now

Statewide, we will be at April level hospitalizations/ICU numbers soon at the rate we are going.  Right now it is at mid-May levels.

[A-L-E-K]

go big or go home

[Hoosier]

I wonder how bad the Spanish flu fatigue was back then.  I'm sure it existed, but I feel like people as a whole are more impatient now.  

Of course there were things going on with the Spanish flu that would've really been frightening, like having so many young/healthy people dying.  Plus it was hard to keep up with the amount of deaths... there were literally bodies piling up in some instances.  My great grandma -- who I don't even think was 30 at the time -- and her baby died and were buried in the same casket.  

[OSUmetstud]

[Hoosier]

A big 4k spot in Illinois cases today.

[nwohweather]

57 minutes ago, Hoosier said:

I wonder how bad the Spanish flu fatigue was back then.  I'm sure it existed, but I feel like people as a whole are more impatient now.  

Of course there were things going on with the Spanish flu that would've really been frightening, like having so many young/healthy people dying.  Plus it was hard to keep up with the amount of deaths... there were literally bodies piling up in some instances.  My great grandma -- who I don't even think was 30 at the time -- and her baby died and were buried in the same casket.  

I remember reading about it in the Toledo Blade. People were doing the same exact things, traveling way out of town just to go to saloons and what not.

https://www.toledoblade.com/news/medical/2018/12/08/the-spanish-flu-epidemic-that-shut-down-toledo-1918/stories/20181206003

[Hoosier]

Italy rising very dramatically as well.

[StormfanaticInd]

We may hit 65k cases today.

[Inverted_Trough]

7 hours ago, NEOH said:

  You watch too many sitcoms. What type of environment do you work in?! So instead of wasting time IN the office (see examples above), many employees are now losing productivity OUT of the office with the many distractions at home. As a business owner I will say that employees are more productive in the office. This may be somewhat unique to my industry but we have software to track employee productivity -- and it has fallen off of a cliff since people started working from home. There's just no disputing the reporting I receive. 

Okay, Boomer. 

My company's productivity skyrocketed once we went to full time telework.  Which wasn't surprising to me.  Numerous studies have been conducted recently (i.e. during Covid) that showed higher productivity with remote work.

That being said, some face-to-face collaboration is valuable.  Going into the office once in a while for some team building, face-to-face collaboration, or just a change in scenery, is probably the best overall approach in terms of productivity and engagement.

But the idea of requiring your workforce to spend hours per day commuting to a centralized office location, to do the same tasks that - thanks to technology -- can be done at home, is ridiculous.  For most office workers, working from home should have been the modus operandi ten years ago.  The reason that many companies have been resistant to embrace this is because you still have many baby boomers in executive management positions.  They hold onto this belief that "work" is only done if they can physically "see" you in the office.  That dogmatic belief is simply based on  the nature of office work back in the 1970s and 1980s.  Their resistance is cultural, and not based on evidence or the realities of today.

 

[NEOH]

3 minutes ago, Inverted_Trough said:

Okay, Boomer. 

My company's productivity skyrocketed once we went to full time telework.  Which wasn't surprising to me.  Numerous studies have been conducted recently (i.e. during Covid) that showed higher productivity with remote work.

That being said, some face-to-face collaboration is valuable.  Going into the office once in a while for some team building, face-to-face collaboration, or just a change in scenery, is probably the best overall approach in terms of productivity and engagement.

But the idea of requiring your workforce to spend hours per day commuting to a centralized office location, to do the same tasks that - thanks to technology -- can be done at home, is ridiculous.  For most office workers, working from home should have been the modus operandi ten years ago.  The reason that many companies have been resistant to embrace this is because you still have many baby boomers in executive management positions.  They hold onto this belief that "work" is only done if they can physically "see" you in the office.  That dogmatic belief is simply based on  the nature of office work back in the 1970s and 1980s.  Their resistance is cultural, and not based on evidence or the realities of today.

 

But I'm woke, Bruh.  ... kids these days. 

Personally, I don't care if someone works in a tree house as long as they get the job done. I don't there are many companies requiring anyone to come to an office. A balanced approach as you mentioned is ideal. The only issue is when someone tells me they are scared to come to the office because of COVID -- like its chasing them around when the leave their home. Unless you have a very valid (health) reason to be scared that is a non-starter.