The 2020 Lesco & Lawn Thread

[Baroclinic Zone]

This is my ongoing list of plants I'm looking into.  Some I already have in my yard.  I'm going to wait till the Fall at this point to plant anything given we are in the middle of our dry season.

Plants/Shrubs for year round color

Spring:

Plum/Cherry

Crocus

Forsythia

Daffodils/Jonquils

Hyacinths

Iris

Forsythia

Lilac

Quince

Kousa Dogwood

Carpet Phlox

Wegeila

Bleeding Heart

Summer:

Astilbe

Hosta

Rhododendron

Azalea

Roses

Hydrangea

Summersweet

Coneflower

Black-eyed Susan

Day Lilies

Aster

Sage

Gayfeather

Lavender

Shasta Daisy

Bee Balm

Tenor Phlox

Butterfly Bush

Fall

Ornamental Grasses

Mums

Violets

Dianthus

Burning Bush

Barberry

Winter

Winterberry

Purple Beautyberry

Red Twig Dogwood

[CoastalWx]

My hydrangea exploded this year. Tons of blooms after 3 years of very little blooms. Maybe it just needed a few years to mature.

[OceanStWx]

6 minutes ago, Baroclinic Zone said:

Those look good.  I'm looking to start designing plantings that I want for my front beds that were just done.  I'm looking to have year round color/interest thru flowers,shrubs.

I tried to do the "wave of color" through the seasons. Lily of the valley and azalea bloom early, spirea late June-ish, and Hydrangea the rest of the year. All cultivars I picked to grow generally 4-5 ft tall and wide and not block our pinched windows in the front.

I also have a running list of things I'd like in the yard. 

[dendrite]

I have like 25-30 bees at any one time on my bee balm patch right now. 

[TauntonBlizzard2013]

33 minutes ago, CoastalWx said:

My hydrangea exploded this year. Tons of blooms after 3 years of very little blooms. Maybe it just needed a few years to mature.

They do... first few years not too much.

[tamarack]

1 hour ago, Baroclinic Zone said:

This is my ongoing list of plants I'm looking into.  Some I already have in my yard.  I'm going to wait till the Fall at this point to plant anything given we are in the middle of our dry season.

Kousa Dogwood

Red Twig Dogwood

I don't know if nurseries handle the native flowering dogwood - it often suffers from an anthracnose disease that is frequently fatal, so it may be quarantined.  IMO it's even a nicer tree than the Kousa - blossoms at least as pretty and spectacular burgundy/purple fall color punctuated by bright red clusters of "berries" plus a unique "blocky" bark.  (I may be biased as I grew up living on aptly-named Dogwood Trail in NNJ.)

If red twig dogwood is the same species as the common red-osier dogwood, plant it only in places where you can easily control its spread, which is often done by runners extending through the duff (or mulch).

[Baroclinic Zone]

1 minute ago, tamarack said:

I don't know if nurseries handle the native flowering dogwood - it often suffers from an anthracnose disease that is frequently fatal, so it may be quarantined.  IMO it's even a nicer tree than the Kousa - blossoms at least as pretty and spectacular burgundy/purple fall color punctuated by bright red clusters of "berries" plus a unique "blocky" bark.  (I may be biased as I grew up living on aptly-named Dogwood Trail in NNJ.)

If red twig dogwood is the same species as the common red-osier dogwood, plant it only in places where you can easily control its spread, which is often done by runners extending through the duff (or mulch).

Yeah, I have a Kousa now.  It's done wonderfully.  Blooms a bit later then other Dogwoods I see around.  Nice white blooms with some tinges of pink in there.  Fruit is red as well.

Looks like red-twig is the same species.  I had one when I lived in Middleboro and I just loved the bright red in WInter.

https://www.mortonarb.org/trees-plants/tree-plant-descriptions/red-osier-dogwood

[backedgeapproaching]

6 hours ago, dendrite said:

I have like 25-30 bees at any one time on my bee balm patch right now. 

I picked up 3 bee balm plants late last year on sale for $3 at a local nursery l, forget the name, but they're pink and loaded with bees also. Nice to see.

[dendrite]

1 hour ago, backedgeapproaching said:

I picked up 3 bee balm plants late last year on sale for $3 at a local nursery l, forget the name, but their pink and loaded with bees also. Nice to see.

I planted mine in early June of 2017. Then and 3 years later.

[DavisStraight]

5 hours ago, Baroclinic Zone said:

Yeah, I have a Kousa now.  It's done wonderfully.  Blooms a bit later then other Dogwoods I see around.  Nice white blooms with some tinges of pink in there.  Fruit is red as well.

Looks like red-twig is the same species.  I had one when I lived in Middleboro and I just loved the bright red in WInter.

https://www.mortonarb.org/trees-plants/tree-plant-descriptions/red-osier-dogwood

Thats what I have, nice white flowers when it blooms, the last one in my yard to bloom, some years I get a ton of fruit, I have about 5 wheelbarrows full one yrear. I read they make a jelly in Asia out of the fruit.

[S&P]

Looking at pics of folks tomato plants , I notice it doesn’t look like people remove the suckers-so plant doesn’t waste  energy producing foliage vice fruit. My dad and grandad taught me to remove the suckers , anyone else do that so you have 2-3 main stems? 

[JC-CT]

12 hours ago, S&P said:

Looking at pics of folks tomato plants , I notice it doesn’t look like people remove the suckers-so plant doesn’t waste  energy producing foliage vice fruit. My dad and grandad taught me to remove the suckers , anyone else do that so you have 2-3 main stems? 

It depends on how you grow them. If you remove the suckers then you can have plants closer together without overcrowding, and that can also make sense from a disease management perspective (less foliage on each plant). But suckers on tomato plants don't actually suck any energy from the plant and they become fruit-bearing growth stems themselves. So all things being equal, a plant that hasn't been pruned will produce more lbs of fruit than one with the suckers removed, by a considerable amount.

[OceanStWx]

I'm in the midst of thinking about how to finish off parts of my yard. I have a swampy area that ideally would be populated by more interesting plants than currently growing there. Thinking of trying to get something like cardinal flower growing in there. Ideally I'd love to put something like quaking aspen or tamarack in there to add to the interest in the fall/winter mixed in with the alder already growing.

But I'm also trying to hedge off the swap from the lawn by low shrubs. I'm think some swamp azalea would probably do well, and maybe a shadblow serviceberry or two. They would frame my Henry Hicks magnolia I just planted this season.

Down the side of the house the swamp becomes a drainage ditch, and I think I'd like to add a wall along that (won't be retaining just decorative). That will frame the wildflower bed nicely I think and give me a convenient place to manage the weeds in the ditch from. 

[dendrite]

I have some willows that really soak up the excess water.

Eek suggested bald cypress to me once. That would be really good in a swampy location and the flare of the trunk can get pretty interesting near standing water.

[tamarack]

1 hour ago, OceanStWx said:

I'm in the midst of thinking about how to finish off parts of my yard. I have a swampy area that ideally would be populated by more interesting plants than currently growing there. Thinking of trying to get something like cardinal flower growing in there. Ideally I'd love to put something like quaking aspen or tamarack in there to add to the interest in the fall/winter mixed in with the alder already growing.

But I'm also trying to hedge off the swap from the lawn by low shrubs. I'm think some swamp azalea would probably do well, and maybe a shadblow serviceberry or two. They would frame my Henry Hicks magnolia I just planted this season.

Down the side of the house the swamp becomes a drainage ditch, and I think I'd like to add a wall along that (won't be retaining just decorative). That will frame the wildflower bed nicely I think and give me a convenient place to manage the weeds in the ditch from.  

Quaking aspen doesn't do well in swampy areas, though it would probably persist there.  Balsam poplar, its cousin, tolerates wet feet better but I'm not sure it would be available.  Maybe some native red maple?  Then with the ones in front you would have fall colors from late August in the swamp to near the end of October toward the street.  I'd be wary of baldcypress unless one can find a cultivar that's proven hardy this far north of its native range.  Either northern white cedar (sometimes sold as arborvitae) or the less common Atlantic white cedar are wetland approved.

To respond to S&P's query on pruning tomatoes, I've always pruned to a single stem unless growing paste tomatoes, which don't get pruned or staked.  In my location, "soon" comes before "many", as first frost date averages Sept. 19.  About 3 weeks from today I'll pinch off the top to prevent our cherry tomatoes (only kind I'm growing currently) from setting any more fruit, so that those already set have a better chance of ripening in time. 

[OceanStWx]

34 minutes ago, tamarack said:

Quaking aspen doesn't do well in swampy areas, though it would probably persist there.  Balsam poplar, its cousin, tolerates wet feet better but I'm not sure it would be available.  Maybe some native red maple?  Then with the ones in front you would have fall colors from late August in the swamp to near the end of October toward the street.  I'd be wary of baldcypress unless one can find a cultivar that's proven hardy this far north of its native range.  Either northern white cedar (sometimes sold as arborvitae) or the less common Atlantic white cedar are wetland approved.

To respond to S&P's query on pruning tomatoes, I've always pruned to a single stem unless growing paste tomatoes, which don't get pruned or staked.  In my location, "soon" comes before "many", as first frost date averages Sept. 19.  About 3 weeks from today I'll pinch off the top to prevent our cherry tomatoes (only kind I'm growing currently) from setting any more fruit, so that those already set have a better chance of ripening in time. 

It's a tough area to figure out, because it's quite wet in the spring and can at times retain water in the winter if it's a big rainfall/snowmelt combo. But when it dries out it's dry, so the drainage I think it pretty efficient. It tends to stay moist longer because we collect all the runoff from the neighborhood. So even several days after a rain there will still be running water through the active drainage part of the area.

[dendrite]

Our Lowes actually had some american sweetgum trees this spring. They're native to our area. I'm trying some dawn redwoods in pots from seed...they're another zone 5 tweener that can handle some wetter periods. Everything I've seen on bald cypress is zone 4 or higher, but I'll defer to tamarack on that for real world verification. I like the red maple idea. You could just get some basic native red maple from arbor day...

https://shop.arborday.org/shade-trees

...or just check the 1/2 off sales at the box stores in the coming weeks. Or find one you like this fall somewhere and try to dig it up and transplant it when it goes dormant. I've had trouble transplanting trees into wet areas in the cold season though. You'd need to support it well.

[OceanStWx]

2 minutes ago, dendrite said:

Our Lowes actually had some american sweetgum trees this spring. They're native to our area. I'm trying some dawn redwoods in pots from seed...they're another zone 5 tweener that can handle some wetter periods. Everything I've seen on bald cypress is zone 4 or higher, but I'll defer to tamarack on that for real world verification. I like the red maple idea. You could just get some basic native red maple from arbor day...

https://shop.arborday.org/shade-trees

...or just check the 1/2 off sales at the box stores in the coming weeks. Or find one you like this fall somewhere and try to dig it up and transplant it when it goes dormant. I've had trouble transplanting trees into wet areas in the cold season though. You'd need to support it well.

That's my problem, I'll have a hard time getting back there so it will need to be fairly self sufficient. I also have half a mind to pick some favorite ideas and try and start as seed and transplant early on and see what happens. Then I won't be out much money if it doesn't work out.

I could easily do that with my maples when they put down seed.

[tamarack]

1 hour ago, dendrite said:

Our Lowes actually had some american sweetgum trees this spring. They're native to our area. I'm trying some dawn redwoods in pots from seed...they're another zone 5 tweener that can handle some wetter periods. Everything I've seen on bald cypress is zone 4 or higher, but I'll defer to tamarack on that for real world verification. I like the red maple idea. You could just get some basic native red maple from arbor day...

https://shop.arborday.org/shade-trees

...or just check the 1/2 off sales at the box stores in the coming weeks. Or find one you like this fall somewhere and try to dig it up and transplant it when it goes dormant. I've had trouble transplanting trees into wet areas in the cold season though. You'd need to support it well.

Two surprises in that post, though I don't doubt either.  First, that sweetgum is native at 42-43 north.  There was none at all in the woods around our NNJ home - first ones I ever saw were planted where my in-laws retired in CNJ, though its absence 50 miles to the north may be cultural history more than forest ecology.  Sweetgum has bright red fall colors, though IMO not as vibrant as red maple.  (No shame in trailing #1.)  It also has abundant and slightly prickly 1" diameter seed balls reminiscent of sycamore, so some serious yardwork, perhaps.  2nd surprise is baldcypress rated at Zone 4, though it's native to southern Illinois which probably gets to -20 now and again.  Since Chris is probably Zone 5B, it might be a good if unusual choice.  I don't think it's native in the East north of coastal Virginia. 

[dendrite]

Oops...was thinking black gum as the native. The trees at Lowes were definitely sweetgum though.

As for the bald cypress, apparently there's a healthy one all the way up in Jefferson, NH.

https://extension.unh.edu/fwt/bigtrees/admin/reports/report_docs/bigtree_rep_champ.cfm

A vertical height of 21ft isn't exactly "big" though.

If anyone wants some northern catalpa come on over and get some. They need to be transplanted from one of my big fabric pots. It's cost Legro a NWS weighing gauge though.

[OceanStWx]

27 minutes ago, dendrite said:

Oops...was thinking black gum as the native. The trees at Lowes were definitely sweetgum though.

As for the bald cypress, apparently there's a healthy one all the way up in Jefferson, NH.

https://extension.unh.edu/fwt/bigtrees/admin/reports/report_docs/bigtree_rep_champ.cfm

A vertical height of 21ft isn't exactly "big" though.

If anyone wants some northern catalpa come on over and get some. They need to be transplanted from one of my big fabric pots. It's cost Legro a NWS weighing gauge though.

Don't tempt me.

[tamarack]

20 minutes ago, dendrite said:

Oops...was thinking black gum as the native. The trees at Lowes were definitely sweetgum though.

As for the bald cypress, apparently there's a healthy one all the way up in Jefferson, NH.

https://extension.unh.edu/fwt/bigtrees/admin/reports/report_docs/bigtree_rep_champ.cfm

A vertical height of 21ft isn't exactly "big" though.

If anyone wants some northern catalpa come on over and get some. They need to be transplanted from one of my big fabric pots. It's cost Legro a NWS weighing gauge though.

Black gum does fine in both wetlands and better drainage.  Very nice fall color and unique right-angle twigs/branches.  Farthest north I've seen it is Gardiner but supposedly it can be found in the Kennebec Valley up to WVL.  That Jefferson tree is proof that in the right place one can get away with planting something far north of its natural range.  There's a 30"+ by 75' tulip poplar in Farmington at Perham and High Streets.  It's on a gentle slope and right in town.

[dendrite]

I have a bunch of pawpaw seedlings started as well. They can handle zone 5 temps and are native to S MI and W NY...we'll see how they do in C NH this winter. They produce the largest fruit from any tree native to the US. They tend to grow as an understory in river and stream bottoms and can handle the occasional wet feet flooding. It's about as close to a tropical fruit tree as we get near this latitude of North America. I can't wait to get fruit from mine.

omnomnom

 

[S&P]

20 hours ago, JC-CT said:

It depends on how you grow them. If you remove the suckers then you can have plants closer together without overcrowding, and that can also make sense from a disease management perspective (less foliage on each plant). But suckers on tomato plants don't actually suck any energy from the plant and they become fruit-bearing growth stems themselves. So all things being equal, a plant that hasn't been pruned will produce more lbs of fruit than one with the suckers removed, by a considerable amount.

Yeah I don’t remove all of them , let some go . But most agree if you don’t manage them it will rob nutrients. This article talks about what type of tomatoes your growing, I grow indeterminate and stake them .

https://www.thespruce.com/should-you-prune-out-tomato-suckers-1403290

 

[tamarack]

14 hours ago, dendrite said:

I have a bunch of pawpaw seedlings started as well. They can handle zone 5 temps and are native to S MI and W NY...we'll see how they do in C NH this winter. They produce the largest fruit from any tree native to the US. They tend to grow as an understory in river and stream bottoms and can handle the occasional wet feet flooding. It's about as close to a tropical fruit tree as we get near this latitude of North America. I can't wait to get fruit from mine.

omnomnom

 

Looks a bit larger than Osage orange, though it's close.  And of course if one counts cones as "fruit" (they're the seed-bearers, just like fruit) several western pines produce far larger.  Sugar, Jeffrey, digger pines have cones that dwarf pawpaw and Osage orange. 

[dendrite]

Tamarack holding me to a higher standard of information.

Largest edible fruit tree native to the US (some sources say continent). 

[tamarack]

5 hours ago, dendrite said:

Tamarack holding me to a higher standard of information.

Largest edible fruit tree native to the US (some sources say continent). 

With those conditions pawpaw stands alone.     Osage orange smells citrusy but is inedible.

[OceanStWx]

I'm trying to ID what's in my bottomland/swampy area first to see what I want to keep, and second to see what might match well with it for planting.

So far I think I've got smooth alder (my best guess because their leaves are not as serrated as other species, have a ton of this), southern arrowwood (I can only find one of these), there is a type of willow but I have yet to pin down the species (more of a shrub than a tree at this point). All make sense for a wet area.

I'm pretty sure about 25 yard back in the thicket is an ash tree. I would love to figure out which type (especially if I can do anything to keep the EAB away). I'll probably have to wait until fall to get back in there though and ID some of the trees on the back edge of the property. It's just too thick for me to get through currently.

[Baroclinic Zone]

9 minutes ago, OceanStWx said:

I'm trying to ID what's in my bottomland/swampy area first to see what I want to keep, and second to see what might match well with it for planting.

So far I think I've got smooth alder (my best guess because their leaves are not as serrated as other species, have a ton of this), southern arrowwood (I can only find one of these), there is a type of willow but I have yet to pin down the species (more of a shrub than a tree at this point). All make sense for a wet area.

I'm pretty sure about 25 yard back in the thicket is an ash tree. I would love to figure out which type (especially if I can do anything to keep the EAB away). I'll probably have to wait until fall to get back in there though and ID some of the trees on the back edge of the property. It's just too thick for me to get through currently.

Did you try using the Picture This App?

https://www.picturethisai.com/

[OceanStWx]

Just now, Baroclinic Zone said:

Did you try using the Picture This App?

https://www.picturethisai.com/

I've been using iSeek but I may try that one too.