Autumn/Winter 2019-2020 Banter/Complaint Thread

[RogueWaves]

6 minutes ago, Snowstorms said:

The total accumulated precip map looks the same too. Legit not even a clipper or a fantasy 360 hr storm. 

GOOD! Since those are just a stupid tease anyways. Now for once, the GFS is telling the truth..

[Gino27]

1 hour ago, weatherbo said:

Columbus climo is s**t to begin with tho.

Tell me about it...

[Stebo]

1 hour ago, Snowstorms said:

The total accumulated precip map looks the same too. Legit not even a clipper or a fantasy 360 hr storm. 

Yeah you don't want it dry this time of year either, that can have a negative feedback with moisture transport especially if it is widespread.

[Hoosier]

1 hour ago, Stebo said:

Yeah you don't want it dry this time of year either, that can have a negative feedback with moisture transport especially if it is widespread.

Happy days are here again

[Stebo]

1 hour ago, Hoosier said:

Happy days are here again

Hell I'm just happy to see something. Having a July pattern in December is garbage.

[buckeye]

9 hours ago, Gino27 said:

Another classic Central Ohio bust. These storms are getting creative on screwing us over nowadays.

Meh, I think we picked up 2" with the Sunday night portion, advisory was 2-4, so technically...

Last night's part 2 was definitely a bust but it looks like it was a widespread bust for the northern portion of this.  I wonder if all the severe stuff down south stole the thunder up north...or is that just an old meteorologists wives tale.

[buckeye]

9 hours ago, weatherbo said:

Columbus climo is s**t to begin with tho.

I know, right.... I moved here because I was told Columbus was a snow town, I'm so p*ssed.   

I just hope the person advising me to move to the back woods of the UP for economic opportunity isn't bullsh*tting me too.

[beavis1729]

3 hours ago, buckeye said:

I know, right.... I moved here because I was told Columbus was a snow town, I'm so p*ssed.   

I just hope the person advising me to move to the back woods of the UP for economic opportunity isn't bullsh*tting me too.

Meh...economic opportunity is overrated.  Of course, in our capitalistic and materialistic "grow grow grow" society, we've been conditioned to care about this over more important things...like nature, peace of mind, quality of life, family, community, relationships, etc.  I'm not immune to this either - our family is staying in the Chicago suburbs because of decent jobs, even though the quality of life and noise pollution is miserable.  So, I can definitely relate to what you're saying...but my point is that it shouldn't be important.  Our society forces us to make these choices, and pits people against each other, just to survive.  Probably not the best way to go about life.

Anyway...the big issue facing 90% of us in this sub-forum is that we've been deluded into thinking that we actually have a winter season.  We don't.  As much as it drives me crazy and I wish it were different...those are just the facts.  You really need to be around 45N in the plains and eastern lakes in order to have sustained winter.  The numbers don't lie.  Where I'm located at 42N, our normal high even in the depth of winter is 30F...meaning that, in January, a 40F day is just as likely as a 20F day.  That's not acceptable.  And it's even worse in mid-Dec and mid-Feb.  Lakes and ponds don't freeze reliably here.  That isn't winter.  Sure, we have bouts of wintry weather and can see some big storms once in awhile...but those are events, not a long/sustained/consistent wintry season.  Of course our winters are better than many populated areas in the world...but those are relative comparisons.  What matters for sustained winter are absolute numbers, not how we compare to Dallas or Seattle or London.  Of course those places have crappy winters, and we all know that...but it doesn't make ours any better.  

It would be much easier on all of us if we ignored the media and the general public's lies about our "brutally cold winters"...and instead stick together and rely on the facts.  We have a great community here, but it feels like we argue with each other all the time.  If we all just admit that winters are horrible south of 45N, it will make things a **** of a lot easier.  We actually know about our crappy winter climo on this board...but unfortunately 99% of people have no ******* clue.  Just human nature, I suppose...but it's maddening.  It's even more frustrating because the winter gradient in the midwest is so stark.  150 miles due north of my location generally has deep winter in most years...and 200 miles pretty much all years.  So close, yet so far.    

[buckeye]

1 minute ago, beavis1729 said:

Meh...economic opportunity is overrated.  Of course, in our capitalistic and materialistic "grow grow grow" society, we've been conditioned to care about this over more important things...like nature, peace of mind, quality of life, family, community, relationships, etc.  I'm not immune to this either - our family is staying in the Chicago suburbs because of decent jobs, even though the quality of life and noise pollution is miserable.  So, I can definitely relate to what you're saying...but my point is that it shouldn't be important.  Our society forces us to make these choices, and pits people against each other, just to survive.  Probably not the best way to go about life.

Anyway...the big issue facing 90% of us in this sub-forum is that we've been deluded into thinking that we actually have a winter season.  We don't.  As much as it drives me crazy and I wish it were different...those are just the facts.  You really need to be around 45N in the plains and eastern lakes in order to have sustained winter.  The numbers don't lie.  Where I'm located at 42N, our normal high even in the depth of winter is 30F...meaning that, in January, a 40F day is just as likely as a 20F day.  That's not acceptable.  And it's even worse in mid-Dec and mid-Feb.  Lakes and ponds don't freeze reliably here.  That isn't winter.  Sure, we have bouts of wintry weather and can see some big storms once in awhile...but those are events, not a long/sustained/consistent wintry season.  And, of course our winters are better than many populated areas in the world...but those are relative comparisons.  What matters for sustained winter are absolute numbers, not how we compare to Dallas or Seattle or London.  Of course those places have crappy winters, and we all know that...but it doesn't make ours any better.  

It would be much easier on all of us if we ignored the media and the general public's lies about our "brutally cold winters"...and instead stick together and rely on the facts.  We have a great community here, but it feels like we argue with each other all the time.  If we all just admit that winters are horrible south of 45N, it will make things a **** of a lot easier.  We actually know about our crappy winter climo on this board...but unfortunately 99% of people have no ******* clue.  Just human nature, I suppose...but it's maddening.  It's even more frustrating because the winter gradient in the midwest is so stark.  150 miles due north of my location generally has deep winter in most years...and 200 miles pretty much all years.  So close, yet so far.    

It's not about chasing the almighty dollar.  It is possible to love what you do, but only have an opportunity to do it in certain climates.   I literally could not have my business in a place where winter was 9 months out of the year and there are more moose than people.   

All that aside, I guess I'm a weenie, but not a finatic.   I love snow storms and a couple of weeks of snow cover in the depth of winter....but that's it.  Regardless of economics, I could never live in a place where the snow cover is deep and consistent for months on end....I'd be busting down a bathroom door with an axe yelling 'here's Johnny' in no time.  It would ruin snow for me.   What keeps me hungry is the fact that it isn't common in the first place, every 6"+ snow storm is essentially a novelty down here....and that's perfectly fine.     

[michsnowfreak]

Beavis has beat this horse so many times, I feel like we always go round and round with the same discussion. The bottom line, Chicago/Detroit have more winter than 80% of the country, and yes, that winter is much much less severe than the far North. Bo lives in a Winter Haven. It's like a snow orgasm. I go up North every winter for a trip and I absolutely LOVE it. The scenery is gorgeous and the snow depth is insane. And  I love snow more than anyone I know. Would I want to live there? Absolutely not. I am much more like Buckeye from aspect of needing civilization and to make a nice living. If anything, opposite of beavis thoughts, I feel very fortunate to live in a place that does have decent winters. This December and its lack of snow is not normal, but neither was the cold and heavy snow of November.  But over all, I will take my climate and economy over the beauty but desolation/economic depression of much of the far North. To each their own, and I am sure better times lie ahead for us all the remainder of Winter. Saturday is the first official day of astronomical winter.

[Cary67]

35 minutes ago, michsnowfreak said:

Beavis has beat this horse so many times, I feel like we always go round and round with the same discussion. The bottom line, Chicago/Detroit have more winter than 80% of the country, and yes, that winter is much much less severe than the far North. Bo lives in a Winter Haven. It's like a snow orgasm. I go up North every winter for a trip and I absolutely LOVE it. The scenery is gorgeous and the snow depth is insane. And  I love snow more than anyone I know. Would I want to live there? Absolutely not. I am much more like Buckeye from aspect of needing civilization and to make a nice living. If anything, opposite of beavis thoughts, I feel very fortunate to live in a place that does have decent winters. This December and its lack of snow is not normal, but neither was the cold and heavy snow of November.  But over all, I will take my climate and economy over the beauty but desolation/economic depression of much of the far North. To each their own, and I am sure better times lie ahead for us all the remainder of Winter. Saturday is the first official day of astronomical winter.

I look forward to these types of posts. Its like holiday tradition watching  Lampoons Christmas Vacation or a Christmas Story. The lamenting of disappointing climate is part of weather ritual just as putting up the tree,hanging lights, or caroling.

[mimillman]

Wow what a god awful December 

[Jonger]

Jesus. Looks like we're going to pay for last years good winter. Just canceled 2 weekend trips to the U.P. 

All Michigan snow will be wiped out.

[IWXwx]

On 12/14/2019 at 3:33 PM, cyclone77 said:

The last half of January is gonna be rockin'!

FYP

[Snowstorms]

While some of us are dealing with a snowless and uneventful December, parts of the NE and New England are having one of their snowiest Decembers, lol. Quite the contrast. 

 

 

[Hoosier]

33 minutes ago, Snowstorms said:

While some of us are dealing with a snowless and uneventful December, parts of the NE and New England are having one of their snowiest Decembers, lol. Quite the contrast. 

 

 

And there was the recent OV storm.  The thing about Nino/Ninoish Decembers is that the snow works out sometimes but it's harder to pull off a cold and snow combination in December... there are exceptions of course.

[WestMichigan]

I found where the snow went - Mount Rainier.

Today

Snow, mainly after 10am. The snow could be heavy at times. High near 16. Wind chill values between -3 and -8. Windy, with a southwest wind 25 to 31 mph, with gusts as high as 40 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. Total daytime snow accumulation of 19 to 25 inches possible.

Tonight

Snow. The snow could be heavy at times. Temperature rising to around 17 by 11pm. Wind chill values between -4 and -9. Very windy, with a southwest wind 60 to 70 mph decreasing to 46 to 56 mph after midnight. Winds could gust as high as 90 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 37 to 43 inches possible.

Friday

Snow. The snow could be heavy at times. High near 17. Wind chill values between -5 and -10. Windy, with a southwest wind 40 to 45 mph decreasing to 33 to 38 mph in the afternoon. Winds could gust as high as 60 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 37 to 43 inches possible.

Friday Night

Snow. The snow could be heavy at times. Low around 13. Wind chill values between -2 and -7. Windy, with a south southwest wind 34 to 36 mph, with gusts as high as 46 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 33 to 39 inches possible.

Saturday

Snow. The snow could be heavy at times. High near 16. Windy, with a southwest wind 31 to 39 mph, with gusts as high as 50 mph. Chance of precipitation is 90%. New snow accumulation of 10 to 14 inches possible.

Saturday Night

Snow likely, mainly before 10pm. The snow could be heavy at times. Cloudy, with a low around 7. Breezy. Chance of precipitation is 70%. New snow accumulation of 3 to 7 inches possible.

Sunday

A 40 percent chance of snow. Mostly cloudy, with a high near 12. New snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches possible.

[michsnowfreak]

1 hour ago, Snowstorms said:

While some of us are dealing with a snowless and uneventful December, parts of the NE and New England are having one of their snowiest Decembers, lol. Quite the contrast. 

 

 

Theyve had several storms but i didnt realize any location was having one of their snowiest. 

[Snowstorms]

18 minutes ago, michsnowfreak said:

Theyve had several storms but i didnt realize any location was having one of their snowiest. 

I was just scrolling through the New England forum and saw that this December is one of their top snowiest, not the snowiest ever. Some places are around 25-30+" already, lol. 

As Hoosier said, Nino Decembers are hit or miss unlike Nina's. 

 

[Stebo]

5 minutes ago, Snowstorms said:

I was just scrolling through the New England forum and saw that this December is one of their top snowiest, not the snowiest ever. Some places are around 25-30+" already, lol. 

As Hoosier said, Nino Decembers are hit or miss unlike Nina's. 

 

I would check historical numbers vs the sensationalism that is the NE subforum.

[Hoosier]

20 minutes ago, Stebo said:

I would check historical numbers vs the sensationalism that is the NE subforum.

It must be n/w of the big cities.  BOS has 11.5" this month... a nice total but not into elite territory.

[Snowstorms]

3 minutes ago, Hoosier said:

It must be n/w of the big cities.  BOS has 11.5" this month... a nice total but not into elite territory.

Yeah Worcester has 25.3" this month. Seems like elite territory. It would be for most of us in the Lakes region. 

 

[slow poke]

6 hours ago, Jonger said:

Jesus. Looks like we're going to pay for last years good winter. Just canceled 2 weekend trips to the U.P. 

All Michigan snow will be wiped out.

Funny how people can look at things so differently when it comes to weather. Just talking MI I thought last winter was “ok” at best except for the UP snow belts. Even there the season started a little later then normal I thought but once it got going it was good up there. The season seemed really short to me, about mid January to early March, in the lower even though snow fall was about average from West Branch north. Down state I thought the winter was really bad if you’re a fan of cold and snow. We had a cold outbreak in January for a little bit but I don’t remember anything other then that actually. As far as the snow being wiped out in the UP, I think they’ll be ok up there, they have a really good deep base already. I bet you would be fine to still go up and ride for the foreseeable future. Just my take but again, everyone looks at things different. 

[vpbob21]

1 hour ago, Snowstorms said:

Yeah Worcester has 25.3" this month. Seems like elite territory. It would be for most of us in the Lakes region. 

 

Right, 25.3" is a whole season down here in Ohio.  I had 24" total all last winter.

 

[RogueWaves]

11 minutes ago, slow poke said:

Funny how people can look at things so differently when it comes to weather. Just talking MI I thought last winter was “ok” at best except for the UP snow belts. Even there the season started a little later then normal I thought but once it got going it was good up there. The season seemed really short to me, about mid January to early March, in the lower even though snow fall was about average from West Branch north. Down state I thought the winter was really bad if you’re a fan of cold and snow. We had a cold outbreak in January for a little bit but I don’t remember anything other then that actually. As far as the snow being wiped out in the UP, I think they’ll be ok up there, they have a really good deep base already. I bet you would be fine to still go up and ride for the foreseeable future. Just my take but again, everyone looks at things different. 

It was bad. Sustained winter was a 3-4 week period from Jan 18th into Feb, but even that included a mega-torch on the heals of the PV visit, so using the word "sustained" is questionable at best. Snowfall totals for the season were/are extremely misleading due to a snowy (but useless) November and scattered minor hits after mid-Feb. I felt like an Ohioan

[michsnowfreak]

2 hours ago, slow poke said:

Funny how people can look at things so differently when it comes to weather. Just talking MI I thought last winter was “ok” at best except for the UP snow belts. Even there the season started a little later then normal I thought but once it got going it was good up there. The season seemed really short to me, about mid January to early March, in the lower even though snow fall was about average from West Branch north. Down state I thought the winter was really bad if you’re a fan of cold and snow. We had a cold outbreak in January for a little bit but I don’t remember anything other then that actually. As far as the snow being wiped out in the UP, I think they’ll be ok up there, they have a really good deep base already. I bet you would be fine to still go up and ride for the foreseeable future. Just my take but again, everyone looks at things different. 

 Last Winter was not anything special in the snow department, but I cannot believe how many ice storms we had in the Detroit area. We never get ice storms and we had 3 or 4 last year.  The late January historic cold snap is absolutely something engrained in my memory, but it will be the only thing i remember from that Winter years down the road, everything else was forgettable, especially with so many heavy snow records set the past 20 years.  With a snowy November and another late Spring, it definitely seemed like a long Winter, however for most of December into the 1st half of January, Winter was a no show except for the usual mood flakes.  The 2017-18 Winter was a much much much snowier Winter here in Detroit.  In the UP however, last Winter was epic for snowpack, even more so epic when you consider it was wiped out before Christmas in most spots.  Last Winter I finished with just 31.9" of snow, which I'm not complaining about because we can let the spotlight go elsewhere sometimes, but I have noticed that even though we are part of the Midwest, usually what's good for the Western Midwest ismt great for us and what's great for us sucks for the Western Midwest lol. I got 62.5" of snow of the Winter before when much of the Midwest thought it was a blah Winter

[slow poke]

1 minute ago, michsnowfreak said:

 Last Winter was not anything special in the snow department, but I cannot believe how many ice storms we had in the Detroit area. We never get ice storms and we had 3 or 4 last year.  The late January historic cold snap is absolutely something engrained in my memory, but it will be the only thing i remember from that Winter years down the road, everything else was forgettable, especially with so many heavy snow records set the past 20 years.  With a snowy November and another late Spring, it definitely seemed like a long Winter, however for most of December into the 1st half of January, Winter was a no show except for the usual mood flakes.  The 2017-18 Winter was a much much much snowier Winter here in Detroit.  In the UP however, last Winter was epic for snowpack, even more so epic when you consider it was wiped out before Christmas in most spots.

Good point snowfreak about the UP rebuilding their crazy deep snow depths after many areas were down to very little snow starting January out with. At our place at Higgins Lake there was no snow at Christmas and the snow really didn’t start kicking in till mid January, once it started snowing though it got deep up there till the second weekend in March.  They also got a few big snow storms in April that added to the season totals but only stuck around for a couple weeks. I really thought we were due for a good snowy long winter this year but with December being a no show again this year even if we start getting winter weather in January it going to be another short winter season in lower MI.

[michsnowfreak]

28 minutes ago, slow poke said:

Good point snowfreak about the UP rebuilding their crazy deep snow depths after many areas were down to very little snow starting January out with. At our place at Higgins Lake there was no snow at Christmas and the snow really didn’t start kicking in till mid January, once it started snowing though it got deep up there till the second weekend in March.  They also got a few big snow storms in April that added to the season totals but only stuck around for a couple weeks. I really thought we were due for a good snowy long winter this year but with December being a no show again this year even if we start getting winter weather in January it going to be another short winter season in lower MI.

That all depends how far into Spring Winter lasts lol. November should not be discarded, that was literally as wintry is it can possibly get at this latitude at that time of year for that long. In fact, the irony of this entire thing is if November and December had been swapped, we would think nothing of it.

[weatherbo]

1 hour ago, michsnowfreak said:

 Last Winter was not anything special in the snow department, but I cannot believe how many ice storms we had in the Detroit area. We never get ice storms and we had 3 or 4 last year.  The late January historic cold snap is absolutely something engrained in my memory, but it will be the only thing i remember from that Winter years down the road, everything else was forgettable, especially with so many heavy snow records set the past 20 years.  With a snowy November and another late Spring, it definitely seemed like a long Winter, however for most of December into the 1st half of January, Winter was a no show except for the usual mood flakes.  The 2017-18 Winter was a much much much snowier Winter here in Detroit. In the UP however, last Winter was epic for snowpack, even more so epic when you consider it was wiped out before Christmas in most spots.  Last Winter I finished with just 31.9" of snow, which I'm not complaining about because we can let the spotlight go elsewhere sometimes, but I have noticed that even though we are part of the Midwest, usually what's good for the Western Midwest ismt great for us and what's great for us sucks for the Western Midwest lol. I got 62.5" of snow of the Winter before when much of the Midwest thought it was a blah Winter

Last winter was the deepest snow I had ever seen imby.  60 plus inches in late feb.  At that depth, it's pretty much impossible to measure, just feel encapsulated by it a little bit.  I still have high hopes for this winter.

 

[slow poke]

1 hour ago, michsnowfreak said:

That all depends how far into Spring Winter lasts lol. November should not be discarded, that was literally as wintry is it can possibly get at this latitude at that time of year for that long. In fact, the irony of this entire thing is if November and December had been swapped, we would think nothing of it.

I would consider November having 7 days of true winter like conditions after the Veterans Day snow storm at my place where we had a little over 10” on the ground after that storm. It left the grass covered and looked and felt like winter for that week following the storm.