Heavy heavy lawn thread 2019

[wxeyeNH]

2 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

yeah, they seeded last Oct. I thought about doing it in the next 2 wks or so. Maybe we'll get an indian summer.

Why don't you do it now?  Every day you wait is one less day grass has to establish.  Young grass is more susceptible to frost and you start all over again each spring.  Just my 2 cents.   Oh,  when we moved the house 6 years ago I did try some seeding in Sept.  Didn't work just the winter wheat that I threw on steep slopes came up.  Then hydroseeded the next May and with lots of watering that took

[Lava Rock]

4 minutes ago, wxeyeNH said:

Why don't you do it now?  Every day you wait is one less day grass has to establish.  Young grass is more susceptible to frost and you start all over again each spring.  Just my 2 cents.   Oh,  when we moved the house 6 years ago I did try some seeding in Sept.  Didn't work just the winter wheat that I threw on steep slopes came up.  Then hydroseeded the next May and with lots of watering that took

mostly time constraint. the area I want to seed is ~600sqft. I'll need ~24 bags of compost. I know I can get it delivered in bulk is cheaper, but I don't want to shovel it. Just dump the bag and spread it out, then seed. I just have this feeling I'm wasting my time though. I've tried seeding in Fall and Spring and rarely have any luck. I swear it's got something to do with the granite beneath.

[wxeyeNH]

5 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

mostly time constraint. the area I want to seed is ~600sqft. I'll need ~24 bags of compost. I know I can get it delivered in bulk is cheaper, but I don't want to shovel it. Just dump the bag and spread it out, then seed. I just have this feeling I'm wasting my time though. I've tried seeding in Fall and Spring and rarely have any luck. I swear it's got something to do with the granite beneath.

Hum,  thr granite theory.   I just don't know.  I posted a picture on this thread back on Aug 22nd of the clear cut area we did that is now lawn.  All granite a couple inches under the top and the grass/weed mix that I keep mowed is fine.  So Im stumped

[backedgeapproaching]

6 hours ago, Lava Rock said:

As I'm pulling some of our dead and dormant grass away with my hand I see a lot of little pieces of what look like sawdust

I honestly don't know how there isn't one spec of green in there..not even a little weed of anything, or some new grass tillering after recent rains. 

Your soil test doesn't seem that bad, is it perfect soil, no.  But you should be able to grow a decent lawn even with how it is. Low pH and Low Organic Matter, but that wouldn't strictly result in what you are seeing.  I did a soil test a few weeks ago, and have some major deficiencies, yet grass is thick and green.

If you are going to overseed, do it soon like Gene said.  Oct is definitely pretty late for you location for seeding.  If your established grass does bounce back, make sure to hit it with few Fall fertilizer apps.

[Lava Rock]

50 minutes ago, backedgeapproaching said:

I honestly don't know how there isn't one spec of green in there..not even a little weed of anything, or some new grass tillering after recent rains. 

Your soil test doesn't seem that bad, is it perfect soil, no.  But you should be able to grow a decent lawn even with how it is. Low pH and Low Organic Matter, but that wouldn't strictly result in what you are seeing.  I did a soil test a few weeks ago, and have some major deficiencies, yet grass is thick and green.

If you are going to overseed, do it soon like Gene said.  Oct is definitely pretty late for you location for seeding.  If your established grass does bounce back, make sure to hit it with few Fall fertilizer apps.

We're cursed on Radon Hill. There are some green shoots coming through in some areas, so it seems like little water is the reason, but IDK, this stuff just pulls right out. There are also some bugs in the soil too, but they're not grubs. Meanwhile, on the other side of the house (below) where the crabgrass has taken over, it's just a mess. Heck, you can still see the outline of the erosion mat they laid down almost one year ago.

[OceanStWx]

On 8/30/2019 at 8:48 AM, dendrite said:

Thanks. I did more reading last night. I haven’t noticed a lot of downy mildew here but we certainly get the powdery mildew annually. By August the cuke leaves turn yellow...even with a trellis. Are there any hop varieties that you craft brew guys tend to prefer? Maybe one for aroma and one for bitterness?

Not sure how I missed this but you could hook up an IV drip of Citra or Mosaic and I would be fine.

[dendrite]

1 hour ago, OceanStWx said:

Not sure how I missed this but you could hook up an IV drip of Citra or Mosaic and I would be fine.

lol...any suggestions on ones I can legally obtain? 

Anything from GLH you’d recommend? I’m thinking 3 or 4.

https://www.greatlakeshops.com/

[OceanStWx]

39 minutes ago, dendrite said:

lol...any suggestions on ones I can legally obtain? 

Anything from GLH you’d recommend? I’m thinking 3 or 4.

https://www.greatlakeshops.com/

I'm certainly no expert, but I know what goes in the beers I like. Bissell's flagship (which may be my favorite go to beer) does Apollo, Chinook, Centennial, and Falconer's Flight. I know the NZ hops also have some interesting flavors too.

[dendrite]

1 hour ago, OceanStWx said:

I'm certainly no expert, but I know what goes in the beers I like. Bissell's flagship (which may be my favorite go to beer) does Apollo, Chinook, Centennial, and Falconer's Flight. I know the NZ hops also have some interesting flavors too.

I've been doing my research on disease resistant varieties. Chinook is one that frequently comes up and it's the only one GLH has listed as being somewhat forgiving with poor drainage. Generally all hops varieties stress moist soil, but very good drainage as wet feet will kill the plants. Triple Perle and Newport were the other 2 I had ranked up there for ease of growing. It so wet here and I'm prone to mildew diseases so I want to give them the best chance possible. There's a nice list here of different hops varieties.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B7aNkuU_q8iEREdBMkxWcFI2THM

[CoastalWx]

29 minutes ago, dendrite said:

I've been doing my research on disease resistant varieties. Chinook is one that frequently comes up and it's the only one GLH has listed as being somewhat forgiving with poor drainage. Generally all hops varieties stress moist soil, but very good drainage as wet feet will kill the plants. Triple Perle and Newport were the other 2 I had ranked up there for ease of growing. It so wet here and I'm prone to mildew diseases so I want to give them the best chance possible. There's a nice list here of different hops varieties.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B7aNkuU_q8iEREdBMkxWcFI2THM

Literally chicken and beer at your house. Amazing.

[OceanStWx]

8 minutes ago, CoastalWx said:

Literally chicken and beer at your house. Amazing.

That ASOS install is looking more and more likely by the day.

[Lava Rock]

As I'm pulling some of our dead and dormant grass away with my hand I see a lot of little pieces of what look like sawdust

To add to this, I've seen some insects in the soil. Starting to think they might be chinch bugs. Need to look more carefully and confirm identification.

[dendrite]

54 minutes ago, CoastalWx said:

Literally chicken and beer at your house. Amazing.

[dendrite]

1 hour ago, OceanStWx said:

That ASOS install is looking more and more likely by the day.

Citra Jr.

Comet VF1181
An early version of the “C” type citrusy hop. A vigorous American heirloom variety. It is an all-purpose
hop used for bittering or as late additions to bring out the strong citrusy flavors. Result of a cross of
English “Sunshine” X wild Utah male around 1962- (10 years prior to Cascade). A potent high-oils hop
with “raspy” or “wild” bitterness; similar to Brewers Gold. 24-40”sidearms. Substitute: Citra, Summit.
Emerges in spring bright yellow and leaves green up somewhat as the bines mature. Currently being
described a Citra’s “little sister” by a major western hop supplier.

Think I'm leaning Chinook, Comet, Triple Perle, Newport

Putting the ASOS right in the middle of the mulched hops bed.

[OceanStWx]

3 minutes ago, dendrite said:

Citra Jr.

Comet VF1181
An early version of the “C” type citrusy hop. A vigorous American heirloom variety. It is an all-purpose
hop used for bittering or as late additions to bring out the strong citrusy flavors. Result of a cross of
English “Sunshine” X wild Utah male around 1962- (10 years prior to Cascade). A potent high-oils hop
with “raspy” or “wild” bitterness; similar to Brewers Gold. 24-40”sidearms. Substitute: Citra, Summit.
Emerges in spring bright yellow and leaves green up somewhat as the bines mature. Currently being
described a Citra’s “little sister” by a major western hop supplier.

Think I'm leaning Chinook, Comet, Triple Perle, Newport

Putting the ASOS right in the middle of the mulched hops bed.

Citra is my all day every day. So if it's anything like that I'm in.

I didn't even know I liked it until I started looking at what was in all my favorite beers. But I like citrus flavors, so it makes sense. 

[Lava Rock]

I'm going to spread some Sevin granules on the lawn. I have little doubt after seeing some bugs in the grass that all this damage is due to chinch bugs. Can't believe i didn't think if this sooner.

[dendrite]

I think I’d relax on the pesticides but that’s just me. I find it hard to believe they wiped out every bit of greenery like that.

[Great Snow 1717]

15 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

I'm going to spread some Sevin granules on the lawn. I have little doubt after seeing some bugs in the grass that all this damage is due to chinch bugs. Can't believe i didn't think if this sooner.

What is more important to you, your lawn or your health? I would never use products like sevin.  There is no upside at all. Why not dig out the area and put fresh top soil down and then reseed?

[Lava Rock]

3 minutes ago, Great Snow 1717 said:

What is more important to you, your lawn or your health? I would never use products like sevin.  There is no upside at all. Why not dig out the area and put fresh top soil down and then reseed?

why so the bugs can some back again? I've dealt with this multiple summers now, thinking all along it was drought and/or poor soil. Not to mention we've spent a fortune on new lawns, reseeding efforts. I'm not a big fan of chems, but in this case, I need to stop the infestation asap.

[Baroclinic Zone]

15 hours ago, OceanStWx said:

Citra is my all day every day. So if it's anything like that I'm in.

I didn't even know I liked it until I started looking at what was in all my favorite beers. But I like citrus flavors, so it makes sense. 

Citra is very versatile.

[Great Snow 1717]

9 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

why so the bugs can some back again? I've dealt with this multiple summers now, thinking all along it was drought and/or poor soil. Not to mention we've spent a fortune on new lawns, reseeding efforts. I'm not a big fan of chems, but in this case, I need to stop the infestation asap.

And it is likely that it doesn't stop the infestation because many if not all insects have become resistant to pesticides. And chinch bugs fall into that category. The overuse of pesticides and other lawn care products have made it increasingly difficult to control insects. When I was a kid, and playing baseball and football ,the fields were all in pretty good shape. No one used lawn care products.

  The lawn care industry has made billions by convincing home owners that they need the perfect lawn.  Do you honestly think the lawn care companies are producing top of the line products?? The answer is no they are not. They are producing products that barely work for the most part because they want home owners to continue to  purchase their products in the hope that the lawn will look better.  It's all one giant con game. 

[Great Snow 1717]

32 minutes ago, dendrite said:

I think I’d relax on the pesticides but that’s just me. I find it hard to believe they wiped out every bit of greenery like that.

Agree

 

[Lava Rock]

46 minutes ago, dendrite said:

I think I’d relax on the pesticides but that’s just me. I find it hard to believe they wiped out every bit of greenery like that.

It's not hard to believe actually. The areas prone to damage are where the insects are most active are those that are sun exposed and have the highest soil temps. The randomness of how the brown/dead spots start in July, then proceeds like a tidal wave across the lawn is pretty good evidence. Plus the fact watering has no effect, as evidenced by recent rains. I can see the bugs in the thatch, so I'm confident that's what it is. I have read that diatomaceous earth has some effect on killing the bugs, so I'll look into that as well. If anyone has other organic options, let me know.

[Great Snow 1717]

1 hour ago, Lava Rock said:

It's not hard to believe actually. The areas prone to damage are where the insects are most active are those that are sun exposed and have the highest soil temps. The randomness of how the brown/dead spots start in July, then proceeds like a tidal wave across the lawn is pretty good evidence. Plus the fact watering has no effect, as evidenced by recent rains. I can see the bugs in the thatch, so I'm confident that's what it is. I have read that diatomaceous earth has some effect on killing the bugs, so I'll look into that as well. If anyone has other organic options, let me know.

Perhaps planting a tree(s) in that area to provide shade.

[tamarack]

1 hour ago, Lava Rock said:

It's not hard to believe actually. The areas prone to damage are where the insects are most active are those that are sun exposed and have the highest soil temps. The randomness of how the brown/dead spots start in July, then proceeds like a tidal wave across the lawn is pretty good evidence. Plus the fact watering has no effect, as evidenced by recent rains. I can see the bugs in the thatch, so I'm confident that's what it is. I have read that diatomaceous earth has some effect on killing the bugs, so I'll look into that as well. If anyone has other organic options, let me know.

Perhaps get a firm ID on the bugs, then look for the appropriate variety of BT, the biological insecticide which has been adapted for numerous insect families, each working only on that family (BT for Diptera [flies and mosquitos], as an example, won't harm bees.)

[tunafish]

Lava, my lawn is a cornucopia of weeds and bugs, and the back half is in full sun and still doesn't look that bad.  I don't know what the issue or solution is, but I doubt pounding pesticides is the answer.

Not sure if Milky Spore works on Cinch bugs but maybe give that a shot. Takes a few years to establish and you're soil is probably too cool this year, but it might be worth a shot next year.

Either that or till it all and plant perennials or wildflowers. Probably cheaper than the money you'll undoubtedly continue to pour into it.

[mostman]

18 hours ago, Lava Rock said:

It's not hard to believe actually. The areas prone to damage are where the insects are most active are those that are sun exposed and have the highest soil temps. The randomness of how the brown/dead spots start in July, then proceeds like a tidal wave across the lawn is pretty good evidence. Plus the fact watering has no effect, as evidenced by recent rains. I can see the bugs in the thatch, so I'm confident that's what it is. I have read that diatomaceous earth has some effect on killing the bugs, so I'll look into that as well. If anyone has other organic options, let me know.

It's pretty easy to test for chinch bugs. They have a little white star pattern on their back - you can google for it. Spray some water with some soap in it and trap some in a glass.

If it is chinch, don't treat it yourself. Hire a good fertilizer company to come out and do it. They will use the correct amount and put you on a program. I had them when we first built our house, they absolutely will wipe out an entire lawn, weeds and all.

[Lava Rock]

What's this flat weed that grows close to ground?

[Lava Rock]

What's this flat weed that grows close to ground?

Found it. It's prostrate spurge

[Baroclinic Zone]

Spotted Spurge.  ****ing shit sucks.  Emits a sticky white sap when you don't pick from the root clean.