Bob Chill Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Anyone who has participated in this forum for multiple years knows that we are often regarded as a great resource for valuable, level headed, and accurate analysis of winter wx. For every active poster there are at least 10 lurkers (probably much more). We can top 300 people viewing threads during events and that's just a snapshot in time. Thousands of lurkers swing by this place and it's not for entertainment. It's for accurate information regarding weather events of all kinds. I have personally received several complaints via PM recently and it's very disheartening. There has been a significant decline in the quality and behavior of posters this year. It's not isolated either. It's become widespread and being completely blunt, perception of our sub has declined to the point of almost unreadable at times. I'm no angel either. I'm not throwing rocks at glass houses so this post applies to me too. A lot goes on behind the scenes here that people never see and it's time to clean up or clean house. There's a difference between a quick quip or funny post and opening the flood gates and piling on of worthless, stupid, and useless posts in threads that are read by probably thousands of people that will never make a single post. There have been excessive offensive posts as well (guilty) and it has to stop now. We need to leave the locker room humor in the banter thread or just knock it off all together. This is a common interest science based forum and not Reddit or wherever else the trolls and potty mouths flock to. One of the disheartening things that's going on is long term posters tossing around toilet humor and crybaby posts nearly daily and not actually adding anything of value. Nobody likes a whiny crybaby. We all know many of them in real life. It gets old quick and it's a turnoff. We have 2 threads dedicated for that stuff but instead all of it is getting piled into discussion threads that many lurkers rely on. It's time for everyone to collectively take a moment and think about what and where they are about to post. I have mod powers and honestly, I pretty much hate deleting and hiding things. All of us do. Once in a while it's no big deal. Every single day....yea, it's becoming a big deal. Lastly, winter wx around here is a fickle beast. Always has been always will be. This year is no different than countless others just like it. Sometimes it comes easy and most of the time it's a struggle for every single flake that falls from the sky. Complaining about it every single day multiple times per day is dragging this sub down into the gutter. If you can't handle the failure and frustration with winter wx here then maybe it's best to not pay attention to it at all. This isn't an invite only chat room. It's actually a relied upon resource for thousands of people. Take a minute and think about your role here. Are you a valuable contributor or an emotional parasite? What is your ratio of value to junk posts? I'm not saying this place needs to be Sunday church or anything. I just can't sit by and watch the walls of value crumble while the piles of junk reach skyscraper territory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickinBaltimore Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Well said Bob. I hardly post, but I lurk frequently. To be honest, I'm a novice when it comes to this, and I enjoy your analysis, along with the other mets and knowledgeable posters we have here, as it helps me better understand patterns, reading models, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mappy Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Great post Bob. I know I am guilty of banter, stirring the pot, etc. I'll be better at not doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlet Pimpernel Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Bravo, Bob! Couldn't have said it any better. I've noticed the same thing this year, a lot more overly-snarky, bitter, and whiny posts in the main discussion threads, that add no value or even sap value from them. I say this as someone who will readily admit to making my own off-topic/banterish comments in some threads now and then, or not adding much value with some things I say. Most of the time, however, I try to just read what various long-time experts have to say (and/or those who get access to newer information a lot quicker than I can) and maybe interject something additional to the line of thought, or pose a question. And yeah, I admit to feeling frustration when things go awry...but I try to keep those feelings mostly to myself and not come in here littering the model/medium range threads with several meaningless posts of "Next!" or "The GFS sucks through the entire run, cancel winter!", etc., to express my displeasure at how things look. There's nothing more frustrating than checking things in the morning and sifting through several pages of negative comments about how the Euro sucked for us, and the 06Z GFS looked even worse, or something like that. Maybe there is just a lot more frustration by a lot of people this winter (combined with how bad last winter was), but it does seem the level of discourse has dropped significantly this year. All the same, there are several in here whom I enjoy reading (yourself included), and who add a ton of level-headed, informative, valuable discussion even when things don't look that great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowerLowerDE Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 The selfish cry babies and locker room talk does drag the board down in quality. Quite a few talented and well known mets post here. I love to read the insight they share with us. What I fear is that some of them will quit posting as much, if at all. Professionally they may feel that they don't want to be involved with some of the stuff that is posted. I can't blame them but I would hate to see them go...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowershoresadness Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Bob Chill said: Anyone who has participated in this forum for multiple years knows that we are often regarded as a great resource for valuable, level headed, and accurate analysis of winter wx. For every active poster there are at least 10 lurkers (probably much more). We can top 300 people viewing threads during events and that's just a snapshot in time. Thousands of lurkers swing by this place and it's not for entertainment. It's for accurate information regarding weather events of all kinds. I have personally received several complaints via PM recently and it's very disheartening. There has been a significant decline in the quality and behavior of posters this year. It's not isolated either. It's become widespread and being completely blunt, perception of our sub has declined to the point of almost unreadable at times. I'm no angel either. I'm not throwing rocks at glass houses so this post applies to me too. A lot goes on behind the scenes here that people never see and it's time to clean up or clean house. There's a difference between a quick quip or funny post and opening the flood gates and piling on of worthless, stupid, and useless posts in threads that are read by probably thousands of people that will never make a single post. There have been excessive offensive posts as well (guilty) and it has to stop now. We need to leave the locker room humor in the banter thread or just knock it off all together. This is a common interest science based forum and not Reddit or wherever else the trolls and potty mouths flock to. One of the disheartening things that's going on is long term posters tossing around toilet humor and crybaby posts nearly daily and not actually adding anything of value. Nobody likes a whiny crybaby. We all know many of them in real life. It gets old quick and it's a turnoff. We have 2 threads dedicated for that stuff but instead all of it is getting piled into discussion threads that many lurkers rely on. It's time for everyone to collectively take a moment and think about what and where they are about to post. I have mod powers and honestly, I pretty much hate deleting and hiding things. All of us do. Once in a while it's no big deal. Every single day....yea, it's becoming a big deal. Lastly, winter wx around here is a fickle beast. Always has been always will be. This year is no different than countless others just like it. Sometimes it comes easy and most of the time it's a struggle for every single flake that falls from the sky. Complaining about it every single day multiple times per day is dragging this sub down into the gutter. If you can't handle the failure and frustration with winter wx here then maybe it's best to not pay attention to it at all. This isn't an invite only chat room. It's actually a relied upon resource for thousands of people. Take a minute and think about your role here. Are you a valuable contributor or an emotional parasite? What is your ratio of value to junk posts? I'm not saying this place needs to be Sunday church or anything. I just can't sit by and watch the walls of value crumble while the piles of junk reach skyscraper territory. don't forget buddy we are taking you to a MD game. It would be ironic if it was a snow game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Chill Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, Lowershoresadness said: don't forget buddy we are taking you to a MD game. It would be ironic if it was a snow game I'm in. Hopefully the terps don't have a linebacker throwing the ball when we go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
87storms Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 i actually haven't been too bothered by most posts (though some of have been odd). what's always kinda bugged me is that it seems like some of the veterans get away with more of that stuff than the newbies. i can see why, but i think there's a bit of a crowd mentality in regards to that. my view on that is if a small number of people who have been here a while want to chat online, then create another forum for yourselves or go have a dinner party. bob, you've done a good job. you're actually pretty laid back and let a lot slide. thick skinned. keep doing your thing. and of course, if we had more snow this year, probably no one would be complaining lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ji Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 this is the kind of thread you get when there is no snow.....a sure sign of a disastrous winter lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
87storms Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Bob Chill said: I'm in. Hopefully the terps don't have a linebacker throwing the ball when we go. lol. rough year last year for sure. i'm willing to give durkin one more year. they have a strong class coming in as well, from what i've read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ji Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 hours ago, mappy said: Great post Bob. I know I am guilty of banter, stirring the pot, etc. I'll be better at not doing that. im guilty of some of the cry baby stuff but i blame the pattern, models and the european models. If they were better...i would be better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mappy Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Ji said: im guilty of some of the cry baby stuff but i blame the pattern, models and the european models. If they were better...i would be better well work on being better regardless of those other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTRWx's Thanks Giving Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I think it's important to recognize the difference age gaps here too (especially considering some are hidden). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coh Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I rarely post anything here because I live in upstate NY (though I spent a combined 10 years in Maryland and Virginia at one point)...but I do swing by often because some of the most interesting and insightful analysis/discussion is found here. I have noticed a significant increase in the negative and junk posts that you mentioned and it makes it much harder to find the relevant stuff. Hopefully you can get it under control. Unfortunately this seems to be the trend overall, not only on this forum but on facebook groups and elsewhere. I guess in some ways this board just mirrors what is going on in society at large. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowLuvrDude Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Thanks a million for this. I've been reading all of the great discussions on this forum since the days heading into the memorable bizzard almost 2 years ago. Just register to this forum not too long to maybe chime in every now andvthen. Sadly, nowadays it's hard to enjoy reading here when the same whiners (in6cluding posters that have been around for years). Just painful to read... At one point not too long ago, there was one page full of meltdown posts on a past discussion thread (which I find funny because we are much, much better off than last winter). Some of you should be ashamed of yourselves. I almost lost the desire to continue reading any further until Mr. Bob Chill made this THREAD. But to the posters and mets who stick around and stay to the point (including Mr. Chill himself), I would like to say thank you for the great weather discussions that I greatly enjoy reading. Even if we don't score, the enjoyment of the tracking is what counts, even more rewarding when we actually score! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psuhoffman Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Amen bob and I have been guilty of engaging in stupid distraction lately as things got bad in here. I will do better to get back the the way it used to be and ignore the nonsense. We have a thread for banter and for fail talk. While some posts are just wrong I bet 90% of the problem would go away if people simply put their posts in the right spot. Random comments in banter. Complaints and meltdowns in the panic room. It's not that much effort to click over to another thread. And I've been guilty of banter in the storm threads too so I will take my own advice as well. As always thanks to those that donate time to this community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subtropics Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Ji said: this is the kind of thread you get when there is no snow.....a sure sign of a disastrous winter lol So is life in the subtropics lol. As Mr. Hoffman has pointed out, this isn't a disastrous winter. It is an AVERAGE winter. Can we really complain when we live closer to the equator than we do the arctic circle? We live in the south man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobalt Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 30 minutes ago, BTRWx's Thanks Giving said: I think it's important to recognize the difference age gaps here too (especially considering some are hidden). I mean, I get that there is probably a significant age gap, but I don't really believe that's what causes things like this. I'm 14 years of age, but like many, we all share the common interest of Meteorology, or just certain things in that field, like severe weather or winter storms. Someone said a while ago that if sites like these were mets only, this forum would be incredibly boring. Another reason why these useless posts happen is due to hysteria, or the opposite. Optimism is what caused psu to open the Dec 8-9 storm thread when the major models didn't even have the storm hitting Salisbury. Lack of optimism is what caused us to write off the Jan 4th costal storm. I'm certainly at fault in some of these circumstances for being a Debbie Downer, and I've learned from it. Most of us also love weather because it's something completely out of control, and the only way to see it is either looking at computerized models that simulate the atmosphere or experiencing the weather in our own back yards. From my personal experience, I have been greeted as expected. My first initial posts (like many other people's first posts), were misguided, but many (including myself) learned post etiquette pretty quickly. Of course crappy winters add on to hysteria, and therefore bad posts, but this winter has been pretty good. We've certainly not had the shortage of threats to track, and cold air hasn't been a premium as of yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTRWx's Thanks Giving Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Cobalt said: I mean, I get that there is probably a significant age gap, but I don't really believe that's what causes things like this. I'm 14 years of age, but like many, we all share the common interest of Meteorology, or just certain things in that field, like severe weather or winter storms. Someone said a while ago that if sites like these were mets only, this forum would be incredibly boring. Another reason why these useless posts happen is due to hysteria, or the opposite. Optimism is what caused psu to open the Dec 8-9 storm thread when the major models didn't even have the storm hitting Salisbury. Lack of optimism is what caused us to write off the Jan 4th costal storm. I'm certainly at fault in some of these circumstances for being a Debbie Downer, and I've learned from it. Most of us also love weather because it's something completely out of control, and the only way to see it is either looking at computerized models that simulate the atmosphere or experiencing the weather in our own back yards. From my personal experience, I have been greeted as expected. My first initial posts (like many other people's first posts), were misguided, but many (including myself) learned post etiquette pretty quickly. Of course crappy winters add on to hysteria, and therefore bad posts, but this winter has been pretty good. We've certainly not had the shortage of threats to track, and cold air hasn't been a premium as of yet. One day you will see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clueless Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Two crappy winters in a row will do this. Less locker room talk is always appreciated as well. Take all extraneous bull**** to banter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingJWx Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Just saw this but as a lurker, I'd like to thank Bob Chill and all the other hobbyists and mets who take their time to provide thoughtful analysis in the long range and storm discussion threads. This place is a valuable resource and I hope bad behavior won't derail the discussion as much in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j4076066 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Bob, Thank you for this. I am a Maryland public school teacher and I have been a lurker here for years. I had to register to say thank you. I have learned so much from this sub forum and check it constantly. In my Social Studies classroom, I have even used my own experience with trying to learn from everyone's posts and how I handle the many times when I don't understand the acronyms and jargon (students were amazed to "watch" me struggle with text and try to find a level of comprehension). Recently it has seemed that there has been much more banter in the non-banter threads. Colleagues and friends know I lurk here and ask me "What's the latest from our weather board?" It had become much less informative, particularly when snarkiness seems to be prevalent between some posters. So, in short, I am one of those many lurkers you mentioned. I love reading the posts in this subforum and appreciate everyone posting and debating the science of the weather and hope to see a bit of return to the passionate (but still "professional") discourse. Thank you to all the regular posters. Your insights are greatly appreciated and I feel like I know many of you (is that creepy?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2O Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 To add to Bob's post that I might not have covered in that long winded one I made in banter. The few mods here, both tagged and not, have often let things go, usually far too much, as a result of: 1. not always being here 2. no large storm threat that required STORM MODE 3. general unease of being too strict and not allowing some light comments to deal with the lack of snow 4. combos of all 3 There has always been a hope that people would take a couple of early snow events and the gentle nudging we mods made to all of you to heart and self regulate. In doing this we(I as maybe I am only speaking for myself here) thought that our presence wouldn't be needed as much. It clearly hasn't worked. Threads are quickly cluttered as many of our storms this winter have gone from decent to nothing as they get closer in time. In some there seems to be an effort to purposefully screw things up to see if we are monitoring. If we aren't then its a free for all. It is a shame that many lurkers and others have been discouraged to post because of the quality of most threads(minus banter). For that I do apologize as if I have been tasked to reign in some of it I haven't been doing a great job. I do know that the ones here who do have the ability to get rid of posts don't want to make it a boring forum but something does have to change. It would be great again if people here did that w/o us but I've been here too long to have rose colored glasses. To the mets and others who have added so much value to discussions, I thank you for sticking with it and putting up with the crap. We aren't perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinksnow18 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Bob chill I am from the upstate forum but I was actually introduced to American weather when local blogs in WNY went away a couple years back. I have lurked for some time now as I have a different thread I post to but as you've alluded to I have stayed with this forum for the knowledge that yourself, PSU and others bring. In fact I still come to this blog to find out what your input is to see if there is a sense of change in the patterns or otherwise. I'm always pulling for you guys to get dumped on and get your snowmageddon again. We're all weenies at heart. Great job guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mappy Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 10 minutes ago, j4076066 said: Bob, Thank you for this. I am a Maryland public school teacher and I have been a lurker here for years. I had to register to say thank you. I have learned so much from this sub forum and check it constantly. In my Social Studies classroom, I have even used my own experience with trying to learn from everyone's posts and how I handle the many times when I don't understand the acronyms and jargon (students were amazed to "watch" me struggle with text and try to find a level of comprehension). Recently it has seemed that there has been much more banter in the non-banter threads. Colleagues and friends know I lurk here and ask me "What's the latest from our weather board?" It had become much less informative, particularly when snarkiness seems to be prevalent between some posters. So, in short, I am one of those many lurkers you mentioned. I love reading the posts in this subforum and appreciate everyone posting and debating the science of the weather and hope to see a bit of return to the passionate (but still "professional") discourse. Thank you to all the regular posters. Your insights are greatly appreciated and I feel like I know many of you (is that creepy?) Not creepy at all! Nice to see a lurker like yourself make an username just to say thanks. Hope you stick around! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraff Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Raises hand slowly. I know I lost it yesterday. Won’t hapoen again, but their might have been a beer distributor trade show I attended for 5 hours prior to my dog sled cartopper stupidness. LOLz. Will keep it cool from here on out, but a real storm would help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDM Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Hats off Bob! Takes courage to put out in the open what many feel, but are hesitant to say. The support in the responses is confirmation that you hit the mark and the point made is a worthy one that needed addressing. My limited number of posts belie a daily and often constant lurking since 2002 here and on the forum before it. Despite the decades of interest, I've succumbed to the fact I'll likely never develop the level of subject matter expertise to become a major contributor like you and many others, and I'm comfortable with that. That's why I've always tried to read more and post less unless there's something worthy to contribute. Unfortunately, what's developed here is somewhat indicative of what's happening in general public correspondence. That being, we've become too quick to criticize others who perhaps don't share the same opinion, or in the case of weather, analysis given it is such a subjective topic. In that theme, it seems the intolerance this year has taken on a new light (or low). Maybe it's the cumulative impact of back to back "bad years" so to speak? Dunno. (though I'm not ready to throw in the towel on this year!). In general, there's a hesitation or even at times avoidance to assume noble intent, and instead assume some sort of malice is at play; to the point things get out of hand. If we compare the contrast of today's correspondence to that of just 15 years ago, the difference is profoundly stark. As is the norm, your posts exemplify the same stalwart support to the forum that is part of its foundation. You make it a better place. I feel for you and the other Mods in your efforts to keep peace and preserve the integrity of the dialogue, even in the Banter Sub. No doubt it's not easy. Hopefully, from here on the assumption of noble intent will be renewed, we'll all exercise more restraint, and in doing so the quality of the dialogue will improve at the same time we give the Mods much less to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VA Mad Man Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 36 minutes ago, KingJWx said: Just saw this but as a lurker, I'd like to thank Bob Chill and all the other hobbyists and mets who take their time to provide thoughtful analysis in the long range and storm discussion threads. This place is a valuable resource and I hope bad behavior won't derail the discussion as much in the future. As another lurker and infrequent poster I totally agree with KingJWx. That is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ka60 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Thank you BobChill for putting things in perspective. Scientists and researchers like myself visit this type of forums to check discussion posts to gain valuable information about atmospheric changes and not always for how much snow certain region receives. I appreciate the opportunity to read different views of many members. Keep up the great discussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Chill Posted January 17, 2018 Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 Hey Folks, I really appreciate the feedback. I'm not kidding when I say this....I DREADED making this thread. I've been thinking about it for over a month but there's been some discussions behind the scenes hitting these points and that combined with a couple pm's from random people I've never seen before asking why things have gone downhill required some action. I started thinking about something Matt (Deck Pic) said a few years ago. That doctors, lawyers, scientists, emergency managers, and on and on do lurk here because it's an incredible real time resource for "breaking weather news" in our area. Better than the outlets and mainstream media. It's not just a playground for weather geek talk and banter. It's a legit place for real analysis. Looks like we're all on the same page. However, I don't want anyone thinking we can't have fun becuase it's supposed to be fun here. I love this place. I love joking around too. I don't like incessant complaining though. I get it. I really do. But good god does it get old. Say your piece and be done with it. Don't hit the replay button 50 times afterwards. That's not too much to ask. Lastly, the dirty joke stuff needs to stop. Which isn't something I like saying becuase I personally find much of it pretty funny. It's just not appropriate here anymore. This place should be more of a resource than NSFW comedy. Joking is great. Offending people isn't. There's an easy to see line there too. Let's stay on the good side. Especially in the disco threads. @j4076066 Your post is precisely why I made this thread. I really appreciate you popping in and saying your piece. It makes the points of my post make that much more sense. Don't be a stranger and make it snow dammit!! Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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