Summer 2017 Banter Thread

[WeatherFeen2000]

No real heat in sight besides this annoying humid muggy days plenty of those.

[bluewave]

3 hours ago, psv88 said:

Yea. Problem is Americans want great infrastructure but don't want to make the sacrifices to pay for it. Sacrifices in the form of higher taxes and lower pay and pensions for public employees. In the NYC metro area, teachers, cops and other government workers  make more than those in the private sector, get better benefits, and fat pensions, which are absent from the private sector. 

The above factors have raised our taxes to astronomical levels, rendering any tax increases unfeasible. To that point, real infrastructure improvement requires a massive federal government investment, which won't happen in the current or future political environment. 

In short, due to local and national factors, our infrastructure problem will only get worse. The  positive story to some extent are the major projects currently planned for the city, which were largely spearheaded by the state. This includes the new LGA airport, tappanzee bridge, and east side access for the LIRR. 

Cuomo is really pushing the LIRR third rail project on the island, which most towns want, other than a select few who might hold it up. 

It should be federally funded like beach rebuilding the army corps in Long Beach is doing. We don't need to reduce the public sector workers pay and benefits  that keep this country running. I think the cost of living is so high here since we are near one of the wealthiest cities that this world has even known. Areas of the country with less wealth have a lower cost of living. There is just a ton of money in our area which pushes prices higher.

 

2 hours ago, gravitylover said:

I was down there one time last summer and ended up going over the AB bridge and ran all the way through LB and out through JB and Ocean Parkway all the way to the Fire Island causeway then up to the Sag then LIE to get to an appointment near Brookhaven. It ended up being faster and easier, not to mention much prettier, than crawling out the LIE. I'm sure it added 50 miles or more from the Whitestone Bridge but it was well worth it. Even when I was growing up in Oceanside 30+ years ago I remember blowing off going to the beach because a problem at the LB bridge would have traffic backed up all the way through Island Park.

I love Long Beach, but the traffic and parking situation especially during the warm season is tough.

[psv88]

1 hour ago, bluewave said:

It should be federally funded like beach rebuilding the army corps in Long Beach is doing. We don't need to reduce the public sector workers pay and benefits  that keep this country running. I think the cost of living is so high here since we are near one of the wealthiest cities that this world has even known. Areas of the country with less wealth have a lower cost of living. There is just a ton of money in our area which pushes prices higher.

 

I love Long Beach, but the traffic and parking situation especially during the warm season is tough.

I pay 10k is property taxes for 0.21 acres of land. A large portion of that money goes to the schools and county government. Why should the rest of us pay high taxes so public employees can get pensions of 100k per year or more for teachers and cops, and 70k or more for other government employees?

the amount of money in the area has nothing to do with it. Around Atlanta the taxes are near nothing and there is a ton of money in the city. I'm all for paying government workers well,but they are sucking the system dry at the expense of everyone else.

[psv88]

To add to the above, my mom was a school teacher for 35 years, so it's not as if I am speaking because I'm jealous or anything.

follow the money and that's where it goes

[bluewave]

8 minutes ago, psv88 said:

I pay 10k is property taxes for 0.21 acres of land. A large portion of that money goes to the schools and county government. Why should the rest of us pay high taxes so public employees can get pensions of 100k per year or more for teachers and cops, and 70k or more for other government employees?

the amount of money in the area has nothing to do with it. Around Atlanta the taxes are near nothing and there is a ton of money in the city. I'm all for paying government workers well,but they are sucking the system dry at the expense of everyone else.

Again, NY metro has some of the greatest concentration of wealth in the world. So in order for the public sector workers to maintain a middle class lifestyle, the pay and benefits must be more here. It's only a tiny fraction of the money you can make in the private sector. People don't go into the public sector to get rich. 

The amount of wealth around Atlanta is nothing compared to NY. So your dollar can go much further. The public sector doesn't need to make what they do here to be considered middle class. 

The main reason people are willing to pay the higher taxes here is that the private sector pays much more around our region than other places. We have some of the highest number of millionaires and billionaires in the world around NYC Metro. 10K is pretty much nothing to pay in taxes compared to the 100K plus paid in the wealthier sections of Long Island.

http://www.newsday.com/classifieds/real-estate/billy-joel-charles-wang-of-islanders-don-vultaggio-have-the-highest-taxed-homes-in-nassau-county-1.10322895

[BxEngine]

back to weather please

[psv88]

12 minutes ago, bluewave said:

Again, NY metro has some of the greatest concentration of wealth in the world. So in order for the public sector workers to maintain a middle class lifestyle, the pay and benefits must be more here. It's only a tiny fraction of the money you can make in the private sector. People don't go into the public sector to get rich. 

The amount of wealth around Atlanta is nothing compared to NY. So your dollar can go much further. The public sector doesn't need to make what they do here to be considered middle class. 

The main reason people are willing to pay the higher taxes here is that the private sector pays much more around our region than other places. We have some of the highest number of millionaires and billionaires in the world around NYC Metro. 10K is pretty much nothing to pay in taxes compared to the 100K plus paid in the wealthier sections of Long Island.

http://www.newsday.com/classifieds/real-estate/billy-joel-charles-wang-of-islanders-don-vultaggio-have-the-highest-taxed-homes-in-nassau-county-1.10322895

Agree to disagree. Look at the median household income in Commack. It's about 110k. The idea that most private sector jobs pay more than public sector on the island is not correct. 10k in taxes when median household income is 110k is very high. I'm not sure of your background, but you seem to suggest that everyone in the private sector makes 200k. It's not true. 

And 100k in property taxes is unheard of. The wealthier areas in reality are between 15 and 30. Sure some is higher, but almost nobody pays 100k

[bluewave]

12 minutes ago, psv88 said:

Agree to disagree. Look at the median household income in Commack. It's about 110k. The idea that most private sector jobs pay more than public sector on the island is not correct. 10k in taxes when median household income is 110k is very high. I'm not sure of your background, but you seem to suggest that everyone in the private sector makes 200k. It's not true. 

And 100k in property taxes is unheard of. The wealthier areas in reality are between 15 and 30. Sure some is higher, but almost nobody pays 100k

It's all a matter of supply and demand. I guarantee if you put your house on the market for a going rate in your area that you will get multiple offers. I highly doubt that the amount of taxes paid for a nice area like yours will be a deal breaker for the buyer. 

Plenty of people or couples make more than 200K in the private sector around the NYC area and suburbs. The biggest estates on Long Island do have more than a 100K tax bite, but that is the highest end of the market.

[Rjay]

It was a good discussion but let's stay away from anything that can turn political.   Thanks in advance.  

[Fantom X]

22 hours ago, Stormlover74 said:

This is very true

this is why we need multiple bridges/tunnels from Nassau/Suffolk to Connecticut (which will never happen)

[bluewave]

7 minutes ago, Fantom X said:

this is why we need multiple bridges/tunnels from Nassau/Suffolk to Connecticut (which will never happen)

I would have liked the bridge across Long Island Sound for the trips to CT. But the people on the North Shore didn't want all the traffic running through their neighborhoods. Hopefully, this doesn't start up the North Shore vs South Shore battle again.

[gravitylover]

NIMBYism has ruined LI. I don't want to see windmills offshore it ruins the view, I don't want the cross Sound traffic in my area, I don't want... blah. Go on and pay outrageous electric rates, pay more for all sorts of goods that could be easily transported on and off the island to mainland USA, have ZERO manufacturing of consequence because no manufacturer in their right mind would want to deal with the cost and hassle of getting their products off the island, give up tourist dollars to surrounding states because getting to the beach is too cumbersome and expensive... Blah.

[uofmiami]

19 hours ago, psv88 said:

And 100k in property taxes is unheard of. The wealthier areas in reality are between 15 and 30. Sure some is higher, but almost nobody pays 100k

My brother in-law in Jericho pays around $50K in property taxes, I am sure the Jericho school tax is a very large part of it.  My parents in Muttontown pay around $50K in proprety taxes as well, majority of it Locust Valley school tax.  I have property taxes around $23K on my house in Syosset, which I am challenging assessment on since prior owner never did.  If you have a big enough parcel of land I am sure one could get close to & over the $100K mark for taxes alone on the island.

[bluewave]

1 hour ago, uofmiami said:

My brother in-law in Jericho pays around $50K in property taxes, I am sure the Jericho school tax is a very large part of it.  My parents in Muttontown pay around $50K in proprety taxes as well, majority of it Locust Valley school tax.  I have property taxes around $23K on my house in Syosset, which I am challenging assessment on since prior owner never did.  If you have a big enough parcel of land I am sure one could get close to & over the $100K mark for taxes alone on the island.

Yeah, there are several higher end properties with taxes in excess of 100K on the current MLSLI listings. 

http://www.mlsli.com/

Financial Considerations

Taxes: $196,480

Total Taxes: $240,702

 

 

[psv88]

2 hours ago, bluewave said:

Yeah, there are several higher end properties with taxes in excess of 100K on the current MLSLI listings. 

http://www.mlsli.com/

Financial Considerations

Taxes: $196,480

Total Taxes: $240,702

 

 

Those are very rare examples. You own enough land anywhere and your taxes will be that high. The 100k argument is just silly. 

Point is, we can't afford infrastructure improvement now because of the current tax rate and spending on public employment. There is no way to dispute those facts. One of the two factors need to change. 

[bluewave]

53 minutes ago, psv88 said:

Those are very rare examples. You own enough land anywhere and your taxes will be that high. The 100k argument is just silly. 

Point is, we can't afford infrastructure improvement now because of the current tax rate and spending on public employment. There is no way to dispute those facts. One of the two factors need to change. 

That's what the bond market is for.

[psv88]

2 minutes ago, bluewave said:

That's what the bond market is for.

A tax hike in all but name...and then employees need to be hired to maintain the new infrastructure.

[bluewave]

11 minutes ago, psv88 said:

A tax hike in all but name...and then employees need to be hired to maintain the new infrastructure.

Much cheaper in the long run than letting the infrastructure decline forcing big business moves to places with more modern infrastructure to support their operations.

[IrishRob17]

5 minutes ago, psv88 said:

A tax hike in all but name...and then employees need to be hired to maintain the new infrastructure.

I can't speak for all places but have some experience with public employment. They won't hire more public employees to do it, they will out source it to private contractors and consultants in order to "save money" but when their rates and overhead costs are factored in it winds up double or more what it would have cost. That's how the government "saves" money.  And don't get me started on how much money is spent just trying to interpret all the regs let along follow and enforce them. The public has no idea. 

[bluewave]

19 minutes ago, IrishRob17 said:

I can't speak for all places but have some experience with public employment. They won't hire more public employees to do it, they will out source it to private contractors and consultants in order to "save money" but when their rates and overhead costs are factored in it winds up double or more what it would have cost. That's how the government "saves" money.  And don't get me started on how much money is spent just trying to interpret all the regs let along follow and enforce them. The public has no idea. 

It's a lucky thing thing that Long Beach was able to get its 230 million for the beach rebuilding project in this environment.

http://liherald.com/stories/Army-Corps-project-begins-this-month,81530

The $230 million project calls for the rehabilitation of 17 existing jetties, or groins, and construction of four new ones, as well as the addition of roughly 4.7 million cubic yards of sand for a system of berms and dunes along 35,000 feet of shoreline.

[IrishRob17]

20 minutes ago, bluewave said:

It's a lucky thing thing that Long Beach was able to get its 230 million for the beach rebuilding project in this environment.

http://liherald.com/stories/Army-Corps-project-begins-this-month,81530

The $230 million project calls for the rehabilitation of 17 existing jetties, or groins, and construction of four new ones, as well as the addition of roughly 4.7 million cubic yards of sand for a system of berms and dunes along 35,000 feet of shoreline.

Yep. A colleague of mine is in Long Beach, they are very happy to have landed that project. 

[bluewave]

1 hour ago, IrishRob17 said:

Yep. A colleague of mine is in Long Beach, they are very happy to have landed that project. 

I can remember how much opposition there was to that project from the community back in the 90's and early 00's. People were worried about dunes obstructing their ocean views so it got shelved until after Sandy. The best dunes on the barrier island are currently down in Lido Dunes neighborhood. Sandy couldn't breach them so the houses immediately behind them came through without much damage. The Lido Towers a few blocks away didn't have a decent dune in front of it. So the first floor was pretty much destroyed from the surge and wave action. The major project in coming decades will probably tide gates on all the inlets to prevent back bay flooding. But that will probably be some really big dollars.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/04/science/earth/after-hurricane-sandy-dunes-prove-they-blunt-storms.html

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/nassau/army-corps-to-study-tidal-gates-for-south-shore-1.12712645

[forkyfork]

hi from boiceville. the catskills are pretty

[psv88]

Back in NY after 10 days in the south. Just as hot here today.

[Sundog]

On 7/1/2017 at 3:14 PM, psv88 said:

I pay 10k is property taxes for 0.21 acres of land. A large portion of that money goes to the schools and county government. Why should the rest of us pay high taxes so public employees can get pensions of 100k per year or more for teachers and cops, and 70k or more for other government employees?

the amount of money in the area has nothing to do with it. Around Atlanta the taxes are near nothing and there is a ton of money in the city. I'm all for paying government workers well,but they are sucking the system dry at the expense of everyone else.

 

And yet you are still on Long island and not in Atlanta where the taxes are near nothing. 

 

You can also get 1000 acres of land in Kansas for 10,000 dollars and 100 bucks a year in property taxes. Why havent you relocated? 

 

The answer to this  question is why your property taxes are what they are. 

[psv88]

1 hour ago, Sundog said:

 

And yet you are still on Long island and not in Atlanta where the taxes are near nothing. 

 

You can also get 1000 acres of land in Kansas for 10,000 dollars and 100 bucks a year in property taxes. Why havent you relocated? 

 

The answer to this  question is why your property taxes are what they are. 

Read the whole thread. People were complaining about infrastructure and why it is so old in the area. I said it won't be improved unless taxes are raised or spending on public employees is cut. 

Bluewave is proposing a tax increase, which is fine. People can complain all they want about the need for infrastructure improvements but nothing will be done unless everyone pays for it. 

And to your point (which didn't address my post), I will be leaving the area hopefully within the year. I'm leaving mainly for family reasons, but I certainly won't miss taking it up the rear when my property tax bill comes.

New Yorkers have this idea that they should pay such high taxes because other places with lower taxes suck, etc. however, I have many friends who left ny to Virginia, SC, FL, who are very happy and don't miss ny at all. 

When i leave I will miss many things, but I will be happy to leave high taxes, terrible traffic, and crumbling infrastructure. I personally don't dislike living here, but I can't stand people who complain about the crumbling infrastructure yet are unwilling to pay/sacrifice the costs to improve it.

[JerseyWx]

My cousin used to pay $400 a year in property taxes down in Myrtle Beach.  

I enjoy my area of NJ, but I have to say it is getting increasingly crowded and built up in recent years.  Traffic on route 23 and other local highways is just horrible sometimes.  If there's a bad jam up, the traffic spills on to all the backroads too, whereas you used to be able to get around it.  

[dmillz25]

One thing I could say is that I would never move down south. Too hot and humid for my liking and I would miss the snow too much.

[Stormlover74]

7 minutes ago, dmillz25 said:

One thing I could say is that I would never move down south. Too hot and humid for my liking and I would miss the snow too much.

Yeah same. My family lives down there but not for me. If there were jobs I'd move somewhere upstate or vt

[WeatherFeen2000]

No real heat in sight!