csnavywx Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/07/science/a-conservative-climate-solution-republican-group-calls-for-carbon-tax.html James Hansen was incidentally one of the first to call for a carbon fee and dividend plan and has been talking about it for years: Yes, I'm aware it's coming from Paulson, Mankiw and Baker (of Bush v Gore fame), but there's a (small) chance here to get this off the ground and I really think it would get the ball rolling in the right direction. It would have the biggest effect on coal -- so I'm not sure that a Trump admin would go for that given his campaign trail rhetoric. At the very least, it shows the potential for real action in the next decade or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillT Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 3 hours ago, csnavywx said: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/07/science/a-conservative-climate-solution-republican-group-calls-for-carbon-tax.html James Hansen was incidentally one of the first to call for a carbon fee and dividend plan and has been talking about it for years: Yes, I'm aware it's coming from Paulson, Mankiw and Baker (of Bush v Gore fame), but there's a (small) chance here to get this off the ground and I really think it would get the ball rolling in the right direction. It would have the biggest effect on coal -- so I'm not sure that a Trump admin would go for that given his campaign trail rhetoric. At the very least, it shows the potential for real action in the next decade or so. taxing carbon is utter LUNACY..........some jumped me over this being for "science" no scientist can support this insane concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluewave Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 I like this idea better than a carbon fee or tax. http://www.inc.com/steve-mendelsohn/why-some-experts-say-carbon-taxes-don-t-work.html That's because things like gasoline for your car, heat for your home and electricity for the refrigerator are not discretionary items that can be controlled through traditional supply-and-demand economics. They are prerequisites for participation in the modern economy. Thus, if you propose to make gasoline so expensive that only Tesla drivers can afford to go to work, you could create some real socioeconomic issues that would be a tough sell in Congress. Instead of taxing the fossil fuel usage, Dr. Cohen thinks it would be a much more viable option to incentivize clean energy through a combination of tax credits and incentives and public-private research partnerships. "I've looked back over history to figure out where technological innovation comes from and how it gets infused into our society. Look at the Internet, for example, or smartphones or GPS--all of those technologies started in the federal government and at a certain point the technology gets translated into a commercial project." Dr. Cohen pointed to a prime example on the campus of the State University of New York Polytechnic Institute in Albany where the government has funded nanotechnology clean rooms that the private sector can lease for short periods of time for research and development projects. "No private company could have afforded to build that. That's the infrastructure of the 21st century high tech economy. It's the equivalent of the Erie Canal when efficient transit routes were so central to the economy. Those are the kinds of things the government can do to incentivize the kind of research and development that will really accelerate the growth of clean energy." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Frost Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 "The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary." H. L. Mencken I encourage everyone who believes that AGW is causing catastrophic impacts to the earth and life as we know it to voluntarily contribute your last dime to the cause. But before you do, please google the quotes of P.T. Barnum. As Tip would write, "just sayin"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mempho Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Every solution involves killing off the middle class in Western countries and making the establishment even richer. And yet so many here wonder why so many people are firmly in the denial camp? The science does not matter. There, I said it. The science does not matter. As long as the solution is an economic autocracy (and, by extension- a political one), what's the point? Sent from my SM-G900R7 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juliancolton Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 6 minutes ago, mempho said: And yet so many here wonder why so many people are firmly in the denial camp? Mostly boneheadedness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chubbs Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Proposal for a carbon tax/fee from one group of republicans. "Dubbed the "Republican climate jailbreak strategy," the plan calls for taxes to be collected at the source — on oil at the refinery, for instance — then built into the prices for products made from that material. Revenue would be returned to taxpayers, amounting to about $2,000 annually for a family of four." http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/02/group-prominent-republicans-just-launched-longshot-bid-carbon-tax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brewbeer Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 16 hours ago, mempho said: As long as the solution is an economic autocracy (and, by extension- a political one), what's the point? We are already well entrenched in an economic autocracy, and have been for several decades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brewbeer Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 On 2/12/2017 at 7:53 PM, Jack Frost said: I encourage everyone who believes that AGW is causing catastrophic impacts to the earth and life as we know it to voluntarily contribute your last dime to the cause. I encourage everyone who believes AGW isn't going to cause catastrophic impacts to the earth and life as we currently know it to voluntarily make long term investments in large tracts of property in southern Florida. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mempho Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 We are already well entrenched in an economic autocracy, and have been for several decades.Would you then agree that handing more power to the autocracy won't solve any climate change problems? Sent from my SM-G900R7 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brewbeer Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 1 hour ago, mempho said: Would you then agree that handing more power to the autocracy won't solve any climate change problems? Have I handed more power to the autocracy if I choose to live in a small house, live close to my work, drive a small fuel efficient automobile, replace low efficiency lighting with LEDs and install a high efficiency heating system in my home, and take other measures to reduce my energy consumption from fossil fuels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mempho Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Have I handed more power to the autocracy if I choose to live in a small house, live close to my work, drive a small fuel efficient automobile, replace low efficiency lighting with LEDs and install a high efficiency heating system in my home, and take other measures to reduce my energy consumption from fossil fuels? Absolutely not. All I'm saying is don't make this another centralized structure in order to gain power/extort wealth. I'm not perfect, by any means but, for the record, I do make choices from a personal standpoint - I drive a Prius, for example, and love to invest in energy efficient solutions myself. I'm not a big fan of fossil fuels for three reasons : 1) it's clearly bad for the environment (even if carbon forcing turns out to be overblown - look at smog), 2) it indirectly funds terrorists, and 3) it's expensive. When a person who flies on a private jet (arguably, the most poisonous form of transport for the environment) tries to implement these things, I suspect it's just for profit and control. These are not the people you want in control if you need to address climate change. Sent from my SM-G900R7 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chubbs Posted March 4, 2017 Share Posted March 4, 2017 Singapore is adopting a carbon tax. https://www.nccs.gov.sg/climate-change-and-singapore/domestic-actions/reducing-emissions/carbon-pricing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Frost Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 On February 21, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Brewbeer said: I encourage everyone who believes AGW isn't going to cause catastrophic impacts to the earth and life as we currently know it to voluntarily make long term investments in large tracts of property in southern Florida. Please contact me if you have information as to the availability of such tracts that are priced well below market due to the perception of their owners that such tracts will be negatively impacted by the imminent consequences of AGW. This would be in addition to the price reductions already accounted for due to the already occurring and ongoing increase in the number and intensity of hurricanes due to AGW. I would be more than happy to due diligence and perhaps buy the choicest of these tracts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaJohn Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 8 hours ago, Jack Frost said: Please contact me if you have information as to the availability of such tracts that are priced well below market due to the perception of their owners that such tracts will be negatively impacted by the imminent consequences of AGW. This would be in addition to the price reductions already accounted for due to the already occurring and ongoing increase in the number and intensity of hurricanes due to AGW. I would be more than happy to due diligence and perhaps buy the choicest of these tracts... Check out the price of property insurance along the coastline of of Florida. That's the early warning sign. Right now, it's not an issue because those properties are mainly owned by rich people. But at some point in the future, those property owners will be forced to self insure. Then you might see some good deals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Frost Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 1 hour ago, FloridaJohn said: Check out the price of property insurance along the coastline of of Florida. That's the early warning sign. Right now, it's not an issue because those properties are mainly owned by rich people. But at some point in the future, those property owners will be forced to self insure. Then you might see some good deals. I hear ya FJ. Whether it's an AGW issue or the folks just annoyed at subsidizing the risks of living next to an ocean is open to debate. Let me know if you see any opportunities. I'm a bit of a risk taker when the risks are associated with CO2.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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