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February banter thread

Eskimo Joe

By Eskimo Joe,
in Mid Atlantic

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psuhoffman

psuhoffman

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, pasnownut said:

I hope your not implying that I have half a brian, because it takes less than that to see agenda driven broadcasting hidden under a guise of integrity and said thin veil for many outlets.  I go to many outlets in search of the truth.  

Selective fact sharing is still one sided news.  Wow.

I'm not interested in a political convo, so I'm done.  You attacked Fox, I responded, because like with them...many ARE guilty.  and unfortunately they are mainstream meia outlets.  I have no bias for media.  I want the truth, but am smart enough to see thru other stuff.

Mods, dont worry, I'm done with this.

Nut

 

First this isn't political.  And I take offense to those that try to make this a liberal/conservative thing.  I have said nothing at all liberal or conservative.  I made a factual statement that Fox News is littered with nonsense.  Thats been proven by non partisan non biased fact checking organizations. MSNBC is just as bad. Both are propaganda more then news.  Fact checking proves it. That's not political it's a damn fact. I'm not playing this "facts are arbitrary" game with anyone.

Second the movement to make facts arbitrary is a great threat to our society and the concurrent attempt to label this topic "political" is equally dangerous because politics is a dirty word and it then implies that taking the side of "truth" makes you biased and thus further discredits the argument.  Arguing the validity of facts isn't political and allowing that to become the status quo would be the worst mistake this country could make.  

Third, bias by omission or source selection are real but not the same as lies or fake news.  Ok so one source only offers one view.  If the facts they use to support that view are real and legit then it's bias but not lies or fake.  You can argue your opposing view with your own legit facts too but not try to simply end the debate completely by labeling the other side lies or biased. Everyone is biased that doesn't make it wrong. There is a difference between lies and bias. People that can't see that are dangerous.

This isn't political because its true of both sides. There are quality sources of conservative leaning news such as the Wall Street Journal.  Liberals are too quick to dismiss conservative points also.  This isn't politics as much as pure intellectual laziness.  Not wanting to have to defend your point of view so simply dismiss any opposition.  I'll debate anyone about anything but you have to back up your argument and respond to opposition not simply scream lies.  I've lost plenty of arguments and found I was wrong when forced to listen to opposing views.  Plus by defending your view you increase your knowledge.  Labeling anything you disagree with as lies or fake is lazy.  

This is dangerous because if we make facts arbitrary our leaders can justify absolutely anything.  Facts are also important as a check on ignorance.  If any view is equally legitimate regardless of evidence that stands up to scrutiny we as a society could and have justified some downright evil awful actions.  Having to justify yourself with facts and stand up to scrutiny from opposition is a check on that to BOTH sides.  The media is incredibly important in that process and labeling them all illegitimate is a major win for anyone who would want to lead us astray.

I have no idea if you are stupid.  Probably not.  But what you said was stupid and worse incredibly dangerous. I've said stupid things before so it would be unfair to say anything more judgemental then that.  

I've now said my peace.  Take it leave it or hate me I had to get that off my chest.  I won't say anymore on here since I know many don't want anything "controversial" on here and while I vehemently deny this is political it is obviously controversial.  I will gladly discuss or debate with anyone through PM or on facebook etc...

If this earns me a vacation so be it.  This issue is way more important then snow or JB or anything else we're chatting about.  I am an educator and a debate coach and one who values the importance of knowledge and fact in our society.  The movement to make everything arbitrary scares the crap out of me and this is not political to me it's truth versus nonsense.  

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Fozz

Fozz

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, WinterWxLuvr said:

Anybody posting anything remotely political in this sub forum should be given a 5 day vacation.  Immediately.  Get enough of that sh*t every time you turn around.

In the weather threads, sure. In the banter thread, I think there can be some leeway.

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Fozz

Fozz

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, WinterWxLuvr said:

I disagree 100%.  There needs to be no attempt to resurrect PR in our weather forums.

There are plenty of places for people to go for that stuff other than here.

There's a lot of sports talk in this forum, even though we have a Sports subforum and not everyone is a fan of the DC teams, but we still get by fine.

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isohume

isohume

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, pasnownut said:

yeah....cause that will have an adverse affect on the weather maps, and how they are perceived.

You go first.....

LOL

Nut

 

Oh I don't want to muck up those serious disco threads. Just saying it'd be good to know how folks roll around here.  

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pasnownut

pasnownut

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Fozz said:

There's a lot of sports talk in this forum, even though we have a Sports subforum and not everyone is a fan of the DC teams, but we still get by fine.

Yeah, the only REAL football team is the Eagles....

and I still love y'all.

Dont care what team you play for....root for....whatevs.

 

Nut

 

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CAPE

CAPE

Posted
Posted

Best to keep anything political out of these threads. Even banter. Nothing good can come of it. This country is pretty much divided down the middle. And its stark, and hostile. Thats the reality. Sports or other random stuff is not even comparable. Go elsewhere to discuss politics. Just my opinion of course.

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pasnownut

pasnownut

Posted
Posted
Just now, isohume said:

Oh I don't want to muck up those serious disco threads. Just saying it'd be good to know how folks roll around here.  

I get it, but by the same token I thought we live in a society that is trying to remove labels....not place them.

Here we all wear weather badges of various colors, shapes and sizes, but we all love weather....I need not know more.  For that alone is enough to like amost everyone here (nobody's perfect you know :)), but were not here to judge character based on political ideology.  I can tell you that personally, noone here scares me despite any leanings.

K....now I'm really done.

Can someone find me a snowstorm?

 

Nut

 

 

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isohume

isohume

Posted
Posted
Just now, pasnownut said:

I get it, but by the same token I thought we live in a society that is trying to remove labels....not place them.

Here we all wear weather badges of various colors, shapes and sizes, but we all love weather....I need not know more.  For that alone is enough to like amost everyone here (nobody's perfect you know :)), but were not here to judge character based on political ideology.  I can tell you that personally, noone here scares me despite any leanings.

K....now I'm really done.

Can someone find me a snowstorm?

 

Nut

 

 

That's cool man. I'm just playing with the whole thing really. 

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psuhoffman

psuhoffman

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, C.A.P.E. said:

Best to keep anything political out of these threads. Even banter. Nothing good can come of it. This country is pretty much divided down the middle. And its stark, and hostile. Thats the reality. Sports or other random stuff is not even comparable. Go elsewhere to discuss politics. Just my opinion of course.

 

1 hour ago, WinterWxLuvr said:

http://www.americanpol.com/bb/

Go get it.

I will not further engage on the argument about the media. However I still would assert and challenge anyone to retort my claim that arguing the validity of a source is not and cannot be allowed to become political. It's not an ideological claim. It's one that impugns the integrity of scientific methodology. A claim such as that should be proven or refuted as false. And that process isn't political. 

Sure anyone can claim it's political because they take one side of the debate due to their politics. But I'm attacking that link.  By that logic I can make anything  political. Global warming is political because some people choose not to believe and they base that on their ideology. The NFL spoke out against the Texas governor for his proposed transgender bathroom bill so I am boycotting them and anyone who discusses the NFL is political. Jb is a known conservative so bashing him is just liberal propaganda so we can't do that. 

So I take issue with allowing this to be labeled as political so easy. It's definitely controversial and so a valid argument is we shouldn't take about this because it upsets some people. But just because many base their opinions of this on their politics doesn't make it inherently politics. No more then my hating the redskins (I do) because of my politics (I don't it's because I'm an eagles fan) makes them political. 

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Fozz

Fozz

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, WxWatcher007 said:

I tend to agree with this. Politics is about as toxic as it has ever been in the last few decades at least. Unlike sports, there is no real ability to shoot the sh*t about trump or Obama or whoever. I do it all day everyday and have learned to put politics aside and respect/like most people. That's a rare skill these days. Best to keep all politics out of a wx board.

I think there's a difference between saying that Fox sucks and attacking someone over his politics. Obviously the latter shouldn't be tolerated here.

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CAPE

CAPE

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

That's a much less wordy way of saying my point above. 

Personally, I had no issue with your op making the analogy you did. But, there are those who watch fox news and believe it is 100% legit. And many of these same folks also believe cnn is left wing garbage. So attempting to take an objective position on the validity of a specific media source gets roped into politics and is divisive. A line is drawn whether that was the intention or not.  As a computer science major, I am all about logic, truth, and proof. It should be simple to recognize/validate fact-based reporting. It should not be subjective, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

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psuhoffman

psuhoffman

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, C.A.P.E. said:

Personally, I had no issue with your op making the analogy you did. But, there are those who watch fox news and believe it is 100% legit. And many of these same folks also believe cnn is left wing garbage. So attempting to take an objective position on the validity of a specific media source gets roped into politics and is divisive. A line is drawn whether that was the intention or not.  As a computer science major, I am all about logic, truth, and proof. It should be simple to recognize/validate fact-based reporting. It should not be subjective, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

I understand what your saying and yes it's divisive but that doesn't mean it's inherently political.  And things work however we make them. My point is I'm pushing back on the current attempt to politicize facts and reason as arbitrary. Determining the validity of a claim based on scientific methodology cannot be allowed to be coopted as political and therefore create a scenario where all truth is subjective. 50 million people can decide to call a cat a dog all they want but I'm not accepting it as truth without a valid fact based argument to back it up. Just because a group of people all decide to say something and yell and scream it very aggressively does not mean it's true. 

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Bob Chill

Bob Chill

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, C.A.P.E. said:

Best to keep anything political out of these threads. Even banter. Nothing good can come of it. This country is pretty much divided down the middle. And its stark, and hostile. Thats the reality. Sports or other random stuff is not even comparable. Go elsewhere to discuss politics. Just my opinion of course.

We'd probably better off if we didn't discuss winter wx this year either 

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