NNE Fall Thread

[ono]

1 hour ago, CoastalWx said:

That's crazy. 11.4" and snow depth 5.5".  Boy if you did the once a day method, you're snow average probably would be significantly less. 

it will even out somewhat, but you also have to account for the fact that in such a location where it snows a lot, and with varying types of snow within and across events, measuring a lot makes more of a difference.  Having lived over that way at a relatively-higher elevation (1300', waterbury center), there are 1-2 week (or more) stretches where most days produce measurable snow at 8AM when you leave for work, and more has fallen 10 hours later when you get home- but over 24-48 hours, it just doesn't add up- so a two day stretch of 12" of fluff may become 6" over 48 hours, but you basically live in a snow globe the whole time where it's constantly going, accumulating in pulses of different snow densities and magnitudes. 

Most places experience synoptic snowfall- so you just don't get the style of snowfall, which becomes living-in-a-snow cloud environment. it's apples to oranges in a lot of ways.  if you took J.Spins place at 24 hour measurements, it would less-impressive. but it would, in some respects, fail to accurately depict that microclimate. So measuring more often makes more sense- it gives you an accurate gauge of what the environment is like in such a location.

Basically, such a measurement approach would suggest that if you were to sit around and look out the window- you'd be more likely seeing snow falling given the higher totals by this method. This approach fairly depicts what would likely occur.

[J.Spin]

21 minutes ago, powderfreak said:

It would depend on when you did the once a day method.  Last night if you took the highest depth, it was pretty close.  I mean a lot of other snow falls too density wise, but yeah in any situation a firm once a day measurement would be  decently less than measuring highest snow depth every 24 hours to every 6 hours.  Everyonr had high ratio snow once 850s hit -8C or less it seemed.

 

Yeah, excellent point PF – I was getting at that as well in my response.  I guess there can be multiple approaches to the “once-a-day” method, one where you only ever measure at the one specific time of day that you clear, and another where you clear once a day at one specific time, but monitor for maximum depth throughout the 24-hour period.  I agree that with the latter method you’d generally be in the ballpark of what you’d get from more frequent clearings.

[Lava Rock]

it will even out somewhat, but you also have to account for the fact that in such a location where it snows a lot, and with varying types of snow within and across events, measuring a lot makes more of a difference.  Having lived over that way at a relatively-higher elevation (1300', waterbury center), there are 1-2 week (or more) stretches where most days produce measurable snow at 8AM when you leave for work, and more has fallen 10 hours later when you get home- but over 24-48 hours, it just doesn't add up- so a two day stretch of 12" of fluff may become 6" over 48 hours, but you basically live in a snow globe the whole time where it's constantly going, accumulating in pulses of different snow densities and magnitudes. 

Most places experience synoptic snowfall- so you just don't get the style of snowfall, which becomes living-in-a-snow cloud environment. it's apples to oranges in a lot of ways.  if you took J.Spins place at 24 hour measurements, it would less-impressive. but it would, in some respects, fail to accurately depict that microclimate. So measuring more often makes more sense- it gives you an accurate gauge of what the environment is like in such a location.

Basically, such a measurement approach would suggest that if you were to sit around and look out the window- you'd be more likely seeing snow falling given the higher totals by this method. This approach fairly depicts what would likely occur.

Must be great living in a real world snow globe. Constant snow for days is very cool.

[alex]

New to this as you know but it's pretty amazing to have had 55 hours (and counting) or so of almost constant snow before Thanksgiving. I forget it's fall. 

[ono]

3 hours ago, Lava Rock said:

Must be great living in a real world snow globe. Constant snow for days is very cool.

It is very cool, as long as you have dependable snow removal. When it somewhat unexpectedly dumps 12-15" of dense windblown up on the side of the mountain before a typical 40 minute commute down to Burlington with 1-2", you're shoveling for 90 minutes only to call some coworker down in the Champlain Valley to cover ya (crap tractor/snowblower as a renter) it's a great place to live, but it can be like living in a slightly different world.  Many nights heading home, a 40 minute commute turns into near 60 minutes, starting somewhere at or before J.Spin's neck of the woods. Can take a toll.

[J.Spin]

Event totals: 11.6” Snow/1.03” L.E.

 

At some point last night, sleet mixed into the precipitation around here – it made up the bulk of the stack on the snowboards this morning and there’s a bit of a crust on the snowpack.  The BTV NWS did mention the loss of ice crystal formation in their evening discussion, with the potential for rime at elevation.

 

Area Forecast Discussion

National Weather Service Burlington VT

955 PM EST Tue Nov 22 2016

 

.NEAR TERM /UNTIL 10 AM WEDNESDAY MORNING/...

As we get further into the evening, the depth of the moisture is expected to decrease a little bit more such that we`ll lose most of the ice crystal formation ability and leave us with just clouds filled with super-cooled water. Probably means some rime icing overnight at the highest elevations.

 

Details from the 6:00 A.M. Waterbury observations:

 

New Snow: 0.2 inches (snow/sleet)

New Liquid: 0.06 inches

Snow/Water Ratio: 3.3

Snow Density: 30.0% H2O

Temperature: 28.4 F

Sky: Flurries

Snow at the stake: 4.0”

[adk]

I'd say it was more like freezing drizzle. Crust on all the snow was robust. Sleet tends not to crust like that. Also you could really feel it on 89 and 100 - from Bolton notch through to about the Waterbury / Stowe town line

[wxeyeNH]

Happy Thanksgiving NNElanders..

Wed PM Musings

Finally went above freezing this afternoon after 2 days of sub freezing.  With almost full sun now (Thank you downsloping)  35F seems warm.

Interesting but confusing (to me) weather coming up.  Tomorrow looks clear cut with light snow. Maybe 2-4"?    What happens towards and over the weekend?  Interior Maine and the Northern Whites look best for snow.  I have no idea what would happen here in Central NH.  Guess one day at a time with changes in each model run on placement of QPF.  12Z Euro has about 3-6"  Greens but 8-14" Whites and Interior Maine over the next 4 days.

 

[alex]

Happy Thanksgiving, Gene and everyone! It feels a lot like Xmas...  stuck in the 20s with occasional flurries, and trees still nicely covered. Interestingly the snow on the ground has been melting/sublimating/compacting quite a bit more than the stuff on the deck and the trees. Warm ground??? Ok, Ok, I won't start that... Enjoy your turkeys and your family time!

[powderfreak]

1 hour ago, alex said:

Happy Thanksgiving, Gene and everyone! It feels a lot like Xmas...  stuck in the 20s with occasional flurries, and trees still nicely covered. Interestingly the snow on the ground has been melting/sublimating/compacting quite a bit more than the stuff on the deck and the trees. Warm ground??? Ok, Ok, I won't start that... Enjoy your turkeys and your family time!

Ha funny you mention that cause I've noticed that too in areas.  Elevated objects, decks, tables, even downed trees all seem to be holding more snow than the ground now...its like slowly melting from underneath.  About 3-4" in the yard and 5-6" on the deck.  I have to imagine the ground is still pretty warm given the torch of the first 2 weeks of November.  The snow has to just be insulating that instead of helping freeze it.

 

[powderfreak]

3 hours ago, wxeyeNH said:

Happy Thanksgiving NNElanders..

Wed PM Musings

Finally went above freezing this afternoon after 2 days of sub freezing.  With almost full sun now (Thank you downsloping)  35F seems warm.

Interesting but confusing (to me) weather coming up.  Tomorrow looks clear cut with light snow. Maybe 2-4"?    What happens towards and over the weekend?  Interior Maine and the Northern Whites look best for snow.  I have no idea what would happen here in Central NH.  Guess one day at a time with changes in each model run on placement of QPF.  12Z Euro has about 3-6"  Greens but 8-14" Whites and Interior Maine over the next 4 days.

 

I'm thinking 4" is a stretch for anyone (but who knows I guess) though I think we all should see a widespread 1-2". 

Either way, should be a stretch of wintery weather for NNE.  Good potential coming up.

[powderfreak]

7 hours ago, adk said:

I'd say it was more like freezing drizzle. Crust on all the snow was robust. Sleet tends not to crust like that. Also you could really feel it on 89 and 100 - from Bolton notch through to about the Waterbury / Stowe town line

What was odd is that the mountain received freezing drizzle/mist/fog while down here in town we had light snow.  I have no crust at all in the yard and yesterday afternoon through this morning brought almost an inch of that small flake snow (almost snow mist) that sticks to every tree branch and gives a very wintery look when added to the snow from Monday night.

 

You can see it on the BTV daily climate map... almost like an unblocked flow or something with an axis of 2-3" about 10 miles east of the Spine axis.  The village here definitely had a snowier outcome than the mountain...not sure if better lift hit the snow growth zone or if the cold was a little deeper east of the crest, but this morning I left the house to steady light snow and hit freezing mist in the Topnotch/Matterhorn area.

 

[J.Spin]

22 hours ago, adk said:

I'd say it was more like freezing drizzle. Crust on all the snow was robust. Sleet tends not to crust like that. Also you could really feel it on 89 and 100 - from Bolton notch through to about the Waterbury / Stowe town line

 

Agreed on the freezing drizzle – we headed up to Bolton Valley for some turns this morning and found that sort of crust.  Down here at the house there was certainly some sleet in the amalgam on the snowboard though – perhaps due to some droplets having to fall farther through the colder air to get all the way down to us here in the valley.

 

With respect to the skiing today, whatever mixed precipitation did come into the area did so from the northwest, and so at least at Bolton, whatever areas were protected from the northwest were devoid of crust.  Seeking out those areas yielded some nice turns today:

 

 

It’s kind of too bad that the little bit of mixed precipitation moved though because conditions were wall-to-wall great yesterday.  That was definitely the peak with respect to snow quality for this storm cycle, but hey, it looks like we’ve got two more snowstorms coming in the next few days anyway to freshen things up.

[J.Spin]

As of ~7:30 A.M. or so, light snow has started up here at the house in association with the next incoming system.  The vestiges of Winter Storm Argos actually finished up less than 24 hours ago, so we’re definitely in an active pattern.

[adk]

Snowing pretty good right now in BTV right now. About .75" on cold surfaces right now after an hour or so of snow. 

Gives it a nice feel.

4" seems a little unlikely but who knows. Even just 2" would do a lot to eat up the crust and fill in tracks. 

[klw]

Snowing at a good clip here too.  not much on the ground yet but we already had a nice covering.  Hopefully this will cover up the yellow snow well.  Some of the bushes and trees are still weighted down from last weekend.  This could prove interesting.

[wxeyeNH]

29.2/24  light snow started  9:30am  Accumulating on all surfaces.  Vis about 2-3miles

[mreaves]

1 hour ago, adk said:

Snowing pretty good right now in BTV right now. About .75" on cold surfaces right now after an hour or so of snow. 

Gives it a nice feel.

4" seems a little unlikely but who knows. Even just 2" would do a lot to eat up the crust and fill in tracks. 

 

1 hour ago, klw said:

Snowing at a good clip here too.  not much on the ground yet but we already had a nice covering.  Hopefully this will cover up the yellow snow well.  Some of the bushes and trees are still weighted down from last weekend.  This could prove interesting.

Snowing nicely here too. I guess I wasn't paying too much attention to the forecast but I wasn't really expecting much so this feels like a bonus. This past week is the most wintry it has felt in seemingly forever. I certainly have a hard time remembering much from last year. A good start to this year so far. 

[eyewall]

A burst of moderate snow now ongoing here.

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk

[Hitman]

Happy football day!

in the berkshires with about 6-8" settled otg at 1200'

winter forecast courtesy of Josh fox.

http://madriverglenweather.blogspot.com/2016/11/the-enso-has-been-neutralized-and.html?m=1

[eyewall]

Well that band dropped a quick inch. Too bad it shut off so quick.

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk

[J.Spin]

We’ve picked up close to two inches from this storm already, which covers the BTV NWS point forecast for accumulations through the overnight.

 

We’re definitely moving into an above average November for snowfall now – the last event got us into the average range, but anything we get for rest of the month is definitely going to be a bonus.

[powderfreak]

I picked up an even inch at home though it's snowing nicely now so we'll have more accums to report.  

Up at the mountain it was 1.75" and 2.5"...the zone between a healthy 1-2" and a weaker 2-3" haha.  I prefer the healthy 1-2" so that was the call on the report, but hopefully tonight can fill in the half inch gap lol.  

 

[mreaves]

33 minutes ago, powderfreak said:

I picked up an even inch at home though it's snowing nicely now so we'll have more accums to report.  

Up at the mountain it was 1.75" and 2.5"...the zone between a healthy 1-2" and a weaker 2-3" haha.  I prefer the healthy 1-2" so that was the call on the report, but hopefully tonight can fill in the half inch gap lol.  

 

I assume you have the snowboards up and running right?  1500' and 3000' iirc. 

[J.Spin]

Event totals: 1.7” Snow/0.13” L.E.

 

We headed down the Boston/South Shore area today for holiday festivities with family, and it was a bit like traveling in a time machine back into fall down there, with temperatures in the mid-40s F, green grass, and even some leaves on the trees.  Having been out in the snow a lot over the past several days it was a bit of a climate shock, but nice to be back in some fairly comfortable temperatures.  It seemed like fairly classic SNE Thanksgiving weather.

 

We got to see quite a spread of weather on the trip, so I can pass along some observations.  We left the house in Waterbury to steady light snow with a half inch to an inch of fresh down, and the first thing I noted was that once we were past Waterbury the snowpack petered out to essentially nothing.  Then, as we rose up to the higher elevations of I-89 in the Northfield area, the snowpack returned and actually became pretty impressive.  Temperatures were in the 28 – 32 F range, snowfall continued, and roads were quite snowy until we dropped down into West Lebanon on the Connecticut River.  Snowfall made a brief resurgence as we rose up out of West Lebanon, but pretty much faded once we were past the Grantham area.  From that point on, precipitation tapered away and temperatures rose up into the mid 40s F.

 

On the way home, temperatures dropped continuously until we finally hit 32 F in the Grantham area.  There was actually some fairly heavy rain around Boston, and snow seemed to be mixing in a bit before we got to New London, but precipitation wasn’t fully over to snow until Grantham, and roads didn’t become snowy again until we were way back up in the heights of I-89.  Snow tapered off to basically just flurries once we dropped back down to Montpelier and the roads were just wet.

 

Here at the house we picked up 1.7” of snow comprised of 0.13” of liquid.

 

Details from the 10:00 P.M. Waterbury observations:

 

New Snow: 1.7 inches

New Liquid: 0.13 inches

Snow/Water Ratio: 13.1

Snow Density: 7.6% H2O

Temperature: 33.8 F

Sky: Flurries

Snow at the stake: 3.0”

[CoastalWx]

7 hours ago, J.Spin said:

Event totals: 1.7” Snow/0.13” L.E.

 

We headed down the Boston/South Shore area today for holiday festivities with family, and it was a bit like traveling in a time machine back into fall down there, with temperatures in the mid-40s F, green grass, and even some leaves on the trees.  Having been out in the snow a lot over the past several days it was a bit of a climate shock, but nice to be back in some fairly comfortable temperatures.  It seemed like fairly classic SNE Thanksgiving weather.

 

We got to see quite a spread of weather on the trip, so I can pass along some observations.  We left the house in Waterbury to steady light snow with a half inch to an inch of fresh down, and the first thing I noted was that once we were past Waterbury the snowpack petered out to essentially nothing.  Then, as we rose up to the higher elevations of I-89 in the Northfield area, the snowpack returned and actually became pretty impressive.  Temperatures were in the 28 – 32 F range, snowfall continued, and roads were quite snowy until we dropped down into West Lebanon on the Connecticut River.  Snowfall made a brief resurgence as we rose up out of West Lebanon, but pretty much faded once we were past the Grantham area.  From that point on, precipitation tapered away and temperatures rose up into the mid 40s F.

 

On the way home, temperatures dropped continuously until we finally hit 32 F in the Grantham area.  There was actually some fairly heavy rain around Boston, and snow seemed to be mixing in a bit before we got to New London, but precipitation wasn’t fully over to snow until Grantham, and roads didn’t become snowy again until we were way back up in the heights of I-89.  Snow tapered off to basically just flurries once we dropped back down to Montpelier and the roads were just wet.

 

Here at the house we picked up 1.7” of snow comprised of 0.13” of liquid.

 

Details from the 10:00 P.M. Waterbury observations:

 

New Snow: 1.7 inches

New Liquid: 0.13 inches

Snow/Water Ratio: 13.1

Snow Density: 7.6% H2O

Temperature: 33.8 F

Sky: Flurries

Snow at the stake: 3.0”

Norwell, MA?   We've had a warm fall with the lack of cold until last week really. Hoping for some winter after next week's mess.

[dryslot]

Perfect hunting day

[J.Spin]

2 hours ago, CoastalWx said:

Norwell, MA?   We've had a warm fall with the lack of cold until last week really. Hoping for some winter after next week's mess.

 

Norwell indeed, it was nice – boys got out and played some soccer.  Most of the leaves on the trees were the oaks of course, but a few others were also hanging on.  From what I could tell off the web, it looks like high temps in the mid to upper-40s F is pretty typical for the date.

[klw]

2 inches here. Probably has compacted/melted a bit but 2 is what I measured.

[tamarack]

3 hours ago, dryslot said:

Perfect hunting day

Unfortunately, all the deer movement around here happened during the snow, probably near midnight.  However, the 1.4" made for quiet, though it loaded the trees and cut visibility by about 2/3.  I'll be back out later; we'll see about tomorrow - if it's steady RA I may chicken out, as I've had no success, or even near success, during that type of wx over my 60 years of chasing the critters.