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Possible 2/16 storm threat


UlsterCountySnowZ

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Still mostly concerned with that 42-50 hour overrunning. The NAM really likes it but thus far no other guidance does. If that shortwave hangs on longer than expected before washing out there could be a wide swath of overrunning snows across Ern PA into NYC early Friday morning

The Canadian does.

WAA is sometimes under modeled. The GFS at 12z hour 54 has no precip but look at its 700 mb field .

That looks like it should be snowing there.

Curious to see if more guidance picks up on the front side of this before it all flips.

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I remember a similar storm up here... With 84 as the battle line, 2013 I believe... I lived in Orange County about 10 miles south of 84.. I was suppose to change to rain.... I snowed heavy with a tailend changeover to sleet... Forecast models said rain was going north of 84.... However everyone north of 84 stayed all snow, cold toungue just kept penetrating

Was the synoptic setup similar?

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I find it hard to believe that this particular arctic air will just escape without a fight so fast and so far north

It won't in areas that wedge down in the carolinas and VA. The RGEM came in insanely cold down in WRN VA NC SC and NERN GA. The Euro and GFS aren't seeing that wedge at all. Up this way the wind goes SE and that is the end of it, the wildcard here is if the NAM idea of early overrunning is correct

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It won't in areas that wedge down in the carolinas and VA. The RGEM came in insanely cold down in WRN VA NC SC and NERN GA. The Euro and GFS aren't seeing that wedge at all. Up this way the wind goes SE and that is the end of it, the wildcard here is if the NAM idea of early overrunning is correct

yes and the GFS does not have the early overrunning but Upton and Mt. Holly are going with it - I think the GFS is underestimating the cold air and overestimating the ocean SE flow off it effecting the thermal profiles warming everyone up to quickly

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I find it hard to believe that this particular arctic air will just escape without a fight so fast and so far north

All you need is an amplified shortwave and you'd be amazed how quickly it can scour out even unmodified arctic air at the surface on south winds. The argument that a surface low can't plow into even an unmodified arctic dome with 3 feet of snowcover under it is a fallacy. It is very possible and has happened many times. Snow and arctic air entrenched in the boundary layer means nothing to low track, it doesn't "force" the low track to go around it despite false popular belief, all you need is a strong mid/upper level shortwave driving it...
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All you need is an amplified shortwave and you'd be amazed how quickly it can scour out even unmodified arctic air at the surface on south winds. The argument that a surface low can't plow into even an unmodified arctic dome with 3 feet of snowcover under it is a fallacy. It is very possible and has happened many times. Snow and arctic air entrenched in the boundary layer means nothing to low track, it doesn't "force" the low track to go around it despite false popular belief, all you need is a strong mid/upper level shortwave driving it...

what I am trying to say is that the 1035 HP is parked right over us Sunday night and is putting up a fight against the approaching storm - that type of strong HP doesn't usually leave without a fight - this was no run of the mill arctic airmass - was near or record breaking around the region

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what I am trying to say is that the 1035 HP is parked right over us Sunday night and is putting up a fight against the approaching storm - that type of strong HP doesn't usually leave without a fight - this was no run of the mill arctic airmass - was near or record breaking around the region

It really won't matter if the models are correct on the track of this storm.

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All you need is an amplified shortwave and you'd be amazed how quickly it can scour out even unmodified arctic air at the surface on south winds. The argument that a surface low can't plow into even an unmodified arctic dome with 3 feet of snowcover under it is a fallacy. It is very possible and has happened many times. Snow and arctic air entrenched in the boundary layer means nothing to low track, it doesn't "force" the low track to go around it despite false popular belief, all you need is a strong mid/upper level shortwave driving it...

 

I believe his point is that the models often underestimate the depth of the arctic air until it's actually established over a given area which ultimately drives the forecast outcome. Both of your points can co-exist. In my opinion, there's still way too many fluctuations from run to run to make any sort of prediction at this point, other than that a mixed bag is likely. How much of each is to be determined.

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All you need is an amplified shortwave and you'd be amazed how quickly it can scour out even unmodified arctic air at the surface on south winds. The argument that a surface low can't plow into even an unmodified arctic dome with 3 feet of snowcover under it is a fallacy. It is very possible and has happened many times. Snow and arctic air entrenched in the boundary layer means nothing to low track, it doesn't "force" the low track to go around it despite false popular belief, all you need is a strong mid/upper level shortwave driving it...

Your not going to be happy until it's 70 in February. Water temps are way down its the heart of snow season

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