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March Threats/Snow Storms Pt. II


mitchnick

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That EPO is ripping thru man.

You can see even a 'good' pattern keeps us right on the fringe of enough cold late in the ens. wischasting/leaning favorable is cool in january.. in mid-March I'm going to push back hard.

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careful...you downplayed, if not poo-poo'ed, Thursday's event 5 days out too

anything's possible in MAR as long as we can revert back to the pattern of the last 3+ weeks after next week's break

no i didn't.. you're an anti science weenie. if you're going to lie I will attack you. just because I wasn't locking in on models 7 days out is not poo pooing.. learn some things. i saw the same **** you did.. i can formulate thoughts without making an unnecessary call from range and then praying.

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By the 15th? Not seeing that. What are you looking at? Looks more like the 18th-20th to me.

wxbell numerical indices page. Euro/gem/gfs ops and ensembles all show the nao dipping negative on the 15th. Trough in the east doesn't establish until the 18-19th so initially it means nothing other than a #.

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You might need to clarify further. We just had a major snow with a ridiculously positive AO, a ridiculously negative PNA, and a positive NAO.

I said unless there is a very anomalous setup. I went back and checked IAD's #. 80% of marches with decent snow had a moderate to strong -nao on the means for the month. I didn't say it was required. It certainly ups the odds.

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wxbell numerical indices page. Euro/gem/gfs ops and ensembles all show the nao dipping negative on the 15th. Trough in the east doesn't establish until the 18-19th so initially it means nothing other than a #.

NOAA ensemble page keeps it positive or close to neutral till after that. Only a few below that. There's a difference between having an -NAO on charts and having a good setup for us. I don't see a good -NAO till after on GFS and Euro ensembles. Still have pretty low height over Greenland/west by the 15th on eps/gfs ens.
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NOAA ensemble page keeps it positive or close to neutral till after that. Only a few below that. There's a difference between having an -NAO on charts and having a good setup for us. I don't see a good -NAO till after on GFS and Euro ensembles. Still have pretty low height over Greenland/west by the 15th on eps/gfs ens.

Agreed. It's probably the higher heights over Iceland on the 15th dropping the index before the pattern looks better on paper. It builds in the from the east so it's a process obviously. I think seeing fairly strong consensus with the upper air pattern after the 15th gives the idea some credence but we've been fooled plenty.

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On paper the means look good for around 18-21st. Something could happen, but we all  know avg high temps are in the 50s etc. I am going to keep enjoying the snow thats on the ground today, then enjoy the normal March weather we get over the next week or so. After that, I probably wont care either way if it snows again.

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Agreed. It's probably the higher heights over Iceland on the 15th dropping the index before the pattern looks better on paper. It builds in the from the east so it's a process obviously. I think seeing fairly strong consensus with the upper air pattern after the 15th gives the idea some credence but we've been fooled plenty.

Fair enough. I don't really disagree with you fundamentally. I think the move is def toward a negative nao.. More wondering if it will be too late for anything but cold air. I dont look at the charts much. I think you are pretty honest in your interpretation.. Really not trying to pick a fight with anyone on this. Just don't really appreciate that sometimes waiting for things to come together is viewed as a negative here.
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It's still pretty far off for something we don't do often here.

 

 

Euro looks decent.. best south of here. You know the rest of my thoughts lol.

 

 

Maybe except in this case it's probably most likely to fall apart and shift southeast. ;)

 

 

no i didn't.. you're an anti science weenie. if you're going to lie I will attack you. just because I wasn't locking in on models 7 days out is not poo pooing.. learn some things. i saw the same **** you did.. i can formulate thoughts without making an unnecessary call from range and then praying.

I said 5 days out....storm March 5, go back 5 days to 2/28

those posts clearly showed you were at least downplaying it

you've been in DC too long my friend, you think snarky answers and equivocal statements are going to make you right more often than not instead of taking a real stand

bottom line, you down played it and poo-poo'ed it and calling me a liar and cursing doesn't change those facts

and apparently me calling the pattern must piss you off     lol

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Fair enough. I don't really disagree with you fundamentally. I think the move is def toward a negative nao.. More wondering if it will be too late for anything but cold air. I dont look at the charts much. I think you are pretty honest in your interpretation.. Really not trying to pick a fight with anyone on this. Just don't really appreciate that sometimes waiting for things to come together is viewed as a negative here.

I totally get where you're coming from. I'm probably no different in how I feel about chances but I'm a self proclaimed optimist so that spin is always rooted in my posts when looking a good bit down the line.

For the record, I think the chance of seeing snow fall again is better than 50/50. Otoh- the chances of a warning criteria event outside of elevation is less than 10%. A sloppy inch or two is 25% at best. If the flip to cold gets pushed back further in time like it often does then odds decrease quickly.

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I said 5 days out....storm March 5, go back 5 days to 2/28

those posts clearly showed you were at least downplaying it

you've been in DC too long my friend, you think snarky answers and equivocal statements are going to make you right more often than not instead of taking a real stand

bottom line, you down played it and poo-poo'ed it and calling me a liar and cursing doesn't change those facts

and apparently me calling the pattern must piss you off     lol

wait you're quoting my posts from a week out? i actually never said it wasn't going to happen.. i did repeatedly say it was not a typical setup to score big (it wasn't) and that we 'just can't know yet' as a joke and because i was tracking a system ahead of it.  in 09-10 a lot of weenies had a great year of forecasting too. i never poo pooed anything.. in fact I was quite bullish in a realistic range so please STFU. no real forecasters say we're a lock on something a week out.. maybe you can't understand that.

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wait you're quoting my posts from a week out? i actually never said it wasn't going to happen.. i did repeatedly say it was not a typical setup to score big (it wasn't) and that we 'just can't know yet' as a joke and because i was tracking a system ahead of it.  in 09-10 a lot of weenies had a great year of forecasting too. i never poo pooed anything.. in fact I was quite bullish in a realistic range so please STFU. no real forecasters say we're a lock on something a week out.. maybe you can't understand that.

haha....5 DAYS, not a week, what are you reading? (3/5 minus 1 day is 3/4, 3/4 minus 1 day is 3/3, 3/3 minus 1 day is 3/2, 3/2 minus 1 day is 3/1, 3/1 minus 1 day is 2/28-the dates of the posts I quoted) 

again,  wrt to your characterization, you are not reading, I said down-played, if not poo-poo'ed

and then there is your obligatory "maybe you can't understand"....again, that DC thing  

look, your posts are there and mine are there...you obviously take this way more seriously than I do

if anyone is bored they can go back and look

 

p.s.: speaking of a week out, I think it was a week, if not more, that I said I felt we were in for at least one more moderate event defined as 4"+     ;)

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Gefs are a little more bullish with the high than the OP. day 7-8. . It will be hard to get snow this far south, but I have a feeling SNE will get buried again.

 

Edit: euro gives the GEFS the finger and is still insisting on a Pactorch for all  of the US day 7-10.  Will see a few days in the 60s if that verifies.

 

Edit2: Looking at the height animosities we are relying on a backdoor cold front to get near normal temps in the day7-10 period. Otherwise it will be well above normal, was dumb of me to talk about snow in the timeframe.

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Euro has a major bias of Too much trough in west this year when historic pdo does not support it especially in 7 to 10 day range

The next 7-10 days look terrible for snow chances across the board. We need an arctic high to drop down and get trapped. Or time with something. That's not happening until the -epo comes back. Canada is going to get assaulted with pac air in the medium range. Even a strong hp in se canada won't deliver what we need. Hopefully the pattern advertised from the 18-23rd happens in some fashion.

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The next 7-10 days look terrible for snow chances across the board. We need an arctic high to drop down and get trapped. Or time with something. That's not happening until the -epo comes back. Canada is going to get assaulted with pac air in the medium range. Even a strong hp in se canada won't deliver what we need. Hopefully the pattern advertised from the 18-23rd happens in some fashion.

Yeah I thought anything next weekend looked back-doorish when I looked this morning. Thats not gonna do it here, esp not in March. The 0z GFS ens mean looked quite good for around the 20th. Have been out enjoying the weather so not paid attention to today's guidance.

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We managed snow after the 20th both last year and in 2013. With a look like this on the ensembles I'm not so sure why others are so bearish on snow later in the month. Obviously any event would have to be at night and would probably be more slushy than snowy inside the city. 

 

P003 has Bob Chill's HECS.

 

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