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Post super bowl storm Model discussion


UlsterCountySnowZ

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I would like to see how far north the 850 zero gets on 12z Euro.

Would like to see back at Toms River like it had it yesterday at 12z , At 0z it took it to Perth Amboy .

The NAM seem to see the confluence at 36 - Last night at 48 the SLP was in Indiana , today it was in N Kentucky .

Those 50 - 75 mile jogs are going to matter .

Another 50 mile jog and you lock the city in totally .

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There is going to be a long period of sleet from NYC, through the I-78 corridor down to New Brunswick area.  Good thing the warm layer is shallow enough to prevent freezing rain.  Models probably underestimating cold at the surface.  Could be a lot of sleet obs at 24 and 25 degrees Monday morning in these areas

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Around the same point, the RGEM 00z had the mix line around Atlantic City. The 12 has it around Staten Island.....Brings it north after that.....Starting to go with the rest of guidance :

74671b5d0ce753f916d5bc77f288508e.jpg

Lol that's intereting given that it only goes out to 48. 48 hrs from 00z is 00z Monday. That time stamp is 12z Monday. Only a 12 hr difference no biggie

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Lol that's intereting given that it only goes out to 48. 48 hrs from 00z is 00z Monday. That time stamp is 12z Monday. Only a 12 hr difference no biggie

You're right. The comparison image that I looked at was where the GGEM continues from the RGEM on the site, so it lumps it together out to 120hrs lower resolution beyond 48. But the frames before that seemed to match the natural progression of the shift north with the mix/rain line

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You're right. The comparison image that I looked at was where the GGEM continues from the RGEM on the site, so it lumps it together out to 120hrs lower resolution beyond 48. But the frames before that seemed to match the natural progression of the shift north with the mix/rain line

I agree that at this point all the guidance is within 25 miles of each other essentially. But when nyc is the dividing line even 10 miles is huge!

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As I've said a few times before, with regard to impact on travel, shoveling, etc., mass of frozen precip is all that matters.  So, even if we only get a few inches of snow, but then get a lot of sleet on top of that and even rain, freezing or not, which will simply be absorbed by the snow/sleet, it's the same mass of frozen precip at the end of the day.  Sure, all snow is prettier and will get more attention, but I've always felt frozen mass is a far better way of comparing storms. 

 

I also think that some of the models are overdoing it with the northward progression of warm air and that the Euro has it right in that we'll get mostly snow, like 6-10" in the Edison area (my opinion is based on what a few folks here and elsewhere have sai, plus decades of observation on systems like this where models seem to underestimate the strength of the cold air - like a couple last March and Feb 2010, if I recall correctly - the one with the insane gradient from 0" in NYC to 2 feet in Philly)

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I wouldn't worry too much about freezing rain unless the 925mb freezing line comes further North. For freezing rain you really need the BL to be the only layer below freezing. In this case the BL stays cold because of the strong CAD but the mid-level lows stay far enough to the South that I believe any mixing would be sleet unless you were just North of the rain line.

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Every other layer is cold DAN

Our problem is once the 850 low is in CPA we have to flip. For a while

You say things with such conviction.., chill with the guaranteesthink probabilistically.

I'm not saying we don't snow a lot here, perhaps 3-5" in 3 hours stuff with the crazy frontogenic forcing.

But the mix line usually sets up north of the 850 0c...how many times do we see sneaky warmth bust a forecast? And no, heavy rates overcoming mid level warmth is the exception, not the rule.

5-8 would be my first call for nyc, but fragile setup.

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