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Central PA & Fringes - December-January 2014-15


djr5001

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00z NAM is not your friend.  Strung out and warm.  The great lakes low is about 2 - 3 mb weaker, but the entire storm comes at the LSV in pieces.  Maybe a half decent burst of precip in the mid afternoon, otherwise it's nothing to write home about.

 

That's more like the NAM.. if it isn't dumping 4-6 feet on someone it's a strung out mess like that haha. Despite the new GFS being unknown with it's tendencies with coastals or even just rolling with it's past tendency of being too far SE,  I don't really like the fact that it has largely backed off today with getting much into our region or really PA as a whole after being in pretty good agreement with the Euro. I guess we'll see if that continues shortly with 0z... and later on with the rest of the suite. 

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GFS OTS...lol, truth be told, I'd rather have that than the fringe game. It's like better to lose badly than to lose a heartbreaker.

 

That juiced up clipper right behind it might end up delivering a better storm Sun/Mon for the entire commonwealth anyways... dang.

 

And while I've been able to see how we can get this southern stream storm up to where it affects most of us, I really don't like the setup for it outside of the Sus Valley and maybe southern tier, and even there it's tentative IMO. There just seems like too much influence from the northern branch that kinda presses the storm (e.g the great lakes low). We'll see how things go the rest of tonight and tomorrow. If we do end up having to punt this storm, I'm not worried.. it looks like an active and eventually quite cold pattern could be evolving as we end out January. 

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That juiced up clipper right behind it might end up delivering a better storm Sun/Mon for the entire commonwealth anyways... dang.

 

And while I've been able to see how we can get this southern stream storm up to where it affects most of us, I really don't like the setup for it outside of the Sus Valley and maybe southern tier, and even there it's tentative IMO. There just seems like too much influence from the northern branch that kinda presses the storm (e.g the great lakes low). We'll see how things go the rest of tonight and tomorrow. If we do end up having to punt this storm, I'm not worried.. it looks like an active and eventually quite cold pattern could be evolving as we end out January. 

Screw it...I will take a clipper train that slowly piles up the snow ;)

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Looks like 2.5-3" is what the state college area ended up with per the PNS. Another couple inches with the clipper late this weekend and we'll have a decent run of having the ground covered at least.

Measured 2.5" in Bellefonte...seems pretty uniform across the county.

 

06z GFS goes a little crazy with the Sunday night-Monday clipper and drops like 10" here...yeah right.  As CTP mentioned though, it does look stronger than yesterday's clipper and should have more moisture to work with.  Low track also looks really nice for us, so it certainly could end up being a high-end clipper event...3-6" instead of the usual 1-3".

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Those runs last night and this morning are nothing short of dejecting if you wanted a big storm. I mentioned the prospects of 4-8" were a good call yesterday by the look of the morning runs, but also emphasized the setup was less than ideal for a lock. The lack of a high pressure setup to our north combined with a low scooting across the northern Great Lakes is always worrisome. In order to combat such a setup, you need basically the ultimate thread the needle. Yesterday morning had it and now today it does not. The NW precip shield of the storm looks less enthusiastic looking for many here and the mid levels are not exactly screaming for a prolific snow event. It's been a rough go for those that have been at least eyeing the potential. I'm not giving a final call till tomorrow, but I can assure you by the looks of it, 4-8" for the LSV probably will not be it.

On the bright side, down the road (I know this has been said numerous times) it looks to be getting more into a favorable period for cold and southern wave systems. The long range depiction shows a displaced PV to the southeast in Quebec with really cold air settling in over the eastern half of the CONUS. The GFS and Euro both show very cold anomalies infultrating the region for a period mid next week and even another shot by next weekend. The STJ looks to remain active with a few pulses ejecting across the south with NS energy close by. It's not likely all will provide a storm , but the ingredients are there. I will not go into specifics of model runs because they will change numerous times before we come close to those periods. I'll say to watch out for anything in early February at this point. Winter might finally be arriving, but will it deliver the snow or not remains to be seen. The look for colder conditions looks more favorable at this juncture.

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Those runs last night and this morning are nothing short of dejecting if you wanted a big storm. I mentioned the prospects of 4-8" were a good call yesterday by the look of the morning runs, but also emphasized the setup was less than ideal for a lock. The lack of a high pressure setup to our north combined with a low scooting across the northern Great Lakes is always worrisome. In order to combat such a setup, you need basically the ultimate thread the needle. Yesterday morning had it and now today it does not. The NW precip shield of the storm looks less enthusiastic looking for many here and the mid levels are not exactly screaming for a prolific snow event. It's been a rough go for those that have been at least eyeing the potential. I'm not giving a final call till tomorrow, but I can assure you by the looks of it, 4-8" for the LSV probably will not be it.

On the bright side, down the road (I know this has been said numerous times) it looks to be getting more into a favorable period for cold and southern wave systems. The long range depiction shows a displaced PV to the southeast in Quebec with really cold air settling in over the eastern half of the CONUS. The GFS and Euro both show very cold anomalies infultrating the region for a period mid next week and even another shot by next weekend. The STJ looks to remain active with a few pulses ejecting across the south with NS energy close by. It's not likely all will provide a storm , but the ingredients are there. I will not go into specifics of model runs because they will change numerous times before we come close to those periods. I'll say to watch out for anything in early February at this point. Winter might finally be arriving, but will it deliver the snow or not remains to be seen. The look for colder conditions looks more favorable at this juncture.

Unless you can get some serious blocking downstream, it will be very unlikely to produce any widespread, significant snow.  Wes Junker has posted a chart (can't find it on my computer offhand) of the number of 6"+ snowstorms with a La Nada pattern AND +NAO.  The stats show that <20% of storms occur during such a pattern.

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Unless you can get some serious blocking downstream, it will be very unlikely to produce any widespread, significant snow. Wes Junker has posted a chart (can't find it on my computer offhand) of the number of 6"+ snowstorms with a La Nada pattern AND +NAO. The stats show that <20% of storms occur during such a pattern.

I understand. That point was also given by Kocin and Ucellini in their NE Snowstorm book as well. I didn't imply there was a good chance, but just a better shot than the recent pattern we've been given. I mentioned at the end of my post that getting snow in the upcoming pattern remains to be seen. The progressive flow pattern throughout the winter still remains in play and will continue to impact the general forecast. The main difference is the supply of colder air into the eastern US helps with any upcoming system the next few weeks. The cold will be transient, but the shots of cold look to be the best of the winter season so far. I'd rather take my chances working with that setup than what we are dealing with this weekend for example. We'll see how it goes I guess.
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How's the Euro looking?

actually fairly similar to GFS for Saturday but still not much more than dusting - 2" for most of us... but then has clipper system for Monday much weaker with marginal temps and not as much moisture... a ton of gulf moisture available that would have been nice to be able to tap into for Saturday...

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actually fairly similar to GFS for Saturday but still not much more than dusting - 2" for most of us... but then has clipper system for Monday much weaker with marginal temps and not as much moisture... a ton of gulf moisture available that would have been nice to be able to tap into for Saturday...

Thanks for the update!

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actually fairly similar to GFS for Saturday but still not much more than dusting - 2" for most of us... but then has clipper system for Monday much weaker with marginal temps and not as much moisture... a ton of gulf moisture available that would have been nice to be able to tap into for Saturday...

 

Huh?

 

The Sunday night/Monday clipper is much stronger and more moist on the 12z Euro than it was on the 00z Euro. It's got a swath over >0.35" amounts for most of north-central PA.

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Huh?

 

The Sunday night/Monday clipper is much stronger and more moist on the 12z Euro than it was on the 00z Euro. It's got a swath over >0.35" amounts for most of north-central PA.

 

Could you elaborate on the 12Z Euro for the LSV for both Saturday and Monday?

 

DJR might have been referring to just the LSV region with that post, but I certainly am not sure.

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