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Winter 2014-15 Med/Long Range Discussion Part 2


Hoosier

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Sort of interesting to see the GFS NW of the Euro the last few runs regarding the system around the 20th. The 0z Euro ensembles still had several members show an OV track before a transfer to the east coast, so I still think that one could be somewhat interesting (a widespread heavy snow, no, but a swath of moderate snow maybe) depending on when a possible phase occurs.

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12z euro has too much northern stream interaction as the vort swings through the four corners region. The vort only goes negative along the TN/AL border as opposed to the TX area on the GFS.

 

Explain that one to me. I would think earlier stream interaction = earlier phasing = more likely for the storm to go NW.

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12z euro has too much northern stream interaction as the vort swings through the four corners region. The vort only goes negative along the TN/AL border as opposed to the TX area on the GFS.

Having said that it has ticked more north than recent runs so that's perhaps a positive.
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Explain that one to me. I would think earlier stream interaction = earlier phasing = more likely for the storm to go NW.

To illustrate my point i'm going to post a euro vorticity map from wxbell. If the mods have a problem, feel free to remove it. Note how far East the ridge axis is over the intermountain west.. this allows the N and S stream features to stay connected by PVA, keeping the S vort positively tilted.

 

Heres the 12z GFS. Note the further west ridge over the intermountain west when compared to the euro. This allows the N stream vort to move slower so wave spacing is heightened and S vort can go neg. PV over the maritimes is also more progressive.

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I've pretty much written off the 20th system for up this way, although it's still not 100% dead.  Southern and eastern MW still in the running though.

 

I'm becoming much more interested in the 24/25th storm as both GFS runs, and even the new Euro indicate some big potential around that time frame.

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It's interesting to see how different the ECMWF and GFS are regarding the 20th storm. I mean, the difference, one could expect out 144 hours. But it seems to me that the GFS is always the much more progressive player. Kind of a role reversal. Anyone know what the NOGAPS is showing for the 20th just out of curiosity?

 

 

Light snow south of I-80.  Too warm roughly south of I-70.

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The ECMWF shows some major warming taking place across the Stratosphere in the med-long range. Could this be the ice breaker we've all been waiting for? If it comes to fruition, the potential is there for a major SSW come early January which would lead to a major cold outbreak ~Jan 5th. Still long ways to go, but potential is growing for a widespread cold January across the board.  

 

post-6644-0-22887400-1418589235_thumb.gi

 

Another key thing to watch is the Pacific. Models redevelop a potent -EPO and coupled with a -AO/NAO, it could lead to frigid temperatures for the entire nation. Our best chance for decent snow IMO would be from Dec 18th to Jan 5th. There after the ridge axis in the West maybe to far East to allow storms to track across the interior. However, if we have a decently strong Polar jet Stream, we can still get a few clippers here and there. 

 

The Canadian/GGEM Ensembles develop a poleward NPAC ridge (+PNA) just off the coastline and this sends the PV further south across Hudson Bay. Fun times ahead!

 

post-6644-0-02050100-1418589915_thumb.pn

 

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Any word on the 12z ECMWF ensembles for the 20th? 

 

Was just looking at that. Several members on the NW side of the mean and pretty amped (996mb-1003mb) that have the sfc low moving from southern/central AR up through western KY/southern IN. Even a few take the sfc low through southern IL and then SW of Indy and north of EVV.

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Wut.

It's a joke. Obviously I'm too much of a nerd :(

 

I used to live on the east coast. When the NOGAPS was less progressive than the other models, the eastern forums considered it a sign that things were modeled too far south and east, considering the NOGAPS had a strong progressive bias. Probably doesn't apply to the Midwest, but just a thought I wanted to put out there. Feel free to bash.

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Yes, that the Euro is snorting coke. I'm sure the Eurozone would be happy to know that their multi-billion dollar project has devolved into a crack whore. And I'm not talking about Greece.

 

It's probably not the best idea to be hitting the Jack Daniels on a Sunday night...:lol:

 

(j/k)

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