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Possible NYC snow Wed Night or Thursday


Mitchel Volk

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Would not be surprised to see some subtle variations in track, but becoming clearer about a big storm taking shape.

 

Impressive to see the moisture feed and precipitable water it will have to work with. Agree with the concerns about the blocking not being there.  Will be key to see where the baroclinic zone sets up.

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The high resolution Euro shows exactly what I'm talking about. If not a paste-bomb west of EWR, it's very close to being one. 

 

At 84 hours in Northeast NJ (using the sw to ne trajectory from Union to Bergen counties as an example) the 925mb temperatures at -2, 850mb temperatures are -2, and 700mb temperatures have just risen from -4 to +2. So there is mid level taint occurring above cold air that is rooted nearer to the surface. 

 

That can be overcome with heavy, dynamic precipitation in some areas which is what the Euro is showing. Closer to the coast, that is not possible because the warm layer is more expansive. 

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This run looks terrible for us coast people that want some snow out of this. It figures, just when we think the Euro will trend east, it trends even further west. Remember folks, last year models were terrible to look at 48 hours out, so this solution could obviously change in either way. Wouldn't be shocked to see a trend east or west by the time the 18z models come in. Also, I wonder if this solution (west of the benchmark) is actually right. That might be telling to how the models work the rest of the winter. Also, as many of you mentioned, this is the first test of the new Parallel GFS. If we don't get anything out of this and models trend east the rest of the way, the parallel will look great. Otherwise, the Parallel will look terrible. But so far, at least for us coastal people, the GFS looks the best so far. For the very interior people, I'd say the Euro looks the best. Just my insight. But I think tonight's 0z models and tomorrow's models will be very telling.

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The high resolution Euro shows exactly what I'm talking about. If not a paste-bomb west of EWR, it's very close to being one. 

 

At 84 hours in Northeast NJ (using the sw to ne trajectory from Union to Bergen counties as an example) the 925mb temperatures at -2, 850mb temperatures are -2, and 700mb temperatures have just risen from -4 to +2. So there is mid level taint occurring above cold air that is rooted nearer to the surface. 

 

That can be overcome with heavy, dynamic precipitation in some areas which is what the Euro is showing. Closer to the coast, that is not possible because the warm layer is more expansive. 

A lot of people are talking about the western suburbs, but how does this look on Mt Zucker?

 

Snow to rain for Westchester?

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The high resolution Euro shows exactly what I'm talking about. If not a paste-bomb west of EWR, it's very close to being one. 

 

At 84 hours in Northeast NJ (using the sw to ne trajectory from Union to Bergen counties as an example) the 925mb temperatures at -2, 850mb temperatures are -2, and 700mb temperatures have just risen from -4 to +2. So there is mid level taint occurring above cold air that is rooted nearer to the surface. 

 

That can be overcome with heavy, dynamic precipitation in some areas which is what the Euro is showing. Closer to the coast, that is not possible because the warm layer is more expansive. 

78 AND 84 are snow at KNYC and EWR . Anyone east of JFK and the GSP it`s really going to be hard to see much more than some snow past hr 78

 

The surface never gets above 34 at the park and falls after hr 84 .  

Reminds me of Feb 2010  once to the Hudson it`s snow . ( not to those totals ) . This storm has it`s foot on the gas

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The high resolution Euro shows exactly what I'm talking about. If not a paste-bomb west of EWR, it's very close to being one. 

 

At 84 hours in Northeast NJ (using the sw to ne trajectory from Union to Bergen counties as an example) the 925mb temperatures at -2, 850mb temperatures are -2, and 700mb temperatures have just risen from -4 to +2. So there is mid level taint occurring above cold air that is rooted nearer to the surface. 

 

That can be overcome with heavy, dynamic precipitation in some areas which is what the Euro is showing. Closer to the coast, that is not possible because the warm layer is more expansive. 

 

Thanks for the insight and that will be a key to watch in the next few runs.  Sitting in central Union County here I fear I might be on the battle lines for this one in regards to the warm layer/surface (win some/lose some).

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With a not so good synoptic setup, I do fear that some models may trend NW as we get closer to the event, but the EURO stands alone thus far

Agreed. I think that we will end up with a track between the 12z GFS and 0z EURO, but we still have a lot of time here, and a 50 mile shift west or east will have huge implications for the I-95 crew. Strength of the system will also be important as that will make the difference in how quickly we could get a changeover to back end snow (as shown by the crazy dynamics on the 12z EURO). Very tricky system, but agreeing with your point that the synoptic setup does not favor a snowier solution for our immediate area, I know it's a vastly overused term in this forum but we really do have to thread the needle with this system.

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78 AND 84 are snow at KNYC and EWR . Anyone east of JFK and the GSP it`s really going to be hard to see much more than some snow past hr 78

 

The surface never gets above 34 at the park and falls after hr 84 .  

Reminds me of Feb 2010  once to the Hudson it`s snow . ( not to those totals ) . This storm has it`s foot on the gas

 

Yup.  It's a razor's edge type of storm (which we see often here).  Will need a quick thump combined with dynamic cooling.  That's still definitely in play.

Any more amplified than this solution though, we will be in trouble.  

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If that run verified the whining on here would reach unbearable proportions.

It really shouldn't it's still November after all. Exactly how many times have we seen significant snows in November? I hope people realize this.

Also were also assuming the euro is correct which given the storm is still over 3 days away bears further watching especially considering all the other models are a good deal further east.

It's quite a storm though despite what happens and i think it's only a positive heading into winter even with a coastal hugher.

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Can we move/delete these banter posts please? This is exactly what everyone is talking about with regards to posts that clog the thread, particularly during a model play by play.

 

edit I see they're gone now

 

Back to the storm, I'd say this type of track should not be dismissed. We haven't had as many coastal huggers in recent years but they used to be the norm particularly from 92-94 when the interior got blasted and the coast had snow at the start or the end but mostly a mixed bag

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Stronger resistance along the East Coast makes sense given both a muted PNA and +NAO signal correlated to enhanced mid level ridging off the SE Coast. The PNA will be right around neutral for this event. If we had a stronger PNA pulse with some blocking, we'd have ourselves a snowstorm, but that's not the case. I see no reason to dismiss the ECMWF, and in fact, this solution is more reasonable meteorologically due to the weaker western PNA. It allows the Mid-west energy to feed into the short wave without being forced offshore / SE.

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