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Upstate NY/North Country + adjacent ON, QC, VT: End of Fall/Into Winter!


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Good evening all. Thought it was a good time to start a new thread with November coming up next week. Possible first snowflakes (Aside from the grauple a week ago) coming next weekend. To start this thread right I forgot to post some video I took of the March Blizzard last year. Enjoy!

 

Driving in it

 

 

Thunder-Snow

 

 

 

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REGARDLESS OF WHICH OF THE ABOVE YOU BELIEVE...THE FRIDAY-SATURDAY
PERIOD SHOULD FEATURE AT LEAST A GENERAL CHANCE OF PRECIPITATION...
WITH INITIAL RAIN SHOWERS ON FRIDAY EVENTUALLY MIXING WITH AND/OR
CHANGING TO SNOW SHOWERS FRIDAY NIGHT AND SATURDAY AS MUCH COLDER
AIR ADVECTS INTO THE REGION BEHIND WHATEVER SURFACE FEATURE EXISTS.
THIS WOULD RESULT IN THE FIRST TRUE SNOWFLAKES OF THE SEASON FOR THE
VAST MAJORITY OF OUR AREA...AND PERHAPS MORE THAN THAT ACROSS THE
NORTH COUNTRY SHOULD THE STRONGER/MORE AMPLIFIED GFS/ECMWF SOLUTIONS
VERIFY...IN WHICH CASE A SOLID ADVISORY-TYPE SNOWFALL WOULD BE
POSSIBLE FOR THAT AREA. WHILE IT`S STILL WAY TOO SOON AND THINGS ARE
WAY TOO UNCERTAIN TO EVEN MENTION THIS POTENTIAL WITHIN THE HWO...
THIS POTENTIAL WILL NEED TO BE CLOSELY MONITORED OVER THE COMING
WEEK.

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  • Friday A chance of showers. Mostly cloudy, with a high near 46. Chance of precipitation is 50%.

Friday Night A chance of rain and snow showers. Mostly cloudy, with a low around 32. Chance of precipitation is 30%.

Saturday A chance of rain and snow showers. Partly sunny, with a high near 39. Chance of precipitation is 30%.

Saturday Night A chance of snow showers. Partly cloudy, with a low around 29. Chance of precipitation is 30%.

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From the KBUF AFD:

 

THE POWERFUL SHORTWAVE WILL CONTINUE ITS PUSH TO THE SOUTHEAST ON
FRIDAY...MAKING ITS WAY TO THE UPPER OHIO VALLEY WHILE ITS ATTENDANT
SFC LOW WILL TAKE THE UNUSUAL TRACK FROM LK HURON TO NORTHWEST PA.
SIGNIFICANT HGT FALLS AND LIFT PROVIDED UNDER THE LEFT FRONT EXIT
REGION OF A 120KT H25 JET TO OUR WEST SHOULD COMBINE WITH A DEEP
MOISTURE FIELD TO PRODUCE THE LIKELIHOOD OF SHOWERS...WHICH DURING
THE MORNING COULD BE MIXED WITH SOME WET SNOW.

AS THE VERY VIGOROUS SHORTWAVE DIGS ACROSS THE APPALACHIANS TO
VIRGINA FRIDAY NIGHT...BROAD CYCLOGENESIS WILL TAKE PLACE ALONG THE
MID ATLANTIC COAST WHILE THE INTI AL SFC LOW WILL LOSE ITS IDENTITY
OVER THE LAUREL HIGHLANDS. THIS WILL ESTABLISH A FEED OF ATLANTIC
MOISTURE OVER OUR REGION...WHICH WHEN COMBINED WITH SOME UPSLOPE
FLOW AND A LITTLE LOW LEVEL LAKE ENHANCEMENT WILL LIKELY PRODUCE
SOME WET SNOW OVER THE BULK OF OUR FORECAST AREA. IT IS LOOKING MORE
LIKELY THAT THERE WILL BE AT LEAST SOME ACCUMULATION...ESPECIALLY
OVER THE HIGHER TERRAIN OF THE SRN TIER.

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It would be great to see the models continue the trend of a more amplified, negatively tilted UL trough this weekend, but the the 12z GFS has the main shortwave and embedded vort max digging too far south with much less phasing than in previous runs. We'll have to see if the EC picks up on this as well.

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From the KBUF AFD:

 

THE POWERFUL SHORTWAVE WILL CONTINUE ITS PUSH TO THE SOUTHEAST ON

FRIDAY...MAKING ITS WAY TO THE UPPER OHIO VALLEY WHILE ITS ATTENDANT

SFC LOW WILL TAKE THE UNUSUAL TRACK FROM LK HURON TO NORTHWEST PA.

SIGNIFICANT HGT FALLS AND LIFT PROVIDED UNDER THE LEFT FRONT EXIT

REGION OF A 120KT H25 JET TO OUR WEST SHOULD COMBINE WITH A DEEP

MOISTURE FIELD TO PRODUCE THE LIKELIHOOD OF SHOWERS...WHICH DURING

THE MORNING COULD BE MIXED WITH SOME WET SNOW.

AS THE VERY VIGOROUS SHORTWAVE DIGS ACROSS THE APPALACHIANS TO

VIRGINA FRIDAY NIGHT...BROAD CYCLOGENESIS WILL TAKE PLACE ALONG THE

MID ATLANTIC COAST WHILE THE INTI AL SFC LOW WILL LOSE ITS IDENTITY

OVER THE LAUREL HIGHLANDS. THIS WILL ESTABLISH A FEED OF ATLANTIC

MOISTURE OVER OUR REGION...WHICH WHEN COMBINED WITH SOME UPSLOPE

FLOW AND A LITTLE LOW LEVEL LAKE ENHANCEMENT WILL LIKELY PRODUCE

SOME WET SNOW OVER THE BULK OF OUR FORECAST AREA. IT IS LOOKING MORE

LIKELY THAT THERE WILL BE AT LEAST SOME ACCUMULATION...ESPECIALLY

OVER THE HIGHER TERRAIN OF THE SRN TIER.

 

 

It would be great to see the models continue the trend of a more amplified, negatively tilted UL trough this weekend, but the the 12z GFS has the main shortwave and embedded vort max digging too far south with much less phasing than in previous runs. We'll have to see if the EC picks up on this as well.

 

Welcome back. Definitely looks to be an elevation driven event as most early season storms are. I think we will have a better idea on how this is going to unfold by tomorrow night. 72 and sunny, feels great out there today.

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.DAY ONE...THIS AFTERNOON AND TONIGHT.

A COLD FRONT WILL CROSS WESTERN NEW YORK LATE THIS AFTERNOON AND

EARLY EVENING. THE FRONT WILL BE ACCOMPANIED BY A BAND OF SHOWERS

AND POSSIBLE EMBEDDED THUNDERSTORMS...SOME OF WHICH COULD PRODUCE

STRONG GUSTY WINDS. THERE IS A MARGINAL THREAT FOR SEVERE WEATHER.

.DAYS TWO THROUGH SEVEN...WEDNESDAY THROUGH MONDAY.

OUR FIRST REAL SHOT OF WINTRY AIR WILL MAKE ITS WAY ACROSS OUR

REGION LATE FRIDAY INTO THE WEEKEND. THIS AIRMASS COULD PRODUCE

AN ACCUMULATING SNOW ACROSS MUCH OF THE REGION AS TEMPERATURES

WILL FALL CLOSE TO...OR BELOW FREEZING.

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There are certainly some exciting solutions floating around for this weekend.  Too soon to really say much, but things could get interesting

 

Any chances of snow in WNY in the lower elevations? Local forecasters are going with an all-rain solution at this juncture.

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Had some wet flakes yesterday. Nothing was sticking though. Boston hills got a coating.

Man the models did a 0-100 change over the past couple of days in regards to the long range temps, i have a feeling we could be looking at yet another brutal winter based on the favorable OPI/SAI & SCE. Your thoughts?

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Man the models did a 0-100 change over the past couple of days in regards to the long range temps, i have a feeling we could be looking at yet another brutal winter based on the favorable OPI/SAI & SCE. Your thoughts?

 

Below normal temperatures (Not as extreme as last year) and Above average snowfall (I'm calling for 105 inches at KBuf).

 

I've been following these topics to make these predictions.

 

http://www.americanwx.com/bb/index.php/topic/44473-and-we-begin/page-16

 

http://www.americanwx.com/bb/index.php/topic/44158-winter-2014-15-discussion/

 

http://www.americanwx.com/bb/index.php/topic/43733-2014-2015-winter-outlooks-and-discussions/

 

Lots of good information on this forum. Love all the Mets analysis and conclusions based on the data.

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Thought I would put together a list of Oct/Nov Lake effect events here in WNY from a friend over at Accuweather forums data-set.

 

Halloween 1993, the most significant early season snowfalls for many places. Very elevation dependent.

img-resized.png Reduced 9%

post-16475-1263861156.png

 

November 24-26, 1950, "The Great Appalachian Storm". If you live anywhere in Ohio, Western PA, and SW NY, you should pray for a repeat of this storm. One of only 4 triple phasers confirmed. Snow records in my town are shot, so I had to estimate based on nearby totals, climo, and liquid.

img-resized.png Reduced 9%

post-16475-1263862436.png

 

November 2-5, 1966, minor, but long duration and very early season

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1263950938.png
700 x 500 (48.52K)


November 3, 1991, small accumulations, but short duration and very early season

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1263950996.png
700 x 500 (46.44K)





 

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November 5, 1982, brief, but very intense, 2nd highest early season storm in Buffalo (behind October 2006)

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1263951057.png
700 x 500 (47.69K)


October 1976, two very early mid month, significant snowfalls. Kicked off a historic winter and complimented a very cold October.
 

img-resized.png Reduced 9%

post-16475-1263951127.png

 

November 28-30, 1965, long duration event with high accumulations in the Boston Hills and the high population area around Erie, PA, extending inland to the Chautauqua Ridge/Sherman area.

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264037470.png
700 x 500 (50.4K)


November 11-13, 1977, relatively quick, moderate, early season event, first significant snowfall of the winter. I forgot to turn off the #s layer, so sorry for the numbers.

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264037615.png
700 x 500 (54.62K)

October 1925, unusually snowy October in the region,

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264296840.png
700 x 500 (47.37K)
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November 8-9, 1933, first in a series of 3 snow storms during 11/1933 that produced near-record or record snowfall in the Southern Tier. These storms were pretty fascinating in that they all were particularly hard hitting in Jamestown. Snow records are scattered at this time, so I tried to gradient the best I could with climo (for all storms),

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264297126.png
700 x 500 (50.36K)


November 10-11, 1933, second storm, unusual inland extent and snow in Niagara county,
 

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264297218.png
700 x 500 (50.14K)


November 15-16, 1933, third storm, classic, early season elevation storm with Buffalo swing,

img-resized.png Reduced 9%

post-16475-1264297340.png

 

November 27-28, 1952, brief, intense Buffalo squall,
 

img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264297733.png
700 x 500 (47.02K)


November 20-22, 1957, textbook South Towns storm, quick and intense snow with a fairly long duration, daily totals in Elma were 2.5", 14.5", and 16.0".
img-resized.png Reduced 9%
post-16475-1264298206.png
700 x 500 (48.8K)
 
 
700 x 500 (51.18K)
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Lake Effect Summary -  November 9-10, 2008

EventSnowfall_2008_11_09.gif

 

 

Lake Effect Summary - November 16-19, 2008

EventSnowfall_2008_11_16.gif


Maximum Snowfall: Lake Erie 30" (Ellicottville); Lake Ontario 28" (West Leyden)

 

 

 

Lake Effect Summary - November 20-23, 2008

EventSnowfall_2008_11_20.gif


Maximum Snowfall: Lake Erie 18" (Mayville); Lake Ontario 14" (West Monroe) 

Duration: 72 hours +/- 

Prime Feature: Marginal multi-faceted event.

 

 

 

Lake Effect Summary - November 26-27, 2008

EventSnowfall_2008_11_26.gif


Maximum Snowfall: Lake Erie 15" (Perrysburg); Lake Ontario 18" (Carthage) 

Duration: 36 hours +/- 

Prime Feature: Evolved from synoptic event, lake enhanced.

 

 

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Lake Effect Summary - November 26-27, 2010
 

EventSnowFall_2010_11_24.png


Maximum Snowfall: Lake Erie 10" (Attica); Lake Ontario 13" (Beaver Falls) 

Duration: 24 hours +/- 

Prime Feature: Marginal early season event, good eastward extent.

 

Lake Effect Summary - November 17-18, 2011
 

EventSnowFall_2011_11_17.png


Maximum Snowfall: Lake Ontario 12.5" (West Fulton, NY); Lake Erie 7.5" (Perry, NY)

Duration: 24 hours +/-

Prime feature: Very Cellular, Great Dendritic Snow Crystal Growth, Lightning and Thunder

 


Lake Effect Summary  - November 25-26, 2012
 

EventSnowFall_2012_11_25.png


Maximum Snowfall: Lake Ontario 15" (Redfield); Lake Erie 7" (SE Buffalo)

Duration: 30 hours +/-

Prime feature: Marginal Early Season Event.

 

 

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Some notable lake effect systems have definitely impacted WNY in past years during November. It's a time when the air temp can drop way below the lake water temperature a mile up. Based on what I'm seeing for next week though it does look like any lake effect would set up on a NW flow. Temps should be cold enough for some decent delta T's but fetch would be limited and accumulation would be hindered by temps at or above the freezing mark during daytime hours.

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Some notable lake effect systems have definitely impacted WNY in past years during November. It's a time when the air temp can drop way below the lake water temperature a mile up. Based on what I'm seeing for next week though it does look like any lake effect would set up on a NW flow. Temps should be cold enough for some decent delta T's but fetch would be limited and accumulation would be hindered by temps at or above the freezing mark during daytime hours.

 

Sounds about right. Haven't had time to look to much into the models yet. I will post a few long term model maps later tonight after I get back from the gym.

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We would actually want the storm system around the 10-12th time period to go far northwest of the area so when that cold front comes through we can get a W/SW flow. (If you want snow for the area) We would warm up nicely and miss out on the synoptic system but set us up better for the Lake Effect. The latest GFS is much farther northwest with this storm.

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