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The Official 2014 Fall Discussion Thread


jburns

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:-) Thanks

That map is not on the website. It's my paid Hazwx media subscription weather maps. Here's the 12Z GFS. Don't hesitate to ask about finding something on my site though, I've been exploring different ways to organize all the pages to make things easier to find.

 

 

Well, no wonder I couldn't find it.  :)

 

Thanks for posting the larger SE map for both the GFS and the NAM 4K.  You guessed correctly that I was interested in seeing the totals for MBY.  Now, I'll have to stop posting (even cloaked) MBY questions or I might get 5-posted, and my posts will definitely get moved to banter.  :D

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Well, no wonder I couldn't find it.  :)

 

Thanks for posting the larger SE map for both the GFS and the NAM 4K.  You guessed correctly that I was interested in seeing the totals for MBY.  Now, I'll have to stop posting (even cloaked) MBY questions or I might get 5-posted, and my posts will definitely get moved to banter.  :D

Nah. It's still the slow season.

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Steve, I'm going with 2 or 3 inches.  I think this might be like the fabled years of old this year, where the gulf lows just keep rolling in and the rain is always 1 1/2 to 3 inches, each and every time :)  Like the 70's when real weather happened, well, except 1993.  No convection will rob me..... maybe you, and folks from I20 on, lol, but close to the furnace I still get the rain, even when all else get the snow :)  Well, except for that danged dry slot, but that pattern is ended...I just have to believe, and think happy thoughts!   In the 70's every storm was a real storm, not these little sprinkle flizzards we get with drought rain.  I saw enough 32's and heavy rain, to fill a dozen cisterns with tons of cold, gritty, bitter disappointment water.  Sprinkled in with storms to remember.  And it may be coming back.  I saw that research work yesterday, and it named some very good years in the 60's when it was bone dry, but bitterly cold, and the seventies when it was super wet, and occasionally got cold enough :) Things don't have to be perfect, just get enough rain, and be winter.  Hang on tight!  If it's not this year, that maybe next, or the one after.  Oh, it's coming :)  T

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:-) Thanks

That map is not on the website. It's my paid Hazwx media subscription weather maps. Here's the 12Z GFS. Don't hesitate to ask about finding something on my site though, I've been exploring different ways to organize all the pages to make things easier to find.

rain_12z_gfs_sat_mon.png

There is no way this map will verify. I haven't seen that much rain in the last 2 months combined.
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I really don't understand that when a model shows alot of precip, the forecasters almost always discount it. The GFS is showing 5-6 inch swath of rain, and GSP discussion is giving it almost no weight in their forcast and going with other models!? They seem to do this ALOT with regards to snow!! With the poor performance of the models this summer, the GFS could be the right model.

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I really don't understand that when a model shows alot of precip, the forecasters almost always discount it. The GFS is showing 5-6 inch swath of rain, and GSP discussion is giving it almost no weight in their forcast and going with other models!? They seem to do this ALOT with regards to snow!! With the poor performance of the models this summer, the GFS could be the right model.

 

You're comparing apples to oranges. The models always do bad in the warm season as far as timing/placement/amount of convective qpf. It's the most difficult season to forecast for. This upcoming synoptic system is not being handled well by the 12z GFS and other models with the low end coastal convection noted and the spurious and likely overly responded upon PV anomally. I noticed the 18z GFS has cut qpf totals down quite a bit across the GSP FA, while sigfntly increasing the coastal response.

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Yep the 18z gfs shows our area with only 1 to maybe 1.5 inches of rain now. Also the cutoff moved a little closer to us with east TN and NW GA getting virtually nothing. It also shows only another .50 or so beyond that all the way out to 16 days so if we somehow miss this event it could be dry for a while.

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Here's the 12Z 4k NAM, not what the GFS is showing for sure.

 

attachicon.gifman_8pm non.png

 

I could live with that.  I'm getting sick of rain and clouds at this point; I just want a week or two of clear sunny weather so I can go do something, and so the ground can dry out a bit for my construction project. 

 

I don't think I've seen blue sky for at least a week :(

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I could live with that.  I'm getting sick of rain and clouds at this point; I just want a week or two of clear sunny weather so I can go do something, and so the ground can dry out a bit for my construction project. 

 

I don't think I've seen blue sky for at least a week :(

The NAM looks quite under done, imo..

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18Z GFS (left) 4KM NAM (right)

wow, thats quite a spread lol.  glad i am not having to make a forecast for the public with such divergent models - we are not all that far out from the rain event either.  its been cloudy here for days but no rain - it would be nice to get a good dousing

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From KFFC

Their discussions have improved so much since last year, do they have new people in charge there?

FXUS62 KFFC 280735

AFDFFC

AREA FORECAST DISCUSSION

NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE PEACHTREE CITY GA

335 AM EDT SUN SEP 28 2014

.SHORT TERM /TODAY THROUGH MONDAY/...

SORT OF A DIFFICULT SHORT TERM FORECAST TODAY. WEAK DAMMING REMAINS

IN PLACE THIS MORNING BUT WITH MIDLEVEL SHORTWAVE PUSHING ACROSS THE

GREAT LAKES AND ANOTHER MIDLEVEL WEAKNESS IN THE EASTERLIES ACROSS

THE NORTHERN GULF...THE SURFACE HIGH WILL GIVE WAY TO A SURFACE LOW

PUSHING INTO THE SOUTHEAST FROM THE GULF OF MEXICO. WILL START OFF

RIGHT AWAY AND SAY THAT THE GFS IS DEFINITELY NOT THE PREFERRED

MODEL OF CHOICE THIS MORNING. ALL GUIDANCE HAS HAD ISSUES THE PAST

COUPLE OF DAYS BUT THE GFS IS ESPECIALLY RIDDEN WITH CONVECTIVE

FEEDBACK AND AS A RESULT HAS A MUCH STRONGER SURFACE LOW AND SOME

CRAZY BULLSEYES IN ITS QPF FIELD. HAVE LEANED MORE TOWARD A BLEND OF

OTHER GUIDANCE VALUES THROUGH THE SHORT TERM. GUIDANCE ALSO HAVING A

HARD TIME RESOLVING WHAT IS CURRENTLY OUT THERE...OR MORE

SPECIFICALLY...WHAT IS NOT CURRENTLY OUT THERE AS HIRES MODELS HAD

PREDICTED RAINFALL ACROSS A GOOD PORTION OF THE GULF COAST BY THIS

TIME...AND NOT MUCH IS FALLING JUST YET. AGREE WITH LATEST TRENDS TO

DELAY ONSET OF PRECIPITATION UNTIL A LITTLE LATER THAN PREVIOUSLY

THOUGHT.

ISENTROPIC UPGLIDE INCREASES THIS AFTERNOON AND TONIGHT AS MOISTURE

OVERSPREADS THE SOUTHEAST. PW VALUES INCREASE TO FAIRLY IMPRESSIVE

AMOUNTS OF OVER 2 INCHES...2.2-2.3 INCHES MONDAY MORNING. THAT IS

ABOVE THE 99TH PERCENTILE FOR THIS TIME OF YEAR FOR KFFC...AND NEAR

THE 99TH PERCENTILE FOR KTAE...SO DEFINITELY ABNORMALLY MOIST.

HOWEVER...AS HAS BEEN PREVIOUSLY ADVERTISED...DEFINITELY CONCERNED

THAT GULF COAST CONVECTION MAY CUT OFF MOISTURE FLUX INTO PORTIONS

OF NORTH GEORGIA...AND THE NAM IS TRYING TO PICK UP ON THIS WITH

MOISTURE FLUX VECTORS REALLY LIMITED TO AREAS SOUTH OF THE INCOMING

SURFACE LOW. 06Z WPC QPF HAS TAKEN ANOTHER SIGNIFICANT TURN AND

REDUCED OVERALL STORM TOTALS AND KEPT THE AXIS OF HEAVIEST RAIN

ACROSS CENTRAL GEORGIA. AGREE WITH THIS FOR THE MOST PART BUT DID

EXPAND LIGHT QPF VALUES FURTHER NORTH. EXPECT THAT THE HEAVIEST RAIN

WILL GENERALLY FALL STARTING OVERNIGHT TONIGHT AND EXPANDING INTO

CENTRAL GEORGIA THROUGH MONDAY AS THE SURFACE LOW PUSHES INTO THE

AREA. SEE ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO NOT GO 100 PERCENT POP OVERNIGHT

AND EARLY MONDAY MORNING ACROSS THE CENTRAL PORTION OF OUR FORECAST

AREA INTO CENTRAL GEORGIA...CORRESPONDING WITH THE HIGHEST QPF. 100

POP PROBABLY WARRANTED LATER INTO MONDAY BUT CONFIDENCE DECREASES

THE FARTHER OUT WE GO. AND SPEAKING OF CONFIDENCE...CERTAINLY NOT

ENOUGH TO ISSUE A FLOOD OR FLASH FLOOD WATCH AT THIS TIME. GIVEN

INCONSISTENCIES BETWEEN MODELS AND RUNS PLUS THE UPSTREAM CONVECTION

CONCERNS...JUST NOT QUITE SURE WHAT THE OVERALL QPF PATTERN WILL

LOOK LIKE. RIGHT NOW...BEST QPF REMAINS IN CENTRAL GEORGIA WHICH

SHOULD BE ABLE TO HANDLE HEAVIER RAIN ANYWAY. CANNOT RULE OUT

ISOLATED AMOUNTS ABOVE CURRENTLY-ADVERTISED QPF...AND CANNOT RULE

OUT HEAVIER AMOUNTS FARTHER NORTH AS WELL. AGAIN...CONFIDENCE NOT

PARTICULARLY HIGH IN OVERALL QPF PATTERN.

THUNDER CHANCES LOOK TO REMAIN FAIRLY MINIMAL THROUGH THE SHORT

TERM...THOUGH HAVE INCLUDED SLIGHT CHANCE JUST ABOUT EVERYWHERE.

BEST ML/SBCAPE VALUES REMAIN ACROSS SOUTHERN ZONES AND REALLY NOT

PARTICULARLY IMPRESSIVE. HOWEVER...WITH THE ISENTROPIC UPGLIDE

CANNOT RULE OUT SOME EMBEDDED RUMBLES OF THUNDER. NO CONCERN FOR

SEVERE THUNDERSTORMS.

TEMPERATURES THROUGH THE SHORT TERM WILL BE HIGHLY DEPENDENT ON

PATTERN OF RAINFALL AND CLOUD COVER. FOR TODAY...EXPECT MOST AREAS

TO BE ABLE TO CLIMB TO NEAR /OR JUST SLIGHTLY BELOW/ NORMAL

TEMPERATURES BEFORE THE ONSET OF RAIN...WITH ABOVE NORMAL TEMPS

EXPECTED TONIGHT. FOR MONDAY...WENT WITH A CONSENSUS APPROACH BUT

WITH SOME BIAS CORRECTION ESPECIALLY IN NORTHEAST ZONES...RESULTING

IN SOME AREAS HOVERING NEAR 70 FOR HIGHS. THINK THIS IS REASONABLE

GIVEN THE WIDESPREAD CLOUD COVER AND PRECIP EXPECTED.

TDP

.LONG TERM /MONDAY NIGHT THROUGH SATURDAY/...

SOME DISAGREEMENT AMONGST THE MODELS FOR MONDAY NIGHT INTO TUESDAY.

THE ECMWF SEEMS TO BE A COMPROMISE BETWEEN THE NAM AND GFS FOR LOW

TRACK...BUT IS SLIGHTLY FASTER WITH TIMING. HAVE LEANED TOWARDS THE

ECMWF SOLUTION...WHICH WAS CLOSE TO PERSISTENCE SINCE CONFIDENCE IS

LOW.

THE WAVE OF LOW PRESSURE SHOULD EMERGE OFF THE SE COAST ON TUESDAY

AND TRACK UP THE EASTERN SEABOARD. HIGH PRESSURE WILL BUILD ACROSS

THE REGION FOR LATE TUESDAY INTO THURSDAY. RIDGING WILL BEGIN TO

SHIFT OFFSHORE LATE THURSDAY AS A SHARP COLD FRONT CROSSES THE

MISSISSIPPI RIVER. THE MODELS HAVE BEEN FAIRLY CONSISTENT WITH THE

FROPA TIMING OF LATE FRIDAY/ EARLY SATURDAY. HIGH PRESSURE WILL

BUILD BEHIND THE FRONT ON SUNDAY.

NO MAJOR TWEAKS TO POPS FOR MONDAY NIGHT INTO TUESDAY. HAVE KEPT THE

FORECAST DRY FROM TUESDAY NIGHT THROUGH THURSDAY AFTERNOON. POPS

SHOULD START INCREASING AHEAD OF THE COLD FRONT THURSDAY NIGHT INTO

EARLY FRIDAY. MODELS HAVE ALSO STARTED TO INCREASE THE CHANCES FOR

PRECIP WITH FRIDAYS FRONT.

A RETURN TO BELOW NORMAL TEMPS IS EXPECTED BEHIND THE COLD FRONT FOR

NEXT WEEKEND.

NLISTEMAA

&&

AVIATION...

06Z UPDATE...

CIGS NOT LOWERING AS FAST AS EARLIER EXPECTED SO HAVE SLOWED DOWN

BRINGING IN MVFR CIGS OVERNIGHT...HOLDING OFF UNTIL 10Z OR SO.

DELAY IN ONSET OF RAIN AS WELL MIGHT NOT KEEP CIGS QUITE AS LOW AS

EARLIER EXPECTED THROUGH THE DAY...BUT GENERALLY KEPT CONDITIONS

MVFR. CANNOT RULE OUT BRIEF LOW VFR ESPECIALLY THIS AFTERNOON.

SHRA MOVES IN BETWEEN 18-21Z...POSSIBLY EARLIER AT CSG...AND CIGS

SHOULD LOWER AGAIN SOON THEREAFTER. HAVE INTRODUCED IFR CIGS FOR

MONDAY MORNING. WINDS E THROUGH THE PERIOD GENERALLY 5-10KT.

//ATL CONFIDENCE...06Z UPDATE...

MEDIUM ON CIGS.

HIGH ON ALL OTHER ELEMENTS.

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