2013-14 versus 2002-03

[WxUSAF]

We're on the same page. My younger kids adored this winter. My legs got a workout on the hill. They we're only 5 in 09-10.

I'm a here and now person. I don't get sentimental about much so 02-03 seems like a lifetime ago and while it was a great winter, my memories will hold this one above it until the next big one comes along next year.

Everybody views their world their own way. There are no wrong answers. I liked this winter more than 09-10 for the duration and constant mental exercise. Nobody can tell me I'm wrong because it's not about that. Heck, I would have gladly traded 09-10 to spread out the totals over the next 3 pretty awful years. People think I'm crazy for saying that. I am crazy but not because of that.

I think this winter will be fondly remembered by me for awhile.  I didn't really get to enjoy 09-10 as much as you'd think with a nearly 90" winter.  My son's due date was between the February storms and so I was out shoveling while also really sick with a stomach bug and stressing that my wife was going to go into labor and I'd have to call a HMMWV.  

 

I'm pretty sure there is nowhere in the east where 2013-14 was colder

 

2002-03.png

 

2013-14.png

I think your point still pretty much stands, but notice there's a pretty drastic scale change between those 2 plots.  

[Fozz]

I don't remember a lot of details from when I was 11 years old either

 

I checked weather.gov regularly, kept up with BWI's F6 monthly data and was glued to TWC even in 2002. The cold shots weren't quite as sharp that year (nor any year since 1994 for a lot of the East), but it seemed to be more persistent.... not a single 60 degree day in DJF at BWI in 02-03.

[Deck Pic]

I think this winter will be fondly remembered by me for awhile.  I didn't really get to enjoy 09-10 as much as you'd think with a nearly 90" winter.  My son's due date was between the February storms and so I was out shoveling while also really sick with a stomach bug and stressing that my wife was going to go into labor and I'd have to call a HMMWV.  

 

I think your point still pretty much stands, but notice there's a pretty drastic scale change between those 2 plots.  

 

fixed

[ORH_wxman]

I think this winter will be fondly remembered by me for awhile.  I didn't really get to enjoy 09-10 as much as you'd think with a nearly 90" winter.  My son's due date was between the February storms and so I was out shoveling while also really sick with a stomach bug and stressing that my wife was going to go into labor and I'd have to call a HMMWV.  

 

I think your point still pretty much stands, but notice there's a pretty drastic scale change between those 2 plots.  

 

 

'02-'03 was definitely a lot colder...though yeah, the plots are on different scales. But '02-'03 was on the order of like 2-3F colder than '13-'14 at BWI/DCA/IAD

 

BWI was 2.4F colder, DCA was 3.4F colder, and IAD was 2.2F colder. That is for DJF mean temp. This March though def starts closing the gap a bit vs '02-'03's cold.

[Deck Pic]

'02-'03 was definitely a lot colder...though yeah, the plots are on different scales. But '02-'03 was on the order of like 2-3F colder than '13-'14 at BWI/DCA/IAD

 

BWI was 2.4F colder, DCA was 3.4F colder, and IAD was 2.2F colder. That is for DJF mean temp. This March though def starts closing the gap a bit vs '02-'03's cold.

 

2013-14 simply wasn't a very cold winter, though colder to the north and west...People like to pretend it was...it was our 4th coldest winter in the last 7 winters at DCA...we had a million warm days

 

33 - 50 degree days...in DJF

[Ian]

2013-14 simply wasn't a very cold winter, though colder to the north and west...People like to pretend it was...it was our 4th coldest winter in the last 7 winters at DCA...we had a million warm days

 

33 - 50 degree days...in DJF

 

On average no but on 'big cold' days it certainly was. 

[Deck Pic]

On average no but on 'big cold' days it certainly was. 

 

I think the comparison that needs to be made is big cold shots versus persistent cold....which is "colder"...I love cold and in January 2009, I was a completely broken man by the end of the month..never felt that way this winter...enjoyed all the cold shots, and before I could get sick of them, it was 57

[Sparky]

This winter really has beaten 02/03.  The surprising start with nearly 9" on 12/8 plus over another 4" on 12/10 got this winter in gear early out here.  January had mucho cold combined with a couple of significant storms, 11" on 1/21 plus 6" on 1/2.  

 

Comparing the biggest storms, which were oddly close in total accumulations:

PD2 - 25.5" with very cold temps but overall unexciting storm to me.

2/12-13 - 24.75" with better snow intensity overall and hours of deathbanding overtop that my broom could not keep up with.

 

Seemed like more snowcover this year than 02/03....especially in January when 02/03 got just dry and cold for a few weeks.  

 

Christmas 02 did have nearly 6 inches of snow which was a surprise that year which is a fond memory from that one.

 

March 14 has been much more generous than 03...11 inches (and counting) vs. 3"

 

Both spectacular long lived winters but 13/14 has won the bronze medal fair and square.

[Fozz]

only in Westminster can a 25" storm be called "unexciting"

[Sparky]

only in Westminster can a 25" storm be called "unexciting"

it was the long drawn out little snowflakes without hardly any winds to boot which killed that one in my memory.  I have called it the Gentle Giant.

[Fozz]

it was the long drawn out little snowflakes without hardly any winds to boot which killed that one in my memory.  I have called it the Gentle Giant.

 

I recall hours and hours of +SN and even some thundersnow. Maybe I'm biased since it was my first HECS at an age older than 5 1/2, but it was among the best I've seen.

[Sparky]

I recall hours and hours of +SN and even some thundersnow. Maybe I'm biased since it was my first HECS at an age older than 5 1/2, but it was among the best I've seen.

I didn't have any thundersnow.

[ORH_wxman]

I think the comparison that needs to be made is big cold shots versus persistent cold....which is "colder"...I love cold and in January 2009, I was a completely broken man by the end of the month..never felt that way this winter...enjoyed all the cold shots, and before I could get sick of them, it was 57

 

 

This year was definitely more volatile than '02-'03 in terms of temps. Way more warm days this winter but also more cold days. The consistency of '02-'03 though ends up winning out for mean temps...as clearly the numbers showed. DCA being 3.4F colder over a 3 month period isn't a small number. Ditto for 2.4F for BWI.

 

 

I looked quickly at # of high temps below freezing and number of low temps below 10F for BWI for each winter:

 

High Below freezing:

 

2002-2003: 15

2013-2014: 18

 

Low Below 10F:

 

2002-2003: 3

2013-2014: 10

 

 

 

For DCA: we'll use freezing but for low temps we'll use 15F since they can't radiaite like BWI:

 

 

High below freezing:

 

2002-2003: 10

2013-2014: 9

 

 

Lows below 15F:

 

2002-2003: 4

2013-2014: 9

 

 

Looks like for extreme cold highs at DCA (and to a lesser extent at BWI), it wasn't much different but the extreme lows had a difference.

[Mrs.J]

Picked more snow in 02-03 and liked it better. We had just moved back from California after being out there for 2 years and no snow. We were like kids in that snow as we had not seen snow in a while. 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

Tough call, but I think I'd have to put 2002-03 just a hair ahead of 2013-14, only because I don't want to whimp out and call it a tie!  If anything, '02-03 is slightly better because of PD-II, but also (as others have mentioned) the cold was more consistent and was greater throughout the DJF period.  It was also the 2nd winter I was here in the DC area (2001-02 was God-awful!), so PD-II was the first real East Coast HECS I experienced.  It was truly a nice recovery winter after '01-'02.

 

I'd place '13-'14 very close based on it being very snowy (47.1" where I'm at), more "extreme" cold days, an epic March (snow and cold), and the fact that it was essentially non-stop in terms of possibilities from December through March.  There were many snow events to follow, and it's like we re-discovered how to get a moderate-sized snow again.  Oh, and this winter did it the hard way, with no blocking to speak of.  Talk about overperforming in the face of disadvantages!

 

Obviously, 2009-10 is the top slot due to the sheer amount of snow and getting the "big three" storms.  The Jan. 30-Feb. 10 period was about the snowiest I've ever seen in my life, including many years when I lived in northeast Ohio.  But it wasn't exactly all that cold that winter despite the incredible blocking; I don't recall any real extremes though it was overall below normal for temperatures.  The snow occurred in very discrete time periods, and that winter quite literally ended almost immediately after the Feb. 9-10 blizzard.

 

(1)2009-10

(2)2002-03

(3)2013-14

[Bob Chill]

If we pull off an april event it could change the results. If we score a widespread 4"+ (highly unlikely obviously) event in April it would be mind blowing from a tracking perspective. Almost 5 straight months of interesting things to keep an eye on.

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

If we pull off an april event it could change the results. If we score a widespread 4"+ (highly unlikely obviously) event in April it would be mind blowing from a tracking perspective. Almost 5 straight months of interesting things to keep an eye on.

 

I agree, if we end up pulling off such an event, one may have to swap the two winters.  To be honest, subjectively it's tough to pick between 2002-03 and 2013-14 as to which was "better".  I almost wanted to put this winter slightly ahead but it's hard to overlook PD-II and the more consistent cold (for DJF at least) in 2002-03.  But this year, winter has obviously hung on a lot longer (beyond DJF) and I think there were more events overall.  And like I said, given that this year was so great even in the face of no blocking is very impressive by itself.  I should add that though we didn't have a PD-II-like storm, Feb. 12-13 was no slouch of an event.

 

In some ways, this year's continuing cold beyond DJF reminds me of 2007, when it was pretty cold into April (after an epically cold February).  We just didn't get the snow like we did this year, though I do remember getting a coating or so of snow Easter morning in early April 2007.

[WVclimo]

I loved the extreme cold shots this winter, but the consistent cold of 02-03 gives it the edge for me. Wall to wall, the cold kept coming that year without any real breaks. I'm also partial to the long duration HECS, so 02-03 wins there too. I wasn't here, but PD2 was 24+ in this yard. And it was a 36" month. Only managed 21" this February.

In 02-03 I lived in downtown Bethesda where the streets were narrowed to one way from snow banks for a couple of weeks, and ran a business in PG County that had a roof collapse from the weight of the snow. This year felt much tamer, and didn't nearly shut me down the way 09-10 did in WV.

13-14 did have more snow here though than 02-03, and pretty much matched 63-64.

[gymengineer]

I loved the extreme cold shots this winter, but the consistent cold of 02-03 gives it the edge for me. Wall to wall, the cold kept coming that year without any real breaks. I'm also partial to the long duration HECS, so 02-03 wins there too. I wasn't here, but PD2 was 24+ in this yard. And it was a 36" month. Only managed 21" this February.

In 02-03 I lived in downtown Bethesda where the streets were narrowed to one way from snow banks for a couple of weeks, and ran a business in PG County that had a roof collapse from the weight of the snow. This year felt much tamer, and didn't nearly shut me down the way 09-10 did in WV.

13-14 did have more snow here though than 02-03, and pretty much matched 63-64.

You and I have exactly the same priorities for ranking winters. As impressive as this snow season has been, it's really been the unusual huge season without the crippling, shut-in storm. Every one of our more recent big seasons has had at least one stretch that shut down the region except for this one: 2/79, 2/83, 1/87 double whammy, 3/93 (in the NW suburbs), 1/96, 2/03, 12/09, 2/10.

If 2/12-13 was 6 or 7 degrees colder or dropped 6" more, we would have had that storm this season too. Of course, that means we weren't all that close to having a shut-in storm this season.