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Feb 12-13 Sleet/Snow/ZR Event


JoshM

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Well it's certainly cold enough for major ice down into central ga absolutely kills them with freezing rain. Question of the day with this run is if the nam is being too supressed with precip with the second wave. might be some convective feed back but if that area of heavy precip is there, could interrupt moisture transport to the north.

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In a single 24-hour cycle, the NAM took the northern 3/4 of N.C. from a 10-inch snow to nothing re: first impluse. #nicemodel

It's crazy how with each run it shows something different.

 

Ha!  By 84 the low is bombing and pulling the 850 freezing line back east a bit

Yeah and it might be under performing actually for nc if that area of heavy convection isn't there, I would expect more precip further north and into nc initially

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Very interesting. Massive phasing occurring on the 84 hr NAM....almost looks like another low is trying to spin up in the NE Gulf based on the wind fields. At very least, the developing SFC low off the SC coast is nearly stationary.

 

Orientation of the vorticity fields is a little different, but this looks a lot like the overall Euro idea to me.

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Well it's certainly cold enough for major ice down into central ga absolutely kills them with freezing rain. Question of the day with this run is if the nam is being too supressed with precip with the second wave. might be some convective feed back but if that area of heavy precip is there, could interrupt moisture transport to the north.

I think the NAM would be an interesting solution to say the least.  I don't buy it yet!  However, what I do by is that each model is getting colder and colder at 2m and 850 across our state.  For the first time, on any models, Verbatim this would CRUSH CSG-MCN-AGS with a massive ICE storm and it actually has me at 30-32 degrees at about 00z WED.  Lookout, Larry, T, Candyman, and everyone else, I think we can at least take away from this run that its def. trending colder.  Which I believe

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the nam is so strong with the northeasterly flow that temps are actually effected by the  wedge all the way down into southern alabama, especially aloft. I've never seen that before. It should be noted the nam has a lot of sleet somewhere between the 0c 850s and central ga. Just amazing.

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Well if it can get its act together on the energy in TX here... I'd agree.  The energy over the N Plains looks intimidating and ready for a big phase with it.

I'm thinking we see a phase, but not sure to the extent the euro is showing. i agree w/ allan and dt on that.

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Very interesting. Massive phasing occurring on the 84 hr NAM....almost looks like another low is trying to spin up in the NE Gulf based on the wind fields. At very least, the developing SFC low off the SC coast is nearly stationary.

 

Orientation of the vorticity fields is a little different, but this looks a lot like the overall Euro idea to me.

Good point Matt but wouldn't this also mean a further South and East precipitation field that would have a sharp cut off over Western NC/SC?

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It's crazy how with each run it shows something different.

 

Yeah and it might be under performing actually for nc if that area of heavy convection isn't there, I would expect more precip further north and into nc initially

 

It's crazy how with each run it shows something different.

 

Yeah and it might be under performing actually for nc if that area of heavy convection isn't there, I would expect more precip further north and into nc initially

 

More like a 12 hour cycle!

 

Looking at the 700mb RH maps, I'd agree.. ATL to CLT to GSO.. a long fetch of moisture... That low is going to be deeping rapidly and the convection is going to explode over these areas

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I honestly don't know what to say....IF this run is even close to verifying and our 2m temps are that cold....I will be at work for days because it would be a super damaging ice storm here.  Over 1.25" of ZR here from 3z WED on

I'm not sure I've ever seen that much ice before......I have no words for this if it verifies. 

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I think the NAM would be an interesting solution to say the least.  I don't buy it yet!  However, what I do by is that each model is getting colder and colder at 2m and 850 across our state.  For the first time, on any models, Verbatim this would CRUSH CSG-MCN-AGS with a massive ICE storm and it actually has me at 30-32 degrees at about 00z WED.  Lookout, Larry, T, Candyman, and everyone else, I think we can at least take away from this run that its def. trending colder.  Which I believe

Yeah this would be a devastating ice storm for those areas and over into central south carolina.  Hell it could end up being a lot of sleet in the northern parts of the midlands. 

 

One thing is for sure, this is an epic storm for a hell of a lot of people being shown now from guidance. The area of coverage and how much actually falls is truly an historical storm in the making (assuming of course the models don't do an about face) Just an incredible period of winter weather.

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Burger, delta, lookout or Larry... One thought I'm thinking this morning and would love your opinion on.

If the first punch drops we'll say 2" of snow north of I-20 up through the 85 corridor up through SC, the the high pressure slides in to place, in my mind this creates a virtual "slide" if you will, and could possibly enhance the CAD south and west?

Larry, having lived in East Gwinnett all my life, I cannot remember a cad event with snow on the ground initially or immediately in this case.

Thoughts?

interesting thought - was discussed briefly yesterday (i think) at one point.  we didnt remember a wedge coming in with snow cover either. i would tend to agree with you, if anything it could help with that extra degree or two drop that we so often need here in ga lol.  i have had storms come in and go snow to ice or rain. i do not recall a one two punch like is being shown.

 

this seems for the most part (as others stated this morning) to be looking like a more usual se winter storm with snow, sleet and freezing rain (to rain in some areas).  since we are what, less than two days away its looking pretty good.  we are almost to the point of being able to see the temps and radar start lighting up lol

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THe cad will keep trending stronger. look at the high pressure on any current sfc analysis over the northern plains, it's an arctic hp with source regions over the nw territories. it's just another reason any thermal boundary that sets up will likely be off the coastline. this situation looks pretty classic. everyone needs to take a deep breath and quit model hugging.

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Yeah this would be a devastating ice storm for those areas and over into central south carolina.  Hell it could end up being a lot of sleet in the northern parts of the midlands. 

 

One thing is for sure, this is an epic storm for a hell of a lot of people being shown now from guidance. The area of coverage and how much actually falls is truly an historical storm in the making (assuming of course the models don't do an about face) Just an incredible period of winter weather.

Agreed! on all accounts.  I did notice a little pocket of sub 4c temps at 850 when that heavy burst comes through.  I know its 1 run, and don't buy it overall, but I do buy into the colder temps *trending*  What are you thinking?  Also, I do think some phasing will occur, just where.

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THe cad will keep trending stronger. look at the high pressure on any current sfc analysis over the northern plains, it's an arctic hp with source regions over the nw territories. it's just another reason any thermal boundary that sets up will likely be off the coastline. this situation looks pretty classic. everyone needs to take a deep breath and quit model hugging.

 

Looking at the mid level maps it's a big one.  Surface cold is not a problem... and for northern areas, mid level temps should work out as well with the major phasing taking place.. HP will build on the back side.  Look at the classic CAD sig on the NAM

 

VlLBlFy.gif

 

500mb vorticity...  beautiful

 

sXnnUqB.gif

 

I can see a single sub-1000mb low bombing off the coast of GA/SC based on the 500mb setup here

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THe cad will keep trending stronger. look at the high pressure on any current sfc analysis over the northern plains, it's an arctic hp with source regions over the nw territories. it's just another reason any thermal boundary that sets up will likely be off the coastline. this situation looks pretty classic. everyone needs to take a deep breath and quit model hugging.

 

Really this setup the NAM is trying to show on this run is how one would expect to see a statewide thump of 9-12" for NC at least like the NAM had yesterday versus a overrunning type event, the warm nose will be a problem but once that coastal gets cranked 850's should crash towards the coast and everyone but the immediate coast would go all snow, then we need that sucker to sit there for a bit.

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interesting thought - was discussed briefly yesterday (i think) at one point.  we didnt remember a wedge coming in with snow cover either. i would tend to agree with you, if anything it could help with that extra degree or two drop that we so often need here in ga lol.  i have had storms come in and go snow to ice or rain. i do not recall a one two punch like is being shown.

 

this seems for the most part (as others stated this morning) to be looking like a more usual se winter storm with snow, sleet and freezing rain (to rain in some areas).  since we are what, less than two days away its looking pretty good.  we are almost to the point of being able to see the temps and radar start lighting up lol

I disagree. The storm back in January of 2000 at least in the Dawsonville area had at least an inch of snow on the ground before freezing rain began.

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Good point Matt but wouldn't this also mean a further South and East precipitation field that would have a sharp cut off over Western NC/SC?

There would be a sharp cutoff somewhere yes.... but there would be some big winners.

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THe cad will keep trending stronger. look at the high pressure on any current sfc analysis over the northern plains, it's an arctic hp with source regions over the nw territories. it's just another reason any thermal boundary that sets up will likely be off the coastline. this situation looks pretty classic. everyone needs to take a deep breath and quit model hugging.

I also agree with this.  The CAD should trend stronger as we get closer.  I will say this, the NAM usually sniffs out the 2m cooling trend first...

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Robert, like most meteorologists on here, is hedging because of the differing model solutions and the complexity of the systems as depicted so far. He said he would issue a call map this afternoon after he has time to study the 12z runs and possibly the later EURO run. The fact that we have so many talented meteorologists whom are perplexed by this system is indicative of how uncertain the end result will be.

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I disagree. The storm back in January of 2000 at least in the Dawsonville area had at least an inch of snow on the ground before freezing rain began.

 

We had 3" inches of snow before the ice during that storm in Hartwell, GA.  I remember that one very vividly.  I also remember Athens not getting any snow at all, so it was a fine line between the two cities.

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