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Central PA and The Fringes - February 2014


PennMan

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We jumped up to 34.2 when rates stopped, we are back to steady snow and there is compaction. Few more nice bands left before it is done.

 

whoa.... if I were in your place I wouldn't even be thinking about compaction. 10" is a great total in any storm, let alone a marginal one like this.

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Anyone have euro digits for tmrw night?

 

UNV:

WED 06Z 05-FEB  -4.7    -5.2    1023      87     100    0.10     559     541    WED 12Z 05-FEB  -4.5    -1.9    1013      93      85    0.78     554     543    WED 18Z 05-FEB  -2.0    -2.6    1008      90      53    0.16     541     535    THU 00Z 06-FEB  -4.7   -10.2    1017      80      69    0.03     541     528    

IPT:

WED 06Z 05-FEB  -4.9    -5.6    1023      84      97    0.06     558     540    WED 12Z 05-FEB  -4.8    -3.4    1015      93      99    0.74     554     542    WED 18Z 05-FEB  -2.7    -4.6    1008      89      73    0.27     541     535    THU 00Z 06-FEB  -5.4   -10.1    1016      82      69    0.06     540     528  

MDT:

WED 06Z 05-FEB  -3.4    -4.3    1023      90     100    0.05     563     544    WED 12Z 05-FEB  -2.4     0.2    1014      95      99    0.59     558     547    WED 18Z 05-FEB   1.6     1.8    1007      86      54    0.16     548     543    THU 00Z 06-FEB  -0.4    -8.4    1014      83      49    0.01     545     535 
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Anyone have euro digits for tmrw night?

Analysis from NYC thread:

Latest European showing 8 + from NW burbs of PHL to East Central PA to Northern NJ to NW NJ ..North Central PA is 9-12 along with SNE ..northern half of PA ,, Southern NY and SC NY State.... starting Tuesday night after midnight!

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Anyone have euro digits for tmrw night?

 

Proabably just a tad under an inch total QPF for you, all snow. Warmest frame at 48 the 850mb 0 line very roughly runs just above Pittsburgh to somewhere around Punxy then drops straight down to Zacks house and runs to Allentown 

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UNV:

WED 06Z 05-FEB  -4.7    -5.2    1023      87     100    0.10     559     541    WED 12Z 05-FEB  -4.5    -1.9    1013      93      85    0.78     554     543    WED 18Z 05-FEB  -2.0    -2.6    1008      90      53    0.16     541     535    THU 00Z 06-FEB  -4.7   -10.2    1017      80      69    0.03     541     528    

IPT:

WED 06Z 05-FEB  -4.9    -5.6    1023      84      97    0.06     558     540    WED 12Z 05-FEB  -4.8    -3.4    1015      93      99    0.74     554     542    WED 18Z 05-FEB  -2.7    -4.6    1008      89      73    0.27     541     535    THU 00Z 06-FEB  -5.4   -10.1    1016      82      69    0.06     540     528  

MDT:

WED 06Z 05-FEB  -3.4    -4.3    1023      90     100    0.05     563     544    WED 12Z 05-FEB  -2.4     0.2    1014      95      99    0.59     558     547    WED 18Z 05-FEB   1.6     1.8    1007      86      54    0.16     548     543    THU 00Z 06-FEB  -0.4    -8.4    1014      83      49    0.01     545     535 

 

Beautiful for us... ugly for south-central PA.

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Agreed. Much better model and ensemble agreement for that storm that we had for this or Wednesday's storms at the same range... like night and day, really. Still some major details to be worked out, though, so it's certainly quite possible we could end up seeing nothing or not much out of it, yet.

Of course - we saw wild swings this past week even late in the game. Heck this upcoming event was a GLC sn-zr-rn for a while.

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Of course - we saw wild swings this past week even late in the game. Heck this upcoming event was a GLC sn-zr-rn for a while.

 

Indeed, though anybody who had been looking at the ensembles would have expected wild swings this week, with ensemble agreement near "abysmal" levels. :P

 

At the very least, ensembles agree that there WILL be a storm to track for the weekend (even if it's weak and out to sea). If I remember correctly, even three days ago, some of the GFS ensembles didn't even have today's storm at all.

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I'm having a hard time seeing how we have a crippling ice storm down here IF the EURO's text data comes true.  For MDT it shows close to 6" of snow followed by a rapid transition to rain near the very end with less than 0.2" total liquid after the transition.  Seems to me there would have to be some major warm tongue between 850 and the surface to create the heavy ZR scenario.

 

I'm not trying to discount all the other model's and especially if Horst is worried, but the EURO along now with the UKIE try to keep 850 near or even slightly below zero during the meat of the storm in vicinity of MDT.

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I'm having a hard time seeing how we have a crippling ice storm down here IF the EURO's text data comes true.  For MDT it shows close to 6" of snow followed by a rapid transition to rain near the very end with less than 0.2" total liquid after the transition.  Seems to me there would have to be some major warm tongue between 850 and the surface to create the heavy ZR scenario.

 

I'm not trying to discount all the other model's and especially if Horst is worried, but the EURO along now with the UKIE try to keep 850 near or even slightly below zero during the meat of the storm in vicinity of MDT.

 

I think the Euro would bring a decent amount of sleet/zr down there. Even though 850s barely pop above 0C at hr 48 (they're near 4C at hr 51, though most of the precip is done by then), the warmest layer is between 850 and 800mb. So it's possible at hr 45 and hr 48 there's still a layer above 850mb that's above freezing.

 

That being said, it would seem to argue for more of a snow->sleet rather than snow->zr scenario.

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Ok...I promise I won't post anything more about my opinions on the next storm but please look at the text data from KCXY from the 12Z run and tell me where is the crippling ice storm.  This is the coldest run yet for the storm.  The warmest it gets is 0 at 850, 925, and the surface.

 

http://wxweb.meteostar.com/sample/sample.shtml?text=KCXY

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I'm having a hard time seeing how we have a crippling ice storm down here IF the EURO's text data comes true.  For MDT it shows close to 6" of snow followed by a rapid transition to rain near the very end with less than 0.2" total liquid after the transition.  Seems to me there would have to be some major warm tongue between 850 and the surface to create the heavy ZR scenario.

 

I'm not trying to discount all the other model's and especially if Horst is worried, but the EURO along now with the UKIE try to keep 850 near or even slightly below zero during the meat of the storm in vicinity of MDT.

thing with text data is that the .2 C for 850 temp at 12z doesnt let us know when that transition from below 0 to above 0 occurs... we could see most of the 6 hour precip as snow or it could transition in the middle of that period... plus it only shows 850 and surface temps so when there is a warm layer at 800 we dont see it on the text data

 

really coming down now in what I have a feeling is the final burst here... much drier snow so the best ratios we have seen all morning occurring now

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