WestCoaster Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Does Lake Ontario ever freeze over? Not really. It's too deep. It can happen around some of the shorelines/harbours, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWeather Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 You're in a belt. If I were you my mouth would be watering over a pattern like this. I don't live in a snowbelt. I am in Hamburg a town with a population of nearly 60,000 people. I am 14 miles south of Buffalo which helps in terms of snowfall, but the real snowbelt is 20-30 minutes away from me in the hills. Perrysburg in Chautauqua county is near 200 inches on the year already. The nearby snowbelts are 10-15 minutes or so away and already have 150+ inches on the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowstorms Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Wow, that's pretty crazy. Mine is at 65-66° most of the time in the winter. Really? If my thermostat is lower than 70F, my house begins getting colder, which is why I keep it around 75 to 78F. Must be the different climatology you and I must have? Whats your mean temperature anomalies for DJF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottawa Blizzard Posted January 17, 2014 Author Share Posted January 17, 2014 Really? If my thermostat is lower than 70F, my house begins getting colder, which is why I keep it around 75 to 78F. Must be the different climatology you and I must have? Whats your mean temperature anomalies for DJF? Right now, it is 68F/20C inside my house, which is comfortable for me. I find that we North Americans overheat our homes. I'd rather have a temperature of 68F and a blanket at night than be sweating buckets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWeather Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Does Lake Ontario ever freeze over? As Westcoaster stated it very rarely freezes over because of how deep the lake is. The outer edges usually freeze over in most normal winters but the middle usually does not. I believe it has frozen over 5 times in record keeping history which equates to 90% ice coverage. Here is a good article about that. http://www.mynewwaterfronthome.com/greatlakesfreeze.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottawa Blizzard Posted January 17, 2014 Author Share Posted January 17, 2014 Not really. It's too deep. It can happen around some of the shorelines/harbours, though. It's frozen over a couple of times, I think. In 1893 and 1934 I believe. It almost froze in 1994. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoaster Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Really? If my thermostat is lower than 70F, my house begins getting colder, which is why I keep it around 75 to 78F. Must be the different climatology you and I must have? Whats your mean temperature anomalies for DJF? I'm typically around 68F. 72F if I want to spoil myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoaster Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 As Westcoaster stated it very rarely freezes over because of how deep the lake is. The outer edges usually freeze over in most normal winters but the middle usually does not. I believe it has frozen over 5 times in record keeping history which equates to 90% ice coverage. Here is a good article about that. http://www.mynewwaterfronthome.com/greatlakesfreeze.aspx Lake Ontario can definitely deliver LES all winter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottawa Blizzard Posted January 17, 2014 Author Share Posted January 17, 2014 Lake Ontario can definitely deliver LES all winter Funny thing is that I checked the traffic cameras for Syracuse- which averages over 100 inches of snow a year - and they have bare ground! People there must be wondering "what winter?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveNay Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 JB has been busting forehead veins over this coming pattern for the last three days in his columns, here is an excerpt from today using Chicago as a marker: What happens after that is the stuff legends are made of. Again, that ITS EVEN ON THE TABLE... this outbreak comes south over the pole and reaches the lakes day 10-11 ( upper support) and that it comes after what is a major cold outbreak that is coming day 5-8 should startle even the most stoic among you. I cant believe this, this is the worst it could possibly get in a place like Chicago. Even if 15 warmer at night, its severe A week with average highs near -5 and average lows near -20, with one night near -30. What is startling is this was the warmer of the models in the last 2 outbreaks Who is this JB guy and where is his blog? I'm not usually one to complain about extremes but goddamn this heating cycle is gonna break the bank Thermostats already fixed on 62 and we're probably gonna end up moving it lower if this pans out I think i win the thermostat challenge. The highest my thermo goes is 60 on the weekend, in the mornings and evenings and 55 the rest of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Central Illinois Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Who is this JB guy and where is his blog? I think i win the thermostat challenge. The highest my thermo goes is 60 on the weekend, in the mornings and evenings and 55 the rest of the time. JB is Joe Bastardi from WxBell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman99 Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 we keep our thermostat at 62 when we're home..60 the rest of the time and at night. Nice and pleasant ..no need for it to be too damn warm. 70 or above is just atrocious to me, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottawa Blizzard Posted January 17, 2014 Author Share Posted January 17, 2014 My benchmark for this upcoming cold wave is a second "zero day" in Toronto. We managed it on the 7th, let's see if we can do it again if not on the 21st or 22nd, then maybe on the 27th or 28th. I'd also like to see a morning low of fifteen below Fahrenheit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daddylonglegs Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 12z Euro is nasty at 216/240...maybe not quite as bad as a day ago, but still showing a blast of cold air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoaster Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 My benchmark for this upcoming cold wave is a second "zero day" in Toronto. We managed it on the 7th, let's see if we can do it again if not on the 21st or 22nd, then maybe on the 27th or 28th. I'd also like to see a morning low of fifteen below Fahrenheit. I think we will really struggle to dip below -10F with this given the pitiful snow cover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowstormcanuck Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I don't live in a snowbelt. I am in Hamburg a town with a population of nearly 60,000 people. I am 14 miles south of Buffalo which helps in terms of snowfall, but the real snowbelt is 20-30 minutes away from me in the hills. Perrysburg in Chautauqua county is near 200 inches on the year already. The nearby snowbelts are 10-15 minutes or so away and already have 150+ inches on the year. Can we define snowbelt? You get frequent bouts of LES and your yearly average probably approaches 100". To me, that's a snowbelt, even if there are locales that are even more impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWeather Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Can we define snowbelt? You get frequent bouts of LES and your yearly average probably approaches 100". To me, that's a snowbelt, even if there are locales that are even more impressive. The city of Buffalo averages 95-105 inches of snow per year. I average around 105-120 down here. The snow belts average 200+ south and east of Buffalo. I just don't consider a suburb that contains 60k people to be a snowbelt. Especially since its a 15-20 minute drive to downtown Buffalo. The real snow-belts are in ski country where they average double my snowfall and have 2k+ elevation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Storm Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 The city of Buffalo averages 95-105 inches of snow per year. I average around 105-120 down here. The snow belts average 200+ south and east of Buffalo. You're in a snow-belt. Just like the area from NW. IN into W. MI is a snow-belt...But obviously averages vary greatly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWeather Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 You're in a snow-belt. Just like the area from NW. IN into W. MI is a snow-belt...But obviously averages vary greatly. I disagree and most local mets would as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosier Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 You're in a snow-belt. Just like the area from NW. IN into W. MI is a snow-belt...But obviously averages vary greatly. I was just thinking of the IN/MI comparison...that entire area is unofficially known as the snowbelt despite averages ranging from around 50-100"+ I'm with you and canuck on a more liberal definition...if you get numerous LES events per winter and a substantial percentage of your snow comes from LES, you're in the snowbelt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Storm Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I disagree and most local mets would as well. Take the lakes away and all of that 60-200"+ area is gone. You're in a snow-belt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowstormcanuck Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I disagree and most local mets would as well. I'm not sure how this map helps you. As I've stated, just because you're not in the bullseye doesn't mean you're not in a snowbelt. Maybe it's a local WNY thing to call the heavier LES areas as the "snowbelt" but to every other non-local, you're in a snowbelt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I can relate to what BuffaloWeather is saying. It's more about a local snow belt than anything. To the outside world anything on the lee of the Great Lakes that gets lake effect is the "snow belt". But watch local news, media, radio, even AFDs from this region and the "snow belt" means an entirely different thing. CLE averages about 70" of snow per year but is not considered in the "snow belt" by anyone here. Yet, most outside the region would define that as snow belt. In fact there are some urban/suburban areas here on the east side of Cleveland that average 80-90" per year and many who live in those suburbs would not consider themselves to live in the snow belt as the best bands generally set up to their north and east in the "real snow belt". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weatherbo Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Anyone that just got 2' of snow from lake Erie is in a snow belt.... any argument against that is moot. Most of NW lower is in a snow belt but there are favored areas within the snow belt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottawa Blizzard Posted January 18, 2014 Author Share Posted January 18, 2014 I think we will really struggle to dip below -10F with this given the pitiful snow cover Perhaps but there's another1-2" coming tonight and more on Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spwild47 Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 I agree with the 1" not doing much for albedo, but from what I have read getting to 4"+ the marginal albedo per inch (slope) really drops off.. 4" should cover the chisel plowed soy and corn fields, but probably not the winter wheat...also rooftop snow may not last that long with just 4".. I have never seen any info on radiative effects by depth curious if that's out there.. Not saying you are wrong just curious as to what the science is behind snowpack depth and cooling. What JB is saying is not going to happen. He is hyping this up way too much. If the area doesn't see any significant snow cover increase before this cold shot, it'll probably end up being warmer than last week. 1-4" of snow on the ground across the area doesn't have the same effect as the 10-16" did last week. What JB is saying is not going to happen. He is hyping this up way too much. If the area doesn't see any significant snow cover increase before this cold shot, it'll probably end up being warmer than last week. 1-4" of snow on the ground across the area doesn't have the same effect as the 10-16" did last week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWeather Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 I'm not sure how this map helps you. As I've stated, just because you're not in the bullseye doesn't mean you're not in a snowbelt. Maybe it's a local WNY thing to call the heavier LES areas as the "snowbelt" but to every other non-local, you're in a snowbelt. This, exactly. But I agree with you, I guess we are in the snowbelt to everyone else in the United States. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geos Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Take the lakes away and all of that 60-200"+ area is gone. You're in a snow-belt. +1 Buffaloweather you're in a snow belt. Especially if you ask someone from outside of areas that don't get LES or very little of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottawa Blizzard Posted January 18, 2014 Author Share Posted January 18, 2014 Wow. The 0z GFS shows it actually going above freezing in Chicago on the 28th, nevermind below zero! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbcmh81 Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Wow. The 0z GFS shows it actually going above freezing in Chicago on the 28th, nevermind below zero! Yep, it completely lost the end of the month cold, except for a 1-day spell on the 27th. For Columbus. 18z 27th: 19/-19 28th: 20/-5 29th: 19/-25 30th: 21/-1 31st: 19/-7 0z 27th: 6/-5 28th: 34/-3 29th: 38/33 30th: 38/32 31st: 49/36 The 18z was pretty weird with the wild swings, but it was at least consistent with the extreme cold. 0z is a thaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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