Jump to content
  • Member Statistics

    17,609
    Total Members
    7,904
    Most Online
    NH8550
    Newest Member
    NH8550
    Joined

Winter 2014-2015 Thread


Ji

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 2.1k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

At the same time in 02 and 04 as this year the NE pac was warm. The bigger difference is in the PDO. Both of those years were in or trending towards a +pdo (04 faded and the winter sucked). That's a big wild card this year. I'd trade the warm pool in the NE pac for a +pdo all day long. 

 

I think it's quite possible the NE pac loses a good bit of warmth by the time we close out the year. If the wpac stays warm with a -pdo signature it could be troublesome. As matt said already, we have a long ways to go and lots can change. 

Yeah.  A GOA low come October can make that warm pool cool very quickly as it stirs things up.  We shall see.

 

Every year it's the same thing.  A limited pool of analog years from which we have data means we have no real precedent to compare to.        

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah.  A GOA low come October can make that warm pool cool very quickly as it stirs things up.  We shall see.

 

Every year it's the same thing.  A limited pool of analog years from which we have data means we have no real precedent to compare to.        

 

 

Yea, analogs are only good for general ideas and even then there are plenty of busts. Specifics like where the snow falls and doesn't get's pretty muddy pretty quick. Mod nino's are the only thing that have a pretty strong track record at our latitude. Nina's are annoying because they lack miller A's more often then not. We don't do well will B's often but they can perform case by case so some nina years are much better than others.  

 

Give me a big stout -ao to start Dec and I won't care much at all about anything else. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

SOI has been negative for a full 31 days. Euro weeklies still paint a Modoki like set-up as the fall progresses. Last year, the "expected niño" crapped out about this time of the year. Let's hope this year turns out better niño -wise. It's now September and it's game time.

MDstorm

Hopefully it wont crap out this year. Should have an updated ENSO outlook from CPC by tomorrow. As of last week the probability of an El Nino developing by winter was reduced somewhat to 65%. But you are right, its game time now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know that it matters much, but there is no nino at all right now...3.4 is dead...all the warm water is west of the dateline...the PDO region looks hideous....again, not sure it matters...

 

anomnight.9.1.2014.gif

officially, we're are "Oh so close" at +.4C in 3.4

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/data/indices/wksst8110.for

 

ENSO 1&2, 3, 3.4 and 4

 27AUG2014     21.3 0.8     25.4 0.4     27.2 0.4     29.2 0.5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't want to post this but I will....

 

When I did the AO data analysis a couple years ago, I pulled the years of all December's with an AO of -1.2 or lower and included ENSO. Weak Nino's have not been friendly to us even when we get some help with blocking. Small dataset but looking at it shows that Nina's and cool neutral have been much better to us than weak warm enso conditions. Luckily there's not enough data to draw any type of conclusions. Just something to consider. 

 

post-2035-0-97211700-1409686570_thumb.jp

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't want to post this but I will....

 

When I did the AO data analysis a couple years ago, I pulled the years of all December's with an AO of -1.2 or lower and included ENSO. Weak Nino's have not been friendly to us even when we get some help with blocking. Small dataset but looking at it shows that Nina's and cool neutral have been much better to us than weak warm enso conditions. Luckily there's not enough data to draw any type of conclusions. Just something to consider. 

 

attachicon.gif-AO Dec aonaopnaenso.JPG

I will take my chances with ENSO neutral up to a moderate Nino over even a weak Nina, esp if we can get the AO/NAO in our favor. I recall looking at ENSO data for Philadelphia winters a while back(yeah I know its not DC but M.A. in general) and it was dramatic how crapola Ninas are for number of significant snow events and also the biggies(>10") compared to Ninos of any strength. Neutral, weak, moderate, and even strong Nino years were all way better wrt number of events and big events. I think the one oddity was that cool neutral did perform better for big events over warm neutral, but not by much. Thats going by memory so I could be wrong on that.

 

Edit- Weak Nina is actually comparable to ENSO neutral wrt to avg snowfall(both slightly above), but goes well below avg for mod or strong Nina. I got all this info for Philly from a presentation I attended for USCG last fall by one of the Mount Holly mets on the upcoming(last) winter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know that it matters much, but there is no nino at all right now...3.4 is dead...all the warm water is west of the dateline...the PDO region looks hideous....again, not sure it matters...

anomnight.9.1.2014.gif

If this was early Nov, niño would be in big trouble. However, 3.4 is not really dead and warming is more likely than not over the next 4-8 weeks. This time next month should look a lot better....or not..... Lol.

MDstorm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Isn't a strongly negative QBO bad though?

maybe, but I doubt it stays that low....in fact, it should be rising by JAN

otoh, sea ice relative to recent years is looking good.....seems to me that it must be colder up there and that would make it more likely than not to increase the chance of greater snow cover

if nothing else, it keeps my weenie hopes high!

sea_ice_only.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

06z GFS shows some N. Hemisphere snow cover gain over the next couple of weeks. I don't usually track this stuff, so I wouldn't know if it's above or below average for this time of year.

We would prefer to have it gain in Oct. At least on the russian side. Gaining on our side could help source regions with cooler airmasses in the fall but really has no bearing on winter. Most of Canada will be covered by Dec almost every year.

The only meaningful thing we can track outside of Enso is the rate of Siberian snow cover in Oct. Last year had a prolific gain in Sept but the rate of gain was low in Oct. The Dec +AO verified for a time but didn't have legs thank god.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...