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Central PA & The Fringes - December 2013 Part III


PennMan

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There is no model that ran today that matches the operational surface map with the surface. We are still going aggressive and stay aggressive and we will stay that way until further notice. There will be no change from us despite the models at the surface indicating it won't be a big storm. This is the difference between meteorology and modelology. We are able to determine what is going on in the big picture that most can't see because they're looking at a surface map that is not accurately reflecting what should be happening. Looking at the upper air pattern of every model today, this should be bigger then shown on the snow maps and an area of low pressure much closer to the coast.

From EPWPA at about 1:20 today.

 

 The Euro looked much like last night as far as total snowfall and very similar to the GFS. But again, if the upper air pattern matched the surface it would be a much different story. For those of you so inclined, read up on the Boxing Day blizzard. That is a storm that everyone was supposed to get an inch when all the models were wrong 24 hours before and the same thing happened where the upper air patterns were different than the surface maps and all the sudden, BOOM. Lots of time... there were huge improvements today on all of the models in the upper air pattern. In meteorology, that is all that matters.

at about 1:30 pm

There will be no second call map released today we will be releasing a final call on Wednesday evening. The first call map stands as called. For those of you that are going on and on about hype lectures and the use of wording that we chose, it is all waste of your time. You can think all you want but a first call is just that, a first call. The final call will have exact amounts and our final call map is still supported. I love how people are just dismissing this storm like it's nothing when they have no idea about how to read a 500mb map.

 

 

a few minutes later.

Maybe they are seeing (hoping) something that everyone else isn't seeing. I don't know, I am not a  met. I am just a player in a rock and roll band.....

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I will say that when a trough with a vigorous vort max that swings that far south into the continent, it will spin up a storm somewhere where a natural baroclinic zone sets up. At this stage of the winter, a surface storm SHOULD form nearer the coast than the globals are depicting. I've seen this many times over my life...not so much that the modeling is off, ( I am sure that the theoretical solutions of the atmosphere are accurately being calculated), but the storm develops in the vicinity of the natural baroclinic region that exists between the cold land mass and the relatively FAR warmer ocean. If the arctic air becomes involved in any way, a "surprise" snowfall will occur somewhere in the northern Mid Atlantic...in spite of the regional and global modeling. I am impressed with the physics of the modelers and how the computers often solve the fluid dynamics of the atmosphere; it's just that the numerical solutions are not what always occur when extremes become involved. Just sayin'...

By the way, Happy New Year y'all!

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That hole is Ugly for central PA. I'm going to the shore for this one. It is trendin better, but if that nam verified many would be on weenie suicide watch for a few hours while it's snowing everywhere but central pa.

 

I just watched TWC's video ( :bag: ) on the storm and the models on their web page, and the graphics they used for the Euro and the GFS both show the same donut hole over PA for a period of time.

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NAM just 180'd!

 

EDIT: Winners on this run are more eastern half - like canderson, Voyager, and myself.

 

MDT looks like a little over .25 QPF. Western half still struggles though. Voyager and I are seeing the .5 line.

 

 

Quite a difference from the 12z run which basically hosed us and gave about 0.05" qpf for the whole event.

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Quite a difference from the 12z run which basically hosed us and gave about 0.05" qpf for the whole event.

Although I'm not a red tagger, I've followed this stuff for long enough to know that the models typically do this...and I really think that as some/many have suggested, the maps arent really showing how the evolution/dynamics should play out.  I think the 0z and tomorrows 12z runs show the trough sharpen a little and a slightly less sheared/southern slider with more appreciable qpf extending back NW before the final run tomorrow night showing a slight correction back SE.  Seen this too many times and I think this time may prove to be no different.  

 

Happy New Years day to all my Central Pa weather peeps!  Fun crew to hang with.

 

Nut

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Goofus is .25 or less for everyone reading. Starting to zero in on a 1 to 3 event.

???  You need to check out CTP as they are usually gun shy and save my area in the LSV, they are thinking 2-4 across much of central Pa with 6" into N and NE Pa.  

 

You need a New Years resolution to turn that posting frown upsideown.  No models depict 1-3 in your area.  You've been in a far better spot than most in the forum for this one.  Not picking on you, but tell it like it is....not as your inner voice tells you to type as you dont want to be let down.

 

Nut

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Although I'm not a red tagger, I've followed this stuff for long enough to know that the models typically do this...and I really think that as some/many have suggested, the maps arent really showing how the evolution/dynamics should play out.  I think the 0z and tomorrows 12z runs show the trough sharpen a little and a slightly less sheared/southern slider with more appreciable qpf extending back NW before the final run tomorrow night showing a slight correction back SE.  Seen this too many times and I think this time may prove to be no different.  

 

Happy New Years day to all my Central Pa weather peeps!  Fun crew to hang with.

 

Nut

Amen!

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Goofus is .25 or less for everyone reading. Starting to zero in on a 1 to 3 event.

???  You need to check out CTP as they are usually gun shy and save my area in the LSV, they are thinking 2-4 across much of central Pa with 6" into N and NE Pa.  

 

You need a New Years resolution to turn that posting frown upsideown.  No models depict 1-3 in your area.  You've been in a far better spot than most in the forum for this one.  Not picking on you, but tell it like it is....not as your inner voice tells you to type as you dont want to be let down.

 

Nut

He's just overcompensating for his weenie years. I prefer this version.

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I know we are still focused on the Thursday/Friday event but I am wondering what today's Euro shows for the potential monster storm for next Monday?  GFS seems much less powerful.  I'm wondering if the Euro is doing the same thing for that one as it was doing for our next one yesterday?

 

There seems to be no question that behind whatever comes through early next week that we spend 24 hours sub -20C at 850.  That should translate into highs no higher than the teens down here and single digits up north with lows Tuesday night Zero or below everywhere (in our CWA).

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???  You need to check out CTP as they are usually gun shy and save my area in the LSV, they are thinking 2-4 across much of central Pa with 6" into N and NE Pa.  

 

You need a New Years resolution to turn that posting frown upsideown.  No models depict 1-3 in your area.  You've been in a far better spot than most in the forum for this one.  Not picking on you, but tell it like it is....not as your inner voice tells you to type as you dont want to be let down.

 

Nut

The dryslot looks quite pronounced until you're almost to the Delaware River. I'd say 2-4" is a possibility but no more unless you're near the NY State border or well east. PA notoriously does poorly in these transfer of energy/dryslot type scenarios.

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