Typhoon Tip Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Feb 13 was extraordinarily high impact here in CT. The state was basically shut down. With the exception of oct 2011 it was the best and most impactful blizzard I've ever seen. Yes but how pervasive is that, Ryan. That's part of the equation in my mine. Hey it's just my opinion so it's probably worth sh!t but CT is not a big area. It's almost meso-scale. I toured around Mass shortly after that storm and sorry, it just wasn't that big of deal. The snow storm near halloween ...THAT was more in line with the type of event I was originally discussing. It's been awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 NCTRL and W MAprobably had the least impact. It also shut down the s shore for 3-7 days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Yes but how pervasive is that, Ryan. That's part of the equation in my mine. Hey it's just my opinion so it's probably worth sh!t but CT is not a big area. It's almost meso-scale. I toured around Mass shortly after that storm and sorry, it just wasn't that big of deal. The snow storm near halloween ...THAT was more in line with the type of event I was originally discussing. It's been awhile. I have no idea what the basis of the discussion is but I would say that '78 was more of a big deal in eastern Mass/RI and maybe a sliver of eastern CT than it was in Western New England so when you're comparing one storm to another, you have to keep that in mind. It's very rare to get a storm that impact the entire region using the guidelines you mentioned but it doesn't mean that it hasn't happened on a sub-region basis. Feb '13 had that impact here but not there. 36 hours of snow with 40mph+ winds and 2-3"/hr rates for a time is pretty rare. Oct '11 was closer to bridging the regions but even then, some people missed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 If your threshold for a high impact snowstorm is what the eastern 1/3rd of MA and RI experienced in Feb 1978....then you will probably be waiting quite a bit longer for another one. It is entirely possible to have a high impact snowstorm with short duration...just look at 12/13/07, 12/23/97, and 12/9/05. As for Feb 2013, the only thing that prevented a lot of SNE from being shut down for several days was that the brunt of it was overnight Friday night...it allowed the snow removal to remain pretty efficient despite the intense conditions. The conditions for several hours during that storm were the worst blizzard conditions I have ever seen. If that storm happened on a weekday mostly during the day, the social impact would have been absolutely enormous. From a meteorological perspective, it was a pretty rare storm...only the timing saved it from shutting the whole region down for 4-5 days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 It was (as Scooter said) pretty meh for N Central Mass. A very good event, but very un-life altering Oct 2011 was a bit of a bigger deal here, but still kind of meh I wish I had experienced what Kevin and others did in Feb to compare it to what I saw in 78 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weathafella Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 If your threshold for a high impact snowstorm is what the eastern 1/3rd of MA and RI experienced in Feb 1978....then you will probably be waiting quite a bit longer for another one. It is entirely possible to have a high impact snowstorm with short duration...just look at 12/13/07, 12/23/97, and 12/9/05. As for Feb 2013, the only thing that prevented a lot of SNE from being shut down for several days was that the brunt of it was overnight Friday night...it allowed the snow removal to remain pretty efficient despite the intense conditions. The conditions for several hours during that storm were the worst blizzard conditions I have ever seen. If that storm happened on a weekday mostly during the day, the social impact would have been absolutely enormous. From a meteorological perspective, it was a pretty rare storm...only the timing saved it from shutting the whole region down for 4-5 days. Also, lessons from 78 were heeded. It seemed heavy handed but having no allowed traffic before the brunt of the storm saved many from casualties, I recall being at work at 11AM and people were saying, looks like a dud....if I didn't have to be off the road I'd stay. That's because people expected an immediate white curtain but the brunt came in late day with mostly oes earlier. So while many cursed the government heavy handedness, it likely saved lives and reduced the impact. It was a 24 hour storm complete with huge winds and 2-3 feet region wide. Not sure what Tip wants... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 If people are comparing this period to something "quiet" , look no further to the 80s. Outside of the big storms in '84 and '87..whole lotta meh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 If people are comparing this period to something "quiet" , look no further to the 80s. Outside of the big storms in '84 and '87..whole lotta meh. Tell me about it - you took what you could, when you could. I seem to recall cold events more than snowstorms outside of April '83 and back to back Veterans Day storms two years in a row. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typhoon Tip Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 If people are comparing this period to something "quiet" , look no further to the 80s. Outside of the big storms in '84 and '87..whole lotta meh. Yeah, no kiddin' -- that period was brutal, then underscored with some whopper blown calls for blizzards that ended up nicking the cape. As far as Feb 2013 ... look, I don't want to violate the sanctity of people's love and lust for that event -- it was great, I thought so at the time, and still do. But its lack of duration is a big problem for me --- and that is related to the length of time it can shut things down, if going with that factor alone. But it was missing other stuff, too. It reminds me of that little brother of the uber talented athlete that ends up in the pro's and then everyone thinks the little brother can be the same thing, so his road is sort of paved reputation-wise.. I have seen blizzard conditions of that storm's ilk, many many many times in my life. But low visibility and deep powdery snow is what it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey2002 Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 As for Feb 2013, the only thing that prevented a lot of SNE from being shut down for several days was that the brunt of it was overnight Friday night...it allowed the snow removal to remain pretty efficient despite the intense conditions. The conditions for several hours during that storm were the worst blizzard conditions I have ever seen. If that storm happened on a weekday mostly during the day, the social impact would have been absolutely enormous. From a meteorological perspective, it was a pretty rare storm...only the timing saved it from shutting the whole region down for 4-5 days. Completely agree... timing is everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey2002 Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Good color showing up now...we should be at peak in another 7-10 days. Awesome pic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damage In Tolland Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Lol at the dumbing down of 24-40 inches of snow in 18-20 hours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Lol at the dumbing down of 24-40 inches of snow in 18-20 hours Yeah for CT that was a huge impact. The weekend thing made it so it didn't quite have the disruption, but watching video of people walking down unplowed streets on Saturday morning after that event was pretty awesome. Everyone is going to have their personal favorites and opinions of impact...but it's going to vary from state to state, even county to county. Like the Dec 2008 ice storm in SNH and ORH County was probably the biggest impact those areas have seen or will ever see in a winter storm (hard to top 10 days of no power in terms of impact), but plenty of other folks in SNE saw literally no impact from that event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Yeah, no kiddin' -- that period was brutal, then underscored with some whopper blown calls for blizzards that ended up nicking the cape. As far as Feb 2013 ... look, I don't want to violate the sanctity of people's love and lust for that event -- it was great, I thought so at the time, and still do. But its lack of duration is a big problem for me --- and that is related to the length of time it can shut things down, if going with that factor alone. But it was missing other stuff, too. It reminds me of that little brother of the uber talented athlete that ends up in the pro's and then everyone thinks the little brother can be the same thing, so his road is sort of paved reputation-wise.. I have seen blizzard conditions of that storm's ilk, many many many times in my life. But low visibility and deep powdery snow is what it is... I don't have a love affair with that event like some people have with '78 but I can recall only three times in my memory of having 4"/hr rates and only once with hail and white out conditions. It snowed for 26 hours here and that's another condition that I've only seen a few times as well. If that happens with such a high frequency where you live, more power to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted September 23, 2013 Author Share Posted September 23, 2013 Lol at the dumbing down of 24-40 inches of snow in 18-20 hoursreally, 2nd best blizzard of my life and no hyperbole. I understand Tips perspective living way inland away from the core but closer in it was outstanding, winds and snow of epic intensity. Powder? Hardly fluff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Yeah for CT that was a huge impact. The weekend thing made it so it didn't quite have the disruption, but watching video of people walking down unplowed streets on Saturday morning after that event was pretty awesome. Everyone is going to have their personal favorites and opinions of impact...but it's going to vary from state to state, even county to county. Like the Dec 2008 ice storm in SNH and ORH County was probably the biggest impact those areas have seen or will ever see in a winter storm (hard to top 10 days of no power in terms of impact), but plenty of other folks in SNE saw literally no impact from that event. Well said. I think I've yet to see an event paralyze the corridor from NYC to BOS in its entirety. I think Oct '11 was bigger in that regard because I left on Sunday to visit my in-laws in Illinois and it took until I was in PA for us to find "normal" life. We got off at several exits along I-84 from Stafford and everyone was without power or there were long lines for gas/food. By the time I got to PA, I felt like a refuge and people were saying "what storm?". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted September 23, 2013 Author Share Posted September 23, 2013 Quiet since Sandy?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlantStickers Anonymous Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Locally living on 114 the road was clear in a day, but for plenty of friends in different parts of town it was a different story digging out/getting their streets done. 2/3 doors of my house were snowed shut and when it came to impact on the campus in salem it wasn't until Wednesday that things were open again, and even then available parking was slashed because there was nowhere for the snow to go. I have pictures of the main commuter lot and the walls of snow were high enough that from the inside you could only see the roofs of two story houses next to the lot. IMO it really wasn't a run of the mill nor'easter for my area. I don't usually measure 25-26" IMBY from a single overnight storm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Temps are cooling off nicely tonight with some 40s showing up in the normal interior cold spots in southern NE and some low 40s in the NNE. Today and the next few days are a welcome return to the cooler weather that we've been having. Tomorrow night could be frosty - maybe NE CT's first frost advisory even though we've already had frost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 50.5/46 here attm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 really, 2nd best blizzard of my life and no hyperbole. I understand Tips perspective living way inland away from the core but closer in it was outstanding, winds and snow of epic intensity. Powder? Hardly fluff. That band had to be probably something that many may have never witnessed or may not witness again their entire life. It was pumping like 0.4" QPF per hour of hail/snow/graupel among 40-50mph wind gusts. There have been a decent amount of big nor'easters (like the three in 2010-2011) since 2000, but last FEB was truly a notch above IMO (and I only got a foot) for CT, RI, and parts of MA. That storm was probably very similar for those folks to the 24-40" that eastern NY and VT got in Valentine's Day 2007...not wet heavy snow, but just dense wind-packed snow that comes with those types of 3-6"/hr bands plus strong winds. And I'm sure that Feb blizzard was like Valentines Day '07 in that folks aren't getting 2-3.5 feet by measuring every 6 hours...it's just several feet on the level at the end of the storm. Those are the whoppers...the ones where even with high winds and all the talk of wind destroying ratios, you're still left with an even 30" of dense wind-pack after the fact. It may not be wet snow, but it's also not upslope powder where we get 20" and it settles to 10" like 24-48 hours later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 That band had to be probably something that many may have never witnessed or may not witness again their entire life. It was pumping like 0.4" QPF per hour of hail/snow/graupel among 40-50mph wind gusts. There have been a decent amount of big nor'easters (like the three in 2010-2011) since 2000, but last FEB was truly a notch above IMO (and I only got a foot) for CT, RI, and parts of MA. That storm was probably very similar for those folks to the 24-40" that eastern NY and VT got in Valentine's Day 2007...not wet heavy snow, but just dense wind-packed snow that comes with those types of 3-6"/hr bands plus strong winds. And I'm sure that Feb blizzard was like Valentines Day '07 in that folks aren't getting 2-3.5 feet by measuring every 6 hours...it's just several feet on the level at the end of the storm. Those are the whoppers...the ones where even with high winds and all the talk of wind destroying ratios, you're still left with an even 30" of dense wind-pack after the fact. It may not be wet snow, but it's also not upslope powder where we get 20" and it settles to 10" like 24-48 hours later. It really was...I recall a heavier snowfall in the mid-90s where I picked up about 13" of snow in 2 hours and that was the heaviest snow I every saw but when that band in February came through and it was snowing 4" an hour with hail and gusty winds, it was like another world outside. I deliberately went out at the peak of conditions to experience it and it's not something I see that often and I know a large portion of eastern/central CT doesn't either. One of the other things that people forget is that there is more equipment now to handle to snow removal than there was in '78. Between 4x4's, plows, snowblowers, landscapers with plows, tractors, etc, I think it we would be hard pressed to ever see the kind of impact that eastern Mass/RI saw in '78 again. Temp down to 49 here...30s seem likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moneypitmike Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Lol at the dumbing down of 24-40 inches of snow in 18-20 hours It is funny. That was a memorable one for you guys down there. Pretty meh by comparison up this way. Hopefully we'll get some decent events this go 'round. Meanwhile, this might be the shortest ZFP I've seen. Looks like something that would be posted in San Diego--8 forecast periods encapsulated in one block. Tonight: Partly cloudy. Patchy fog after midnight. Much colder with lows in the upper 30s. Northwest winds 5 to 10 mph. Gusts up to 20 mph this evening. Monday: Sunny. Patchy fog in the morning. Highs in the upper 50s. Northwest winds 5 to 10 mph with gusts up to 20 mph. Monday Night: Clear. Cold with lows in the mid 30s. West winds 5 to 10 mph. Tuesday: Sunny. Patchy fog. Highs in the mid 60s. Northwest winds 5 to 10 mph. Gusts up to 20 mph in the afternoon. Tuesday Night: Clear. Lows in the lower 40s. Northwest winds 5 to 10 mph. Wednesday Through Saturday Night: Mostly clear. Highs in the upper 60s. Lows in the mid 40s. Sunday: Mostly sunny. Highs around 70 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Regular plows could not move the snow we had (Foxboro, MA) in 1978. Only National Guard big bucket loaders could get us out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 For ern MA, Jan 2005 takes the cake for PYM and points SE. 4/1/97 for BOS area. Debatable for areas in between as neither had the tree damage like this one despite dropping a bit less than Jan 2005. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Temp down to 49 here...30s seem likely. You guys clear and calm down there? I've got 48F up here but it's full overcast from NW orographics and breezy. I doubt we drop anymore than 6F by morning from where we are now. No surface inversion and decoupling tonight...tomorrow night though could be a frosty one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey2002 Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 That band had to be probably something that many may have never witnessed or may not witness again their entire life. It was pumping like 0.4" QPF per hour of hail/snow/graupel among 40-50mph wind gusts. It may not be wet snow, but it's also not upslope powder where we get 20" and it settles to 10" like 24-48 hours later. It actually was a heavy, wet snow down in the New Haven area. 3 feet of wet snow can just paralyze a city. I remember Ryan doing a story in Bridgeport on Tuesday (4 days later) and some streets were still impassable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey2002 Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 You guys clear and calm down there? I've got 48F up here but it's full overcast from NW orographics and breezy. I doubt we drop anymore than 6F by morning from where we are now. No surface inversion and decoupling tonight...tomorrow night though could be a frosty one. Completely clear, but still quite windy... and it's also 48 degrees here currently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typhoon Tip Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapturedNature Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 You guys clear and calm down there? I've got 48F up here but it's full overcast from NW orographics and breezy. I doubt we drop anymore than 6F by morning from where we are now. No surface inversion and decoupling tonight...tomorrow night though could be a frosty one. Yeah it's clear but like Joey said, there's a slight wind out there. There has to be some clear areas up there...I was noticing SLK and the CT Lakes are in the low 40s. My sensor over in Union is down to 46...colder than you...lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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