NNE Spring 2013 Thread

[OceanStWx]

May be but there's no stations there in that small of a distance so that's all estimated precip. Burlington to Mansfield is observed.

 

Considering the population we've got that area fairly well covered. You have precip observations from Berlin, Whitefield, Lancaster, Jefferson, Gorham, and Bethlehem.

 

And the precip shadow there is pretty legit. Winter storms are pretty frequently VFR and barely any snow at HIE.

[Nittany88]

Considering the population we've got that area fairly well covered. You have precip observations from Berlin, Whitefield, Lancaster, Jefferson, Gorham, and Bethlehem.

 

And the precip shadow there is pretty legit. Winter storms are pretty frequently VFR and barely any snow at HIE.

Im not saying its not, but take the distance and precip difference between burlington and mansfield and compare it between the same of any of those and washington. Its not my research so if im wrong im wrong but ive read it in several pieces.

[dendrite]

Im not saying its not, but take the distance and precip difference between burlington and mansfield and compare it between the same of any of those and washington. Its not my research so if im wrong im wrong but ive read it in several pieces.

I think MWN + a locale near HIE wins in a not even close race. MWN averages about 97" of liquid and the pukehole in HIE is probably barely over 30". I think BTV-Mansfield is about 37"-81" respectively. As the crow flies, I think the distances are similar.

[tamarack]

 

May be but there's no stations there in that small of a distance so that's all estimated precip. Burlington to Mansfield is observed.

Certainly true for Maine. Except for some hit-or-miss obs from Sugarloaf, none of the taller Maine mts have records, and my nominee (Katahdin) never will.

[powderfreak]

I think MWN + a locale near HIE wins in a not even close race. MWN averages about 97" of liquid and the pukehole in HIE is probably barely over 30". I think BTV-Mansfield is about 37"-81" respectively. As the crow flies, I think the distances are similar.

HIE must get downsloped from like all angles to get less precip than BTV, which is one of the driest spots in VT, aside from maybe one county south in the Champlain Valley.

[J.Spin]

I find this stuff fascinating and it fits with what I think of climo here... out in Stowe Village we definitely get less snowfall than along the Spine and it can be hit or miss with the west slope depending on the pattern.  This past year we had similar snowfall just because of a lot of E or SE flow events and a lack of NW flow upslope.  And those NW flow events seemed to have high Froude Numbers so Underhill was never really able to pull away from Stowe Village like they did in 2010-2011 where they had 220" vs. 150" in Stowe.

 

I hadn’t thought about it before, but indeed the effect of last year’s east side/west side snowfall distribution looks like it’s also seen in Bolton Valley’s 2012-2013 snowfall numbers.  With only 245” of snowfall relative to their 312” mean, that’s just 78.5% of average, vs. Stowe, Smugg’s, and Jay that all came in with ~85%+ of average snowfall.  It was a decent ski season at Bolton (especially relative to 2011-2012), but definitely well below average on snowfall.  I noticed it most in the way we didn’t have any of those super-deep upslope days that they often get.

 

[OceanStWx]

HIE must get downsloped from like all angles to get less precip than BTV, which is one of the driest spots in VT, aside from maybe one county south in the Champlain Valley.

 

There really is no favorable wind direction for HIE. I mean clearly they put on a downslope clinic in E/SE flow, frequently warming and gusting as they do. And even W or NW flow isn't great because they get shadowed by the northern Greens and high terrain of the Northeast Kingdom.

[Lava Rock]

Cold front just moved through. Gusty winds and hvy shower

[powderfreak]

I thought we could get a dry day in...but nope. Quick thunderstorm came through and only wet the ground with under a tenth of an inch. But still, tough to get a full day precipitation free these days.

Down to 62F off a high of 74F.

[powderfreak]

I hadn’t thought about it before, but indeed the effect of last year’s east side/west side snowfall distribution looks like it’s also seen in Bolton Valley’s 2012-2013 snowfall numbers. With only 245” of snowfall relative to their 312” mean, that’s just 78.5% of average, vs. Stowe, Smugg’s, and Jay that all came in with ~85%+ of average snowfall. It was a decent ski season at Bolton (especially relative to 2011-2012), but definitely well below average on snowfall. I noticed it most in the way we didn’t have any of those super-deep upslope days that they often get.

Yeah it was an interesting year in that regard with a lot of SE flow storms (our two biggest of the season where those)...we'd have a primary low dying to our west with a deepening secondary down near SNE or just south of there. So we would get the SE flow snow (remember how many storms would have that NEVT downslope QPF signature?) but with the dying primary lows to our west, we'd never really be able to get the backside NW flow. And when good deformation and NW flow combined, it was often in SNE last year.

Hopefully this next winter we can get more consolidated and stacked lows further northwest than last year...those are our whoppers when we can get under the best frontogenisis banding on the NW flank of the storm, while also adding low level upsloping flow. That's when the Spine just gets crushed.

[eyewall]

It was a beautiful evening following a quick shower in Winooski. I took a few pics:

 

 

[Nittany88]

I think MWN + a locale near HIE wins in a not even close race. MWN averages about 97" of liquid and the pukehole in HIE is probably barely over 30". I think BTV-Mansfield is about 37"-81" respectively. As the crow flies, I think the distances are similar.

I found no data online for HIE, so I'll use Berlin Municipal Airport.

 

BTV: 36.82"

MMN: 81.30"

Difference- 44.5"

Distance- 17 miles

2.62" per Mile

 

 

Berlin: 41.49"

MWN: 93.90"

Difference: 52.41"

Distance: 21.8 miles

2.40" per Mile

 

 

BTV-MMN has that one, although its close. Of course this is using just climate sites that report precip and have annual climate data. HIE might have it beat like you said, and if you get me annual precip data, I'll be happy to admit that the gradient might be tighter as it is closer (14 miles from MWN).

[Nittany88]

I found no data online for HIE, so I'll use Berlin Municipal Airport.

 

BTV: 36.82"

MMN: 81.30"

Difference- 44.5"

Distance- 17 miles

2.62" per Mile

 

 

Berlin: 41.49"

MWN: 93.90"

Difference: 52.41"

Distance: 21.8 miles

2.40" per Mile

 

 

BTV-MMN has that one, although its close. Of course this is using just climate sites that report precip and have annual climate data. HIE might have it beat like you said, and if you get me annual precip data, I'll be happy to admit that the gradient might be tighter as it is closer (14 miles from MWN).

There we go, I got climate data for Jefferson:

 

Jefferson: 39.79"

MWN: 93.90"

Difference: 54.11"

Distance: 13.4 miles

4.04" per Mile

 

I stand corrected, but I'm sure those few publications I had read were only using long established sites, as Jefferson dates only back to 2000.

[dendrite]

There we go, I got climate data for Jefferson:

 

Jefferson: 39.79"

MWN: 93.90"

Difference: 54.11"

Distance: 13.4 miles

4.04" per Mile

 

I stand corrected, but I'm sure those few publications I had read were only using long established sites, as Jefferson dates only back to 2000.

The 2000s were a wet decade too so any climo data only going back to 2000 will be biased wet as well. Near 40" sounds high for HIE to me.

[powderfreak]

Got down to 43F last night...lol at 33F at SLK.

[dendrite]

Got down to 43F last night...lol at 33F at SLK.

37F at BML and 39F at HIE too. I kept a light wind all night so it didn't drop much here. I'm lovin' it.

[powderfreak]

37F at BML and 39F at HIE too. I kept a light wind all night so it didn't drop much here. I'm lovin' it.

Yeah I didn't expect it to get that chilly. There was a dew point drop around 10pm-midnight where a lot of spots were hung up around 50-55F....then dews plummeted like 10F into the upper 30s and low 40s and allowed those areas that went calm to drop. Montpelier had a breeze all night up on the hill at 1200ft and the lowest hourly was 50F though it looks like they hit 48F between obs.

Now today we all get to enjoy the benefits of that drier air with dews in the 37-47F range it seems.

I've got 70/40 right now with a breeze, which is about as perfect as it gets in my book.

[Nittany88]

Yeah I didn't expect it to get that chilly. There was a dew point drop around 10pm-midnight where a lot of spots were hung up around 50-55F....then dews plummeted like 10F into the upper 30s and low 40s and allowed those areas that went calm to drop. Montpelier had a breeze all night up on the hill at 1200ft and the lowest hourly was 50F though it looks like they hit 48F between obs.

Now today we all get to enjoy the benefits of that drier air with dews in the 37-47F range it seems.

I've got 70/40 right now with a breeze, which is about as perfect as it gets in my book.

Even BTV was down to 48F.

[powderfreak]

Even BTV was down to 48F.

You must be itching for some HHH weather though

Best part of those patterns was always leaving BTV after work at like 11pm to a humid 78F with southerly wind...then watchingthe car thermometer drop the whole way out 89 and RT 2...finally getting home in Jville to a sleep-able 65F under calm conditions.

[Nittany88]

You must be itching for some HHH weather though

Best part of those patterns was always leaving BTV after work at like 11pm to a humid 78F with southerly wind...then watchingthe car thermometer drop the whole way out 89 and RT 2...finally getting home in Jville to a sleep-able 65F under calm conditions.

Oh you know it lol.

[tamarack]

Hard to beat today - sunny 70s with 40s for dews and a nice breeze.  Still plenty of sweat playing with firewood, but easy to cool off.

[powderfreak]

And its raining again.  Luckily yesterday was completely dry!  Generally light rain though we just had a brief downpour move through town.  One minute its just a light rain that you can walk around in without getting soaked, then it pours for 5 minutes, then its light, then it pours again... we'll probably repeat this process all afternoon, haha.

 

[eyewall]

And its raining again.  Luckily yesterday was completely dry!  Generally light rain though we just had a brief downpour move through town.  One minute its just a light rain that you can walk around in without getting soaked, then it pours for 5 minutes, then its light, then it pours again... we'll probably repeat this process all afternoon, haha.

 

 

 

We are certainly getting a good soaking in the CPV.

[mreaves]

Yep, in Williston right now and it's coming down pretty good. Was hoping to get a little golf in later but that doesn't look likely right now.

[MaineJayhawk]

Yesterday was by far the better day to hit the trails. Alas, I had to settle for today. Forecast was calling for increasing clouds and a chance of mid-afternoon showers. Good enough! I made sure to pack my raingear along with food staples such as M&M's and Oreos and hit the road. I made it to Pinkham Notch around 7:15 under bluebird skies and a temp in the low 50s I believe. Saw some peeps from CT shucking oysters at the trailhead - it was that nice! I went up Lion Head Trail by way of Tuckerman Ravine Trail on a mission of redemption. Last week's fog and drizzle was but a distant memory. Awesome to see snow in mid-June. Tuckerman Ravine Trail is in fact closed after Hermit Lake due to dangerous snow conditions.

After taking in Tuckerman I strolled on the Alpine Garden over to Huntington Ravine. I hadn't been on this trail prior to last week, so it was really neat to see what the fog had concealed. Unfortunately I lost the sun here.

I went to the Mount Washington summit to have a brief snack and check the radar and current conditions (48° with winds gusting in the 30s), then headed to the Great Gulf headwall and then looped around to the south to check out Mount Monroe and Little Monroe. The pic below shows the Lakes of the Clouds hut with MWN 1.5 miles in the distance.

Turning to the south, I saw the southern Presidentials as they peeled off to the south. My Kestrel measured winds of upper teens with a temp of 54°… no complaints!

By this time the overcast was getting darker and I knew I had a few miles to go before I dipped below treeline. So I picked up the pace in an effort to beat the rain. There was a brief shower that was heavy e.ought to warrant stashing away the camera, but it was fleeting. Just before I went back in the trees I looked back up Tuckerman Ravine and noticed the summit buildings were obscured by clouds.

Right after that it began to rain, this time in earnest. It picked up in intensity the lower in elevation I was, and by the time I was back at the trailhead I was pretty well soaked. But it was a great day on the trail - above treeline for about 6 hours. I think between my two cameras I snapped over 250 pics. lol.

[CoastalWx]

Great pics man as always.

[powderfreak]

Snow pics!

[MaineJayhawk]

Snow pics!

Quite a bit there, too. It looks like just small patches on these pics, but the scale is deceiving. I also saw snow on Jefferson. My guess is this lasts into July easily.

And I shot about 275 pics. Impressive for a 9 hour hike!

[powderfreak]

And I shot about 275 pics. Impressive for a 9 hour hike!

Heh I know that deal well. I only keep and process maybe 5-10% of all the photos I take. After a good day of skiing I'll have 300-500 shots sometimes!

[powderfreak]

Picked up somewhere just shy of a half inch of rain today....just in case the ground was starting to dry out and standing water was drying out of the low lying areas of the golf course, Mother Nature felt we could use another 0.4-0.5" that fell in a nice several-hour light to moderate soaking of 0.1-0.15"/hr.