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March 24-25 Winter Storm Threat


Mitchel Volk

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The major interactions aloft happen between 42 and 54 hours -- and this is where the higher resolution models (NAM, SREF, and now RGEM) are tucking the surface low in along the coast. Given their tendency to do this during the winter (and be wrong with the idea) my confidence remains very low.

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RELAX .

This a typical SE BIAS  thats in  this model for the last 20 years .  This storm is coming off Hatteras , and gets to SNJ and turns out SE of the BM  . AND THATS OUR GOLDEN SOLUTION RIGHT ? 

 

Its what the Euro ensembles have , its what the JMA has seen for 5 days , but the GFS is just south of that , you should expect this 3 days out it will only correct West   , its the same way you shuld expect the NAM print out 15 inches of snow within one of its next 4 runs , only to back off just before the event

 

We go over this every time , every storm , every run .

 

Since early Feb they hav all  come , they turn out colder as we get closer  , and the models have misread the confluence in each of the last  3 systems , I am not laughing at the GFS , just saying how many times does one have to see this . I will ride the EURO  ensembles .

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The differences aloft between the NAM and GFS at 54 hours are alarming. Not only is the NAM much more amplified with the mid level vort max..pushing it underneath Long Island...but it's also hundreds of miles farther north with the ULL/gyre to the north of New England. This is what is opening the door for the more amplified solution. 

 

The GFS, interestingly, trended more favorable with that feature on this 12z run...but was farther southeast and less amplified with the main vort max over the TN Valley. 

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For the little that its worth...the 48 hr RGEM is spot on with the 12z NAM. It seems to be handling that lead vort max very similarly that allows the surface low to tuck in north and west initially. This is a huge difference for us. The GFS never gets the surface low this far north and west at any point. 

 

http://collaboration.cmc.ec.gc.ca/cmc/cmdn/pcpn_type/2013032312/I_nw_r1_EST_2013032312_048.png

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For the little that its worth...the 48 hr RGEM is spot on with the 12z NAM. It seems to be handling that lead vort max very similarly that allows the surface low to tuck in north and west initially. This is a huge difference for us. The GFS never gets the surface low this far north and west at any point. 

 

http://collaboration.cmc.ec.gc.ca/cmc/cmdn/pcpn_type/2013032312/I_nw_r1_EST_2013032312_048.png

After that frame my loop goes kaplooey what does it show after that?

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For the little that its worth...the 48 hr RGEM is spot on with the 12z NAM. It seems to be handling that lead vort max very similarly that allows the surface low to tuck in north and west initially. This is a huge difference for us. The GFS never gets the surface low this far north and west at any point. 

 

http://collaboration.cmc.ec.gc.ca/cmc/cmdn/pcpn_type/2013032312/I_nw_r1_EST_2013032312_048.png

 

It going to be a very important Euro run to confirm or deny those tucked in solutions.

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After that frame my loop goes kaplooey what does it show after that?

 

The RGEM only goes out to 48 hours. Assuming the GGEM doesn't have any major differences (which isn't always true) we'll get to see a lower resolution depiction of what the RGEM had showed in a few minutes. 

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It going to be a very important Euro run to conform or deny those tucked in solutions.

 

This is another bizarre forecast when it comes to modeling. We have seen some very inconsistent model trends this year. But now, 48 hours before the event, we have some real separation between the big dogs and some of the usually more reliable QPF models even at this range. 

 

What's somewhat alarming to me is that every single SREF member shows a tucked in bomb. Not one of them shows a miss. The NAM agrees, the RGEM has the surface low in a very similar position to the NAM at 48 hr (at a position that the GFS never comes close to bringing the low pressure center) and the Euro Ens showed a significant lean to the northwest.

 

This could all be fodder if the OP and Ens Euro come in and show nothing in 2 hours. But for now its very intriguing for our area...and I say hold on a minute before we declare the NAM and SREF weenie solutions. 

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The NAM and SREF (mean) have gone bonkers two days out with two other storms in the last six weeks (Nemo and Snowquester), which have been general duds down here.  You guys did ok in Nemo but not as well as the NAM had you and you all know how bad Snowquester was.

 

Keep that in mind...

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The NAM and SREF (mean) have gone bonkers two days out with two other storms in the last six weeks (Nemo and Snowquester), which have been general duds down here.  You guys did ok in Nemo but not as well as the NAM had you and you all know how bad Snowquester was.

 

Keep that in mind...

Umm some places got 24" or more in "nemo" and most of central/northern NJ had 8 to 16"

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The NAM and SREF (mean) have gone bonkers two days out with two other storms in the last six weeks (Nemo and Snowquester), which have been general duds down here.  You guys did ok in Nemo but not as well as the NAM had you and you all know how bad Snowquester was.

 

Keep that in mind...

 

30 inches here in "nemo"  though i agree with your general background sentiment of "the nam sucks"

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Umm some places got 24" or more in "nemo" and most of central/northern NJ had 8 to 16"

 

Right...north and east of NYC...I'm talking city and south/west, where it modeled 20"+...

 

It had Trenton picking up 12" and they barely got 2...

 

Some of ya'll won't realize the NAM is a terrible model since it will spit a ton of snow at a drop of a hat...carry on.

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GGEM looks terrible.. NAM is all alone my friends..

 

Sub 980 low east of Cape May yet it can barely get precip into the area wow.. And whatever falls is rain smh

Based on precip maps alone (which again we all now can be wrong so I dont know why you're always quoting it as fact) it is better than last nights 00z run. We'll have to see B and W maps in a bit but it looks like it upped precip

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