Jump to content
  • Member Statistics

    17,608
    Total Members
    7,904
    Most Online
    NH8550
    Newest Member
    NH8550
    Joined

Significant Ocean Storm March 5-7 2013 Discussion Part II


earthlight

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 1.4k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

GEFS gives NYC .75-1.00 QPF just like the op. It's drier than the last run.

 

Gfs just looks very dry for some reason, doesn't really make sense to me as the low is pretty far north and it's deepening. There's a definite convective feedback problem though if you just look at hour 42 with that small intense blob to the storm's east. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't like how the gfs is ticking east

 

We saw a couple of weeks back how the GFS jumped on the more northerly solution several times

only to back off as we approached the storm. The NAVGEM looks more like the euro with the ENE

track off Virginia.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gfs just looks very dry for some reason, doesn't really make sense to me as the low is pretty far north and it's deepening. There's a definite convective feedback problem though if you just look at hour 42 with that small intense blob to the storm's east. 

6Z Navgem & RGEM still look good 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

GFS looks fine, QPF bomb is hurting the precip shield but a solid forecaster knows it never verifies like that.

I'd like to hear what the Mets on here think as well.  I've been reading that there is a 'transition' as the storm gets going off shore --- thus creating a 'jump' or 'screw' area that misses out on the heavy stuff.  Not trying to be negative, just trying to learn and assess...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We have seen this multiple times this winter where the GFS has the right idea but gets way too aggressive between 42 and 84 hours with the north or northwest trend. The Euro typically will slowly trend northwest while the GFS will tick south and east, leaving the NAM and SREF data the far most amplified. They usually will cave to the global models QPF forecasts.

 

Yesterday I weighted 60/40 ECMWF/NCEP data respectively which left me with 0.75-1.25" QPF from northwest to southeast from about MMU to ISP. So I'm still pretty comfortable with that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd like to hear what the Mets on here think as well.  I've been reading that there is a 'transition' as the storm gets going off shore --- thus creating a 'jump' or 'screw' area that misses out on the heavy stuff.  Not trying to be negative, just trying to learn and assess...

If we get an inch of liquid it would b hard to argue we were jumped

The NAMs 2 inches yesterday werent really ever taken seriously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We have seen this multiple times this winter where the GFS has the right idea but gets way too aggressive between 42 and 84 hours with the north or northwest trend. The Euro typically will slowly trend northwest while the GFS will tick south and east, leaving the NAM and SREF data the far most amplified. They usually will cave to the global models QPF forecasts.

Yesterday I weighted 60/40 ECMWF/NCEP data respectively which left me with 0.75-1.25" QPF from northwest to southeast from about MMU to ISP. So I'm still pretty comfortable with that.

For snow lovers I guess the big question is how much of that is snow

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For snow lovers I guess the big question is how much of that is snow

I would think a good chunk of it is snow/ frozen due to the timing. It happens to be perfect this time as far as that goes. Overnight..

If it was 12 hours different, it would be a different ballgame

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If we get an inch of liquid it would b hard to argue we were jumped

The NAMs 2 inches yesterday werent really ever taken seriously.

I hear ya but when there are 2" qpfs to your south and north, you feel jumped. For big snows the qpf has got to be high given the set up.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would think a good chunk of it is snow/ frozen due to the timing. It happens to be perfect this time as far as that goes. Overnight..

If it was 12 hours different, it would be a different ballgame

 

i think this is tremendously overrated.  the benefit of nighttime is better ability to stick, especially on main roads.  however when it comes to precip-type, as in what is falling from the sky, that really comes down to overall track (wind direction) and dynamics of precipitation.  If we get the right combo of those things, it really wouldn't matter if it was 2pm or 2am.  I have seen 8 inches of snow accumulate in early April here on the island...at noon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For snow lovers I guess the big question is how much of that is snow

That's going to come down to thermal profiles and precipitation rates. I think 3-6 is a good forecast west of NYC with 1-3 in NYC and LI. But that could easily end up higher. I just can pull the trigger on it yet given the marginal profiles all the way up to 900 hPa and uncertainties regarding the placement of the best lift and dynamics.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Right now if I had to make a forecast I'd go 1-3" for NYC, Long Island, eastern NJ, 2-4" for Orange County due to lack of QPF, and 3-6" for Western NJ zones, Westchester county, and Coastal Connecticut. Conservative for the city, but I think the bust potential is much higher there due to warmth. I think 3-6" IMBY seems a safe call, even the EURO probably would hit the low end of that.

 

and I agree on the NAVGEM, I think it might have to have the automatic toss that the NOGAPS had removed, it actually has done well with this, very EURO esque.

 

-skisheep

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Right now if I had to make a forecast I'd go 1-3" for NYC, Long Island, eastern NJ, 2-4" for Orange County due to lack of QPF, and 3-6" for Western NJ zones, Westchester county, and Coastal Connecticut. Conservative for the city, but I think the bust potential is much higher there due to warmth. I think 3-6" IMBY seems a safe call, even the EURO probably would hit the low end of that.

 

and I agree on the NAVGEM, I think it might have to have the automatic toss that the NOGAPS had removed, it actually has done well with this, very EURO esque.

 

-skisheep

 

It was interesting that it took until the 18z run to get a solution similar to the 12z Euro after the

12z was a little more south with the precip. I would like to see what we come up with when

the scores are posted. I couldn't find much detail in regard to that on the Navy site.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It looks like we might be  in between two QPF maxes. One over VA/DC and the other over Boston/SNE 

06zgfsensemblep120120.gif


Would be a bummer if DC/BOS both got 12"+ while NYC struggles to get significant (4"+) snows due to lack of heavy precip to cool the boundary layer. 0z Euro actually ramped up the QPF totals for the Boston area, while staying mostly the same in our region 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It looks like we might be  in between two QPF maxes. One over VA/DC and the other over Boston/SNE 

06zgfsensemblep120120.gif

Would be a bummer if DC/BOS both got 12"+ while NYC struggles to get significant (4"+) snows due to lack of heavy precip to cool the boundary layer. 0z Euro actually ramped up the QPF totals for the Boston area, while staying mostly the same in our region 

We still get an inch plus of QPF on this map that's not exactly nothing. It would suck if we got passed over, but such is life, we can't win every storm, and this was really never a NYC special to begin with, it's always been borderline here, even on the epic GFS runs yesterday, temps were borderline. Still think a solid advisory event is possible for areas not in the immediate 5 boroughs.

-skisheep

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I actually wouldn't be surprised to see models amp up again today. The globals are still trending north and with more precip, the NCEP models backed off somewhat possibly to get closer to the globals.

It's a very favorable pattern for a big storm, one of the best you could hope to get for March and precip always tends to go up as we approach the event.

Remembering March 2001, models always tend to make a last minute adjustment north rather than south.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I really laugh when I read *this was never a nyc special*.. what? Sne was out the game a few hours ago. And they have high qpf. It was never a sne storm ..or was it?

Nah brother , this was always a MA storm first , then on Sunday nite the 0z GFS started filling in New England , and that was the first talk of us being jumped , but the models filled us in yesterday , but blasted New England as well . And now its true looks like you may see 2 inches outside DC and 2 inches in Boston ,.

But if we get an inch of liquid and hlaf of that is snow , its more than many thought we would get just 2 days ago

Link to comment
Share on other sites

09z SREF hold serve..still very wet and amped

Slightly drier on the NW side, but these are standard minor fluctuations with every coastal low. BTW the 6z Hi-Res NAM actually changes most of NJ over to rain. I'll take that as a positive though considering it's bias to be overamped 

nam-hires_namer_051_850_temp_mslp_precip

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...