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March Pattern and Discussion


Bevo

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I agree its rare but it is certainly possible, I wonder what this thread would be like if we were around in 1983 and the models showed what was to become the March 23-24 1983 snowstorm....I am sure lots of folks would make post talking about it not being cold enough, its late March, sun angle etc etc etc.

 

That said these storms are rare for a reason.....chances this plays out is pretty low.

 

http://www.glenallenweather.com/links/snowmaps/1983/SE%20snowstorm%20mar24-25,%201983.pdf

that storm was a complete surprise for where i lived at the time (athens).  the forecast was for a cold rain in the 40s. my mom came in to wake me up for school way early and said it was snowing. i made some snide comments until she pulled back the curtains and showed me the snow.  it was amazing and just poured down. the biggest snowfall i experienced growing up in ne ga

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I've been posting with him for a decade. He is no troll.

 

good to hear Queen, although I have seen evidence to the contrary and I'm no fool... many times others would post euro weeklies when they were cold

 

also, saying this is the best setup since January of '11 (back when the PDO wasn't an absolute mess) is a bit of a stretch

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Folks,

 Per the 0Z 3/16 GEFS, the AO is forecasted to dip to near -5 or lower 3/19-23 (yes, 5 days of sub ~-5) with a low ~-5.5 within 3/20-2!! This is even lower than prior runs! How unprecedented is this? Well, going back to 1950, when daily AO records start, there has not been a single day near or lower than -5 between 3/11 and 11/16, inclusive! Actually, there have been sub -5 days in March only in 1970 and that was seven days in early March (3/4-10).

 

 How crazy is this? The 0Z 3/16 and earlier Doc runs have had a 1064 mb sfc high and 566 dm 500 mb hts. centered over the N pole on 3/19!

 

 Considering how anomalous is this AO dip, the major S showing on the 0Z 3/16 Doc on 3/22 for parts of the SE is not far-fetched at all. This is a once in 60 year occurrence for late March regarding the -AO and arguably is the best setup for the SE in two years. Actually, the 64 year record low AO is more anomalous than SE sticking snow outside of the mountains since there have been a few of those in late Mar/early Apr. as opposed to just one since 1950. It has the following in " (only 1"+ plotted):

 

- 1-5 for all of TN with peak of 4-5 Chatt.

- NC: 2-4 Triad/Triangle, 5 Ash, 7 Charl, 5 ILM, 12 Ftvl

- SC: 6 COLA, 8 Flo, 3 MYR

- GA: 3 AUG; 2 AHN, 1 N ATL burbs; 4 Clayton; 2 Dahl and Rome

- far N AL/MS: 1-3

 

 This is the 4th Doc run in a row with SE snow around 3/22-4.

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March snow isn't particularly unusual to me..of course I've been around a while longer than many here.  Larry do you have any stats on how many March snows we've seen in Ga.  I've seen 4 of 5 since I've been down here in the big snow catagory, and probalby lessor snows too...but I don't remember lesser snow as well :)  Folks are acting like it's impossible, and I know it's very possible.  I've seen two 4 inch or greater late March snows in the last 5 or 6 years.  And I don't get that good a rate most Jans., lol.  T

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March snow isn't particularly unusual to me..of course I've been around a while longer than many here.  Larry do you have any stats on how many March snows we've seen in Ga.  I've seen 4 of 5 since I've been down here in the big snow catagory, and probalby lessor snows too...but I don't remember lesser snow as well :)  Folks are acting like it's impossible, and I know it's very possible.  I've seen two 4 inch or greater late March snows in the last 5 or 6 years.  And I don't get that good a rate most Jans., lol.  T

 

 

 Tony is correct as usual. Consider these stats:

 

KATL airport measurable S in MAR since 1950 (more than we've had in two winters): 1960, 65, 80, 83, 87, 93, 96, 09, 10

 

Same for late March, only: 83, 96

 

Major ZR in Mar KATL: 1960, 1971; Major ZR late MAR: 1971

 

 So, KATL has had two major winter storms in late MAR since 1950.

 

# of March's with sub -5 AO since 1950: 1 (1970); # in late March: 0

 

You be the judge about what is more anomalous, the sub -5 late March AO or getting measurable snow or major ZR at KATL or a similar location in late March.

 

Aside: Posting with IE is a royal PITA!!!!

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I think his was point was that at times, it seems like some posters will come out of hibernation just to talk about a model if it shows what they want. I do agree that we usually only see, at least lately, Mr. Bob only talking about how the Euro weeklies are a blowtorch and winter is over. Now I live the euro and usually it shi*s alllllllllllll over the GFS, but this year the weeklies, and somewhat the OP runs have been terrible. That's just my 0.02 cents.

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Where is eveybody at? This is the most credible looking 5 day threat we’ve had all winter.  Cold air is well established for this storm. The surface low is not too strong and getting sheared as it moves east by a strong new england vortex. The euro run reminds me of the January 2011 snowfall in that it has  a dampening wave getting eaten by a cold vortex but still spitting out a hefty baroclinic leaf of moisture across the area.  

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Where is eveybody at? This is the most credible looking 5 day threat we’ve had all winter. Cold air is well established for this storm. The surface low is not too strong and getting sheared as it moves east by a strong new england vortex. The euro run reminds me of the January 2011 snowfall in that it has a dampening wave getting eaten by a cold vortex but still spitting out a hefty baroclinic leaf of moisture across the area.

I'm here. Gfs and cmc are both suppressed
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This definitely makes for an odd board dynamic -- we've been burned so many times, it's hard to even consider seeing snow in late March. Yet. the Euro is nothing to be trifled with when it is consistently showing a solution. At the very least, it's going to be shockingly chilly next weekend, compared to what I just played golf in. :maphot:

Where is eveybody at? This is the most credible looking 5 day threat we’ve had all winter.  Cold air is well established for this storm. The surface low is not too strong and getting sheared as it moves east by a strong new england vortex. The euro run reminds me of the January 2011 snowfall in that it has  a dampening wave getting eaten by a cold vortex but still spitting out a hefty baroclinic leaf of moisture across the area.  

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Where is eveybody at? This is the most credible looking 5 day threat we’ve had all winter. Cold air is well established for this storm. The surface low is not too strong and getting sheared as it moves east by a strong new england vortex. The euro run reminds me of the January 2011 snowfall in that it has a dampening wave getting eaten by a cold vortex but still spitting out a hefty baroclinic leaf of moisture across the area.

What hour does it show this at? I only see a NE bomb and very cold everywhere especially the Midwest.

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This definitely makes for an odd board dynamic -- we've been burned so many times, it's hard to even consider seeing snow in late March. Yet. the Euro is nothing to be trifled with when it is consistently showing a solution. At the very least, it's going to be shockingly chilly next weekend, compared to what I just played golf in. :maphot:

It would be ironic to finally get a widespread winter storm after practically everyone had given up on winter, wouldn't it?

Shall the rule of 10 apply again? NC Piedmont accumulating snows in mid/late March in 1983, 1993, 2003, and ... 2013?

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What hour does it show this at? I only see a NE bomb and very cold everywhere especially the Midwest.

 

 

Friday morning hour 144 on the models.  Like mentioned earlier the GFS and GGEM are supressed which, imo, is the perfect place for them to be this far out.

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Friday morning hour 144 on the models. Like mentioned earlier the GFS and GGEM are supressed which, imo, is the perfect place for them to be this far out.

I see it now.

Lol look at this. Yesterday it was showing above average for everyone in the East. Huge difference today. http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/predictions/610day/610temp.new.gif

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Gawx should get a job at a NWS office if we get a widespread snowstorm out of this. His use of statistics/analogs have proven more credible than any other respected met’s long range forecasts.

Don Sutherland has also been amazing.

I didn't believe neither that we would be having a cold March.

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Alright, I can't believe I'm posting this, but it is out at only 144 hours on the ECMWF.  This is as far into the future as wunderground will show us.  North MS/AL/GA/SC looking good at this point.  Sure wish I could see the hours beyond.  These are three-hour snow totals, by the way, if that wasn't clear.

 

X0Ee0Nd.png

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