Climate Change Banter

[HailMan06]

MINNEAPOLIS (The Borowitz Report) – Scientists have discovered a powerful new strain of fact-resistant humans who are threatening the ability of Earth to sustain life, a sobering new study reports. The research, conducted by the University of Minnesota, identifies a virulent strain of humans who are virtually immune to any form of verifiable knowledge, leaving scientists at a loss as to how to combat them.---------More worryingly, Logsdon said, “As facts have multiplied, their defenses against those facts have only grown more powerful.”

http://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/scientists-earth-endangered-by-new-strain-of-fact-resistant-humans

That's perfect!

[AvantHiatus]

Ignoring facts is a one-way trip to natural selection. Their loss but in this case they bring the whole ship down with them.

[The_Global_Warmer]

I got some ocean front property in Northern Canada

[Sophisticated Skeptic]

MINNEAPOLIS (The Borowitz Report) – Scientists have discovered a powerful new strain of fact-resistant humans who are threatening the ability of Earth to sustain life, a sobering new study reports. The research, conducted by the University of Minnesota, identifies a virulent strain of humans who are virtually immune to any form of verifiable knowledge, leaving scientists at a loss as to how to combat them.---------More worryingly, Logsdon said, “As facts have multiplied, their defenses against those facts have only grown more powerful.”

 

 

http://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/scientists-earth-endangered-by-new-strain-of-fact-resistant-humans

 

 

Republicans slander things everyday to favor their agenda's.   Their saying the reason they cut amtrack funding (a day after that fatal accident)  was to implement another tax deduction for the rich. 

 

Believing in global warming, is bad for the rich.  thus, the reason why most Republicans don't believe in it.  

 

Not that I favor mixing politics in with global warming...it's just the truth. 

[AvantHiatus]

Republicans slander things everyday to favor their agenda's.   Their saying the reason they cut amtrack funding (a day after that fatal accident)  was to implement another tax deduction for the rich. 

 

Believing in global warming, is bad for the rich.  thus, the reason why most Republicans don't believe in it.  

 

Not that I favor mixing politics in with global warming...it's just the truth. 

 

Most definitely, AGW is the greatest reshuffle of the geopolitical deck we've ever seen, or at least has the potential to be. It has the potential to send us further into the abyss or give smaller communities greater freedom and economic independence.

[AvantHiatus]

[Jonger]

Most definitely, AGW is the greatest reshuffle of the geopolitical deck we've ever seen, or at least has the potential to be. It has the potential to send us further into the abyss or give smaller communities greater freedom and economic independence.

 

Explain. If you think AGW abatement is going to lead to the downfall of capitalism, you are nuts. There will always be a segment of the population who uses their wits to achieve more wealth than others.

[AvantHiatus]

Explain. If you think AGW abatement is going to lead to the downfall of capitalism, you are nuts. There will always be a segment of the population who uses their wits to achieve more wealth than others.

With end-game renewables (still very far off), it would be possible to sustain communities indefinitely and there would be no need for traditional communistic or capitalistic systems. As we've learned from first-world countries, a high standard of living is very effective at controlling birth rates.

 

Some would argue such a society would cause birth rates to spiral out of control. Perhaps not as relevant because the carbon footprint of each individual would be very low thanks to improvements in housing and transportation.

 

AGW will collapse capitalism if there is not sufficient adaptation or mitigation. This is a fact. The system is highly un-optimized and outdated in its current form and is not designed for 8 billion people.

 

The ultimate goal should be to obtain a economic system where people can focus only on self-actualization and are not obstructed by the struggle to make basic needs. This is far from a hedonistic society but more or less just open-ended.

[AvantHiatus]

Maslow's self-actualizing characteristics

• Efficient perceptions of reality. Self-actualizers are able to judge situations correctly and honestly. They are very sensitive to the fake and dishonest, and are free to see reality 'as it is'.
  
• Comfortable acceptance of self, others, nature. Self-actualizers accept their own human nature with all its flaws. The shortcomings of others and the contradictions of the human condition are accepted with humor and tolerance.
  
• Reliant on own experiences and judgement. Independent, not reliant on culture and environment to form opinions and views.
  
• Spontaneous and natural. True to oneself, rather than being how others want.
  
• Task centering. Most of Maslow's subjects had a mission to fulfill in life or some task or problem ‘beyond’ themselves (instead of outside of themselves) to pursue. Humanitarians such as Albert Schweitzer and Mother Teresa are considered to have possessed this quality.^{[citation needed]}
  
• Autonomy. Self-actualizers are free from reliance on external authorities or other people. They tend to be resourceful and independent.
  
• Continued freshness of appreciation. The self-actualizer seems to constantly renew appreciation of life's basic goods. A sunset or a flower will be experienced as intensely time after time as it was at first. There is an "innocence of vision", like that of an artist or child.
  
• Profound interpersonal relationships. The interpersonal relationships of self-actualizers are marked by deep loving bonds.
  
• Comfort with solitude. Despite their satisfying relationships with others, self-actualizing persons value solitude and are comfortable being alone.^[19]
  
• Non-hostile sense of humor. This refers to the ability to laugh at oneself.
  
• Peak experiences. All of Maslow's subjects reported the frequent occurrence of peak experiences (temporary moments of self-actualization). These occasions were marked by feelings of ecstasy, harmony, and deep meaning. Self-actualizers reported feeling at one with the universe, stronger and calmer than ever before, filled with light, beautiful and good, and so forth.
  
• Socially compassionate. Possessing humanity.
  
• Few friends. Few close intimate friends rather than many surface relationships.^[20]
  

[WinterWxLuvr]

Our current economic systems (global) are doomed.  The reason won't be climate change, however.  It will be technology.  Soon, as in less than 100 years, there will be no jobs for humans.  I just heard an advertisement the other day that Schwab (sp?) now offers "humanless" financial advisors.

 

With no jobs, there will be no way to acquire wealth.  Through death, properties will be redistributed, and over the course of a few more years (fewer than you think), there will only be one economic status....equal.  Obviously, this will produce a change in human society like no other.

 

As for global warming, I think in the long run, it benefits humans and most animals.  Land that is currently uninhabitable due to cold will become habitable and farmable.  Most land on the planet is currently located in "cold" zones.  Sure, you will lose some real estate, but you'll gain in back in other areas.  Some species will go extinct, but that's the way of the world.  Remember, 99.9%.....

 

Do what we can to live in harmony with the environment, sleep well at night.  Worrying about it.......not gonna happen for me.

[FloridaJohn]

Our current economic systems (global) are doomed.  The reason won't be climate change, however.  It will be technology.  Soon, as in less than 100 years, there will be no jobs for humans.  I just heard an advertisement the other day that Schwab (sp?) now offers "humanless" financial advisors.

 

With no jobs, there will be no way to acquire wealth.  Through death, properties will be redistributed, and over the course of a few more years (fewer than you think), there will only be one economic status....equal.  Obviously, this will produce a change in human society like no other.

 

As for global warming, I think in the long run, it benefits humans and most animals.  Land that is currently uninhabitable due to cold will become habitable and farmable.  Most land on the planet is currently located in "cold" zones.  Sure, you will lose some real estate, but you'll gain in back in other areas.  Some species will go extinct, but that's the way of the world.  Remember, 99.9%.....

 

Do what we can to live in harmony with the environment, sleep well at night.  Worrying about it.......not gonna happen for me.

 

I disagree. Who will be programming those "humanless" financial advisors? Who will build the robots? Who will program the robots? Who will repair and upgrade the robots? Who will design next year's version of the robot/software/etc?

 

Even discounting all of that, the economy will invent and require new jobs that we haven't even thought of. 100 years ago, who ever thought there would be such a job as a "web programmer?" Or a "software programmer?" Of course, the demand for horse-drawn carriages has subsided dramatically since then, too. So there will always be jobs, they will just be different. Just like there always has been. People will still be able to aquire wealth and the incentive to do such that implies.

 

Global warming, in the long run, is a net negative for humans and most animals. Our advanced society has existed only in the climate we are experiencing today. Our cities, transportation, and farming practices are finely honed to work in this climate. Major disruptions will only make these less efficient and more expensive.

 

Gaining farm land in more northern lattitudes will not be able to offset the farm land lost further south. Not only is that northern land less hospitable to farming (poorer soil, etc.), but the amount of light available is different than what we have now. Growing season will have to start later due to available sunlight, and it will be shorter in length. We are unsure at this point if these new, further north farmlands will have enough rain during the growing season in a new, warmer climate. Or maybe too much rain.

 

This doesn't account for all the coastal cities that will be lost to sea level rise. How much cost is there to build giant seawalls to hold back the ocean, or to relocate entire populations? These are not trivial tasks.

 

All current research shows that it is far cheaper to stop emitting CO2 now than it will be to live with the effects in the future. That will have a larger effect on the ecomony than the concern of losing jobs to robots.

[Jonger]

I disagree. Who will be programming those "humanless" financial advisors? Who will build the robots? Who will program the robots? Who will repair and upgrade the robots? Who will design next year's version of the robot/software/etc?

 

Even discounting all of that, the economy will invent and require new jobs that we haven't even thought of. 100 years ago, who ever thought there would be such a job as a "web programmer?" Or a "software programmer?" Of course, the demand for horse-drawn carriages has subsided dramatically since then, too. So there will always be jobs, they will just be different. Just like there always has been. People will still be able to aquire wealth and the incentive to do such that implies.

 

Global warming, in the long run, is a net negative for humans and most animals. Our advanced society has existed only in the climate we are experiencing today. Our cities, transportation, and farming practices are finely honed to work in this climate. Major disruptions will only make these less efficient and more expensive.

 

Gaining farm land in more northern lattitudes will not be able to offset the farm land lost further south. Not only is that northern land less hospitable to farming (poorer soil, etc.), but the amount of light available is different than what we have now. Growing season will have to start later due to available sunlight, and it will be shorter in length. We are unsure at this point if these new, further north farmlands will have enough rain during the growing season in a new, warmer climate. Or maybe too much rain.

 

This doesn't account for all the coastal cities that will be lost to sea level rise. How much cost is there to build giant seawalls to hold back the ocean, or to relocate entire populations? These are not trivial tasks.

 

All current research shows that it is far cheaper to stop emitting CO2 now than it will be to live with the effects in the future. That will have a larger effect on the ecomony than the concern of losing jobs to robots.

 

I think the answer is sequestration and synthetic fuels.

[Sophisticated Skeptic]

Our current economic systems (global) are doomed.  The reason won't be climate change, however.  It will be technology.  Soon, as in less than 100 years, there will be no jobs for humans.

 

I think it'll be at-least part of it. 

 

technology (taking jobs) / climate change / pollution / overcrowding (population) / diseases / worldwide crisis's of different sorts will have a bigger hand.     

 

Bad economies across the globe (currently) are another reason why governments in other countries don't have enough money to protect their own people....and how  'rogue' groups pop-up and control parts of a country with their own weapons and money.  When the public is desperate for food / water / money...they go where it's at. 

 

as for people panicking over technology taking all our jobs... there will always be jobs that require human involvement / interaction.    Currently software creation / mobile app development are good areas to get into. 

[A-L-E-K]

bunch of deep thoughts, guys

[AvantHiatus]

People forget about the ocean. We need that stuff bro. At the rate of acidification, the global ocean could become completely anoxic in less than 300 years on business as usual. I highly recommend everyone read 'Under a Green Sky' by Peter Ward.

 

 

paleontologist peter ward’s book on mass extinctions and climate change provides a deep-time perspective that is both sobering and necessary. Under a Green Sky puts the present within a geological context while also making the climate crisis feel even more personal and pressing. Before getting that perspective in full, however, readers encounter several fetching narratives of paleontological and other scientific fieldwork across the globe. Captivating as they are, the stories are mostly used to set up later passages that aggressively dismantle an argument Ward clearly loathes: that most past mass extinctions — especially the Permian, some 250 million years ago — were caused by huge meteorite impacts. Ward takes scientists and the media to task for, in his mind, recklessly embracing impacts as the culprit du jour for nearly all prior mass extinctions, when an impact is clearly responsible for just one such die-off: the famous dinosaur-killer 65 million years ago.

 

Ward presents a powerful alternative model for explaining these extinctions. In short, an increase in carbon dioxide — from volcanism (in the past) or from humans (in the present) — warms the oceans enough to change circulation patterns. When this happens, sulfur-eating microbes sometimes thrive. These bacteria produce hydrogen sulfide, which, in sufficient quantities and under certain conditions, outgasses into the air, shreds the ozone layer, and poisons other living things. The warming also causes methane ice under the seas to melt and, well, burp, adding to the nasty mix. The end comes not in a bang but a stinky whimper.

 

Some may wish that Ward focused even more on scientists now plumbing the depths of these beguiling connections between current conditions and those of the past. In any case, we learn that tomorrow may mean palm trees in Seattle, nonstop hurricanes near the equator, and a hazy sky where amber dust blends with the wild blue yonder “to create a washed green tinge, a vomitous color.” Eventually, ocean patterns may turn the Earth into a desert world, or the conveyor belt that pushes warm water into the cold North Atlantic may simply shut off, producing the long-overdue return of an ice age.

 

Despite a sometimes hurried prose style, Ward’s book is replete with interesting anecdotes and clear scientific explanations. Readers discover why the climate actually is like a switch. Teaching us how to keep our fingers off the switch isn’t part of this book’s design, but Under a Green Sky provides a kind of core sample of ages past to help us make sense of what the present could hold for the future.

[FloridaJohn]

Bad economies across the globe (currently) are another reason why governments in other countries don't have enough money to protect their own people....and how  'rogue' groups pop-up and control parts of a country with their own weapons and money.  When the public is desperate for food / water / money...they go where it's at.

That's a good point. When resources get scarce in Country A, but are still plentiful in nearby Country B, Country A will invade Country B to get access to those resources.

 

The news will report it as "unrest in central Albania," and won't link the cause directly as climate change, but climate change will be an underlying factor in situations like this.

[The_Global_Warmer]

Socialist Utopia is the future

[AvantHiatus]

Socialist Utopia is the future

[Sophisticated Skeptic]

That's a good point. When resources get scarce in Country A, but are still plentiful in nearby Country B, Country A will invade Country B to get access to those resources.

 

The news will report it as "unrest in central Albania," and won't link the cause directly as climate change, but climate change will be an underlying factor in situations like this.

 

 

notice how I didn't use the "t" word.    Our media likes to focus on these incidents as 1 or 2 bad groups out there.   When a lot of times it's more about the needs of the community.   There's probably a lot of communities in Iraq that assist and make things easier for ISIS to take over their towns...knowing they'll get more aid from them...then their own government.   

 

Just look at how easy it was for ISIS to take all our military equipment over..that was stationed there...it basically had no protection (and no money to protect) from the Iraqi government.   

 

As long as global economies continue to suffer, more of these types of rogue groups will probably continue to grow and flourish. (and many of them, not even "T" groups....even though our Gov might still decide to label them as such)

 

One of the rare instances where loose gun laws are good for the country....groups would think twice before doing silly crap like that here in the u.s.  Where many homeowners have guns...where as almost none do in strict gun law countries...and are ez pickins for these 'rogue' groups.  

 

back to topic...climate -

 

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CALIFORNIA_STORM?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-15-16-12-17

 

"Rare spring storm sweeps into southern California, Arizona" ]

 

global warming already here?   more convincing if they get rains in the summer.   The Cali mountains could get some nice amounts the next week or so.

[AvantHiatus]

Call the fire dept

[superjames1992]

The sea ice thread is out of control. It is amazing the passion people have about ice thousands of miles away from their backyards... ha.

[FPizz]

The sea ice thread is out of control. It is amazing the passion people have about ice thousands of miles away from their backyards... ha.

They have the passion because we are all doomed to die from massive floods.  Why else would they walk around with duck floatie tubes around their waists just in case it happens today?

[AvantHiatus]

They have the passion because we are all doomed to die from massive floods.  Why else would they walk around with duck floatie tubes around their waists just in case it happens today?

Who cares if it's tommorow or 150 years? Without proper mitigation it will happen.

[AvantHiatus]

maybe , but I certainly see him more post-active during patterns favoring ice buildup.

^This

[AvantHiatus]

One-way trip to permaburn hell.

 

[A-L-E-K]

you really need a break

[AvantHiatus]

you really need a break

Denier poster.

[LakeEffectKing]

Denier poster.

That's like telling Fat Albert he purges!!

[AvantHiatus]

That's like telling Fat Albert he purges!!

[HailMan06]

Denier poster.

ROFLMAO at calling A-L-E-C a denier.

Edit: A-L-E-K