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Late December Discussion and Christmas um Event


Cold Rain

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It's not going to snow in NGA if it's 6C at the SFC. Looks good for the I-40 corridor in NC and TN though. Nashville would really do well as its modeled.

Yeah, its close though. Temps always the issue here, story of my life

ECMWF Deterministic FORECAST FOR: GVL LAT= 34.27 LON= -83.83 ELE= 1276

00Z DEC25

2 M 850 SFC SFC 700 6 HR 500 1000

TMP TMP PRS RHU RHU QPF HGT 500

© © (MB) (PCT) (PCT) (IN) (DM) THK

TUE 00Z 25-DEC 9.3 6.8 1013 99 8 0.00 563 553

TUE 06Z 25-DEC 8.5 6.0 1015 99 3 0.00 565 553

TUE 12Z 25-DEC 6.2 5.3 1016 98 7 0.00 567 553

TUE 18Z 25-DEC 10.8 4.8 1017 87 10 0.00 565 551

WED 00Z 26-DEC 9.2 5.3 1014 99 94 0.27 564 553

WED 06Z 26-DEC 10.7 8.4 1007 99 94 0.59 562 556

WED 12Z 26-DEC 13.5 8.2 999 97 30 0.79 553 554

WED 18Z 26-DEC 4.7 -4.3 1004 72 40 0.05 546 543

THU 00Z 27-DEC 2.4 -5.8 1008 72 40 0.02 549 543

THU 06Z 27-DEC 0.6 2.1 1012 68 1 0.00 559 550

THU 12Z 27-DEC -0.6 7.1 1015 70 4 0.00 563 551

THU 18Z 27-DEC 8.0 6.3 1016 46 5 0.00 566 553

FRI 00Z 28-DEC 3.4 5.7 1017 65 18 0.00 568 554

FRI 06Z 28-DEC 0.4 6.3 1018 75 18 0.00 568 553

FRI 12Z 28-DEC -0.2 5.2 1019 72 91 0.00 567 552

FRI 18Z 28-DEC 10.2 4.9 1019 42 31 0.00 568 552

SAT 00Z 29-DEC 5.8 4.8 1019 73 13 0.00 567 552

SAT 06Z 29-DEC 4.5 5.8 1017 79 45 0.00 565 551

SAT 12Z 29-DEC 4.3 0.4 1016 96 99 0.20 562 549

SAT 18Z 29-DEC 4.1 0.7 1010 96 88 0.26 555 547

SUN 00Z 30-DEC 2.8 -0.7 1013 92 69 0.13 547 536

SUN 06Z 30-DEC 0.5 -3.6 1021 73 7 0.00 555 538

SUN 12Z 30-DEC -2.1 0.3 1026 71 5 0.00 566 546

SUN 18Z 30-DEC 6.3 3.8 1027 43 13 0.00 571 549

MON 00Z 31-DEC 1.2 5.8 1028 66 5 0.00 574 552

MON 06Z 31-DEC -2.6 7.3 1027 76 6 0.00 575 553

MON 12Z 31-DEC -1.1 7.4 1026 66 10 0.00 575 553

MON 18Z 31-DEC 9.9 6.7 1025 36 7 0.00 575 555

TUE 00Z 01-JAN 4.8 6.5 1023 71 3 0.00 574 555

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Where did you get this data from? I like it. Thumbs up

Yeah, its close though. Temps always the issue here, story of my life

ECMWF Deterministic FORECAST FOR: GVL LAT= 34.27 LON= -83.83 ELE= 1276

00Z DEC25

2 M 850 SFC SFC 700 6 HR 500 1000

TMP TMP PRS RHU RHU QPF HGT 500

© © (MB) (PCT) (PCT) (IN) (DM) THK

TUE 00Z 25-DEC 9.3 6.8 1013 99 8 0.00 563 553

TUE 06Z 25-DEC 8.5 6.0 1015 99 3 0.00 565 553

TUE 12Z 25-DEC 6.2 5.3 1016 98 7 0.00 567 553

TUE 18Z 25-DEC 10.8 4.8 1017 87 10 0.00 565 551

WED 00Z 26-DEC 9.2 5.3 1014 99 94 0.27 564 553

WED 06Z 26-DEC 10.7 8.4 1007 99 94 0.59 562 556

WED 12Z 26-DEC 13.5 8.2 999 97 30 0.79 553 554

WED 18Z 26-DEC 4.7 -4.3 1004 72 40 0.05 546 543

THU 00Z 27-DEC 2.4 -5.8 1008 72 40 0.02 549 543

THU 06Z 27-DEC 0.6 2.1 1012 68 1 0.00 559 550

THU 12Z 27-DEC -0.6 7.1 1015 70 4 0.00 563 551

THU 18Z 27-DEC 8.0 6.3 1016 46 5 0.00 566 553

FRI 00Z 28-DEC 3.4 5.7 1017 65 18 0.00 568 554

FRI 06Z 28-DEC 0.4 6.3 1018 75 18 0.00 568 553

FRI 12Z 28-DEC -0.2 5.2 1019 72 91 0.00 567 552

FRI 18Z 28-DEC 10.2 4.9 1019 42 31 0.00 568 552

SAT 00Z 29-DEC 5.8 4.8 1019 73 13 0.00 567 552

SAT 06Z 29-DEC 4.5 5.8 1017 79 45 0.00 565 551

SAT 12Z 29-DEC 4.3 0.4 1016 96 99 0.20 562 549

SAT 18Z 29-DEC 4.1 0.7 1010 96 88 0.26 555 547

SUN 00Z 30-DEC 2.8 -0.7 1013 92 69 0.13 547 536

SUN 06Z 30-DEC 0.5 -3.6 1021 73 7 0.00 555 538

SUN 12Z 30-DEC -2.1 0.3 1026 71 5 0.00 566 546

SUN 18Z 30-DEC 6.3 3.8 1027 43 13 0.00 571 549

MON 00Z 31-DEC 1.2 5.8 1028 66 5 0.00 574 552

MON 06Z 31-DEC -2.6 7.3 1027 76 6 0.00 575 553

MON 12Z 31-DEC -1.1 7.4 1026 66 10 0.00 575 553

MON 18Z 31-DEC 9.9 6.7 1025 36 7 0.00 575 555

TUE 00Z 01-JAN 4.8 6.5 1023 71 3 0.00 574 555

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That could be the reason? Idk just passing info along!!!

He might have missed the cold but on the last two systems that many were excited about he said from the get go where they were going and he was right. He has said all month gfs is wrong and he has been right. I hope he is wrong but just know what he has said about this system now and last week. So keep bashing about the cold not being here. If it never gets here like all models keep saying every other run then not only will his winter forecast go down many others will also.

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EC ensemble is a significant snow hit on the day 5 storm for NC. I'm going to write a column on the next 3 events sometime today (26th/30th/2-4th) since i finally have time.

Yep roughly CLT to RDU and points west and north from that line. Then the next storms drop snow even further south. Guys I think it's game on for 12/30!

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EC ensemble is a significant snow hit on the day 5 storm for NC. I'm going to write a column on the next 3 events sometime today (26th/30th/2-4th) since i finally have time.

With Euro/UKIE/CMC on relatively same page it sure is interesting, but GFS has been fairly good inside 5 days, so there is some worry here that GFS is sniffing something out.

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Merry Christmas all. After looking at all the overnight model runs I can take ONE big thing out of it. There is a very good signal for a gulf low being shown under 5 days. Will it have enough cold to work with? Let's not worry about that at this point. I want to see how the modeling changes after we get this big storm out of our way.

Let's be happy for our winter loving friends to the west as parts of Arkansas and Tennessee, and Mississippi will see snow out of this (maybe even blizzard conditions)........................

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850's look good for here, but surface not as good!

SAT 06Z 29-DEC -0.7 2.9 1018 81 28 0.00 562 547

SAT 12Z 29-DEC 1.0 2.0 1017 77 46 0.00 559 545

SAT 18Z 29-DEC 2.3 -2.8 1013 93 99 0.08 554 544

SUN 00Z 30-DEC 1.2 -3.1 1010 97 98 0.22 545 537

SUN 06Z 30-DEC 0.4 -5.4 1014 74 41 0.06 542 532

SUN 12Z 30-DEC -3.2 -5.3 1021 62 17 0.00 550 533

SUN 18Z 30-DEC 2.1 -3.0 1023 49 9 0.00 561 542

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Why is it when the GFS shows a snowstorm and the Euro doesn't, everyone is sure that the GFS will fold to the Euro and when the opposite happens, the opposite happens?

I always wonder the same thing...isn't Euro supposed to be king? Which is it? With this recent storm folks were talking about how it was case closed that Euro was showing the low going to the northwest. Let's hold out hope until say Thursday. Still plenty of time to trend in the direction we want and TBH GFS was close but no cigar. Again this storm is probably a bonus if it happens so if it doesn't no big deal.

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Why is it when the GFS shows a snowstorm and the Euro doesn't, everyone is sure that the GFS will fold to the Euro and when the opposite happens, the opposite happens?

I think in general, some folks like to get a rise out of other folks.

I did notice on the last 2 runs of the GFS Ensemble (00z & 06z), that the placement of the wave on the operational run on the spaghetti plots around hour 120 was on the southern side of the envelope (when comparing with the other GFS ensemble members)...giving some credence to a more northerly track, at least per the GFS/GEFS.

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I always wonder the same thing...isn't Euro supposed to be king? Which is it? With this recent storm folks were talking about how it was case closed that Euro was showing the low going to the northwest. Let's hold out hope until say Thursday. Still plenty of time to trend in the direction we want and TBH GFS was close but no cigar. Again this storm is probably a bonus if it happens so if it doesn't no big deal.

I think we've become accustomed to, when one solution shows snow and one doesn't, believing the one that doesn't, just on principle. Probably not the least accurate belief, since we usually don't get snow, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's grounded in actual science either, since each situation is unique.

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This was earlier from Allan...

December 29th-30th Storm

This storm remains an interesting one. The latest 00z ECMWF has shifted a little further south with a surface low moving across the Gulf Coast and then strengthening off the southeast coast Saturday/Sunday. The model literally lays down 4-8 inches of snow across, WV, eastern KY, NE TN, NW NC and wetern Va, with 1-4 inches across central/eastern TN/ mot of KY, central/eastern Va, and northern NC. This is a much colder/wintry solution than the 6z GFS which shifted more to the north. This scenario has good support it appears from the ECMWF Ensemble members as the mean is very close to the operational. The 6z GFS Ensemble mean is pretty close to the operational run with the further north/warmer scenario. The 00z Canadians shows a much weaker system, but a similar track/thermal profile as the ECWMF. The 00z UKMET also looks similar to the ECMWF.

With most of the global model guidance leaning towards the further south/colder scenario, for now I will trust the ECMWF/ECMWF ENS/UKMET consensus over the GFS. With this track, the potential exists for wintry weather in particularly for TN/KY/WV/VA/NC this coming Saturday into Sunday. It looks primarily to be a rain vs snow scenario if this track verifies. I will keep you updated on this potential system!

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I think in general, some folks like to get a rise out of other folks.

I did notice on the last 2 runs of the GFS Ensemble (00z & 06z), that the placement of the wave on the operational run on the spaghetti plots around hour 120 was on the southern side of the envelope (when comparing with the other GFS ensemble members)...giving some credence to a more northerly track, at least per the GFS/GEFS.

:-)))

Well I tend to side with the model that doesn't show a winter event for the SE as the odds are usually in that models favor.

The 12z GFS was a little better this run than the 0z last night, haven't looked at the 6z yet. Plus the UK/CMC and all important NoGaps were on the Euro's side. But the GFS is very worrisome as inside 4 days it's pretty good.

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This was earlier from Allan...

December 29th-30th Storm

This storm remains an interesting one. The latest 00z ECMWF has shifted a little further south with a surface low moving across the Gulf Coast and then strengthening off the southeast coast Saturday/Sunday. The model literally lays down 4-8 inches of snow across, WV, eastern KY, NE TN, NW NC and wetern Va, with 1-4 inches across central/eastern TN/ mot of KY, central/eastern Va, and northern NC. This is a much colder/wintry solution than the 6z GFS which shifted more to the north. This scenario has good support it appears from the ECMWF Ensemble members as the mean is very close to the operational. The 6z GFS Ensemble mean is pretty close to the operational run with the further north/warmer scenario. The 00z Canadians shows a much weaker system, but a similar track/thermal profile as the ECWMF. The 00z UKMET also looks similar to the ECMWF.

With most of the global model guidance leaning towards the further south/colder scenario, for now I will trust the ECMWF/ECMWF ENS/UKMET consensus over the GFS. With this track, the potential exists for wintry weather in particularly for TN/KY/WV/VA/NC this coming Saturday into Sunday. It looks primarily to be a rain vs snow scenario if this track verifies. I will keep you updated on this potential system!

I'm glad you left out the very end of his comments. That part sucked and I didn't want to see it again. :)

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:-)))

Well I tend to side with the model that doesn't show a winter event for the SE as the odds are usually in that models favor.

The 12z GFS was a little better this run than the 0z last night, haven't looked at the 6z yet. Plus the UK/CMC and all important NoGaps were on the Euro's side. But the GFS is very worrisome as inside 4 days it's pretty good.

Throw it out! :lmao:

For real though, the 4-5 day window is often when the models lose systems and bring them back around the 3 day mark. That may not apply this time, since I don't recall the system being there and being lost. Either way, it's there now, but I wonder if the same principle applies here...the system responsible for the 30th storm isn't being modeled very well yet over a data void area or something. Plus, I think the eventual evolution of the current storm will play a major role. We'll see....

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